18:00:31 <pboy> #startmeeting fedora-server
18:00:31 <zodbot> Meeting started Wed Jan 17 18:00:31 2024 UTC.
18:00:31 <zodbot> This meeting is logged and archived in a public location.
18:00:31 <zodbot> The chair is pboy. Information about MeetBot at https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Zodbot#Meeting_Functions.
18:00:31 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
18:00:31 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'fedora-server'
18:00:48 <pboy> #topic Welcome / roll call
18:01:03 <pboy> Welcome to our Server WG IRC meeting today!
18:01:22 <pboy> „Same procedure as every year“ We'll give a few minutes for folks to show up
18:01:24 <sgallagh> .hi
18:01:25 <zodbot> sgallagh: sgallagh 'Stephen Gallagher' <sgallagh@redhat.com>
18:01:45 <pboy> I’ll post the agenda in about 2 minutes.
18:02:07 <pboy> Hi Stephen!
18:02:15 <sgallagh> I’m only kind of here. I’m suffering from a migraine and can only look at the screen for a few minutes at a time. Please mention me directly if you need my input.
18:02:27 <cooltshirtguy> .hello2
18:02:28 <zodbot> cooltshirtguy: cooltshirtguy 'Jason Beard' <jas_beard@hotmail.com>
18:02:28 <pboy> OK git it
18:02:43 <pboy> Hi Jason!
18:02:52 <cooltshirtguy> Hello!
18:04:37 <pboy> OK, we meet the quorum, so let's start
18:04:47 <pboy> #topic Agenda
18:04:55 <jwhimpel> .hello2
18:04:56 <zodbot> jwhimpel: jwhimpel 'John Himpel' <john@jlhimpel.net>
18:05:05 <pboy> #info  Follow up actions & announcements
18:05:05 <pboy> #info  Add module cockpit-navigator to default Installation
18:05:05 <pboy> #info  LLMNR should be disabled in systemd-resolved in f39 (and later)
18:05:05 <pboy> #info  LVM configuration
18:05:05 <pboy> #info  Test planning for F40
18:05:14 <pboy> #info  Work program and goals for F40
18:05:14 <pboy> #info  Open floor
18:05:35 <pboy> I suppose, we have enough topics and don't need some more  :-)
18:05:42 <pboy> Hi John!
18:05:58 <cooltshirtguy> i think that's plenty
18:06:18 <pboy> Yeah, let's go on.
18:06:28 <pboy> #topic 1. Follow up actions and announcements
18:06:36 <pboy> A still running gag is:
18:06:48 <pboy> #action pboy will write a info about changing the timeout value and nirik will review – still work in progress
18:07:04 <pboy> There will be a time we get this done. hope dies last
18:07:13 <pboy> nd we have a new one, I guess ongoing, too?
18:07:24 <pboy> CTION: Mowest will take care of discussed modifications of the Server download page.
18:07:47 <pboy> We are missing mowest at the moment
18:08:05 <pboy> #action Mowest will take care of discussed modifications of the Server download page. - still work in progress
18:08:16 <pboy> And there is a Proposal:
18:08:25 <pboy> proposed  #agreed We schedule an additional meeting at Wednesday, January 31 18:00 UTC
18:08:36 <pboy> January has 5 Wednesdays. We should use the additional Wednesday in 14 days for an additional meeting to discuss and make upcoming decisions soon.
18:08:52 <pboy> Any thoughts about it?
18:09:08 <jwhimpel> I agree that we ought to meet.
18:09:20 <cooltshirtguy> additional meeting is fine
18:09:25 <pboy> thanks, eseyman agreed as well.
18:09:29 <pboy> OK, so
18:09:39 <pboy> #agreed We schedule an additional meeting at Wednesday, January 31 18:00 UTC
18:09:50 <pboy> For all to know:
18:09:59 <pboy> Next big OSS meeting: FOSDEM, 3 & 4 February 2014 Brussels, Belgium, Europe
18:10:09 <pboy> Fedora will be present with a stand, see
18:10:09 <pboy> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FOSDEM_2024
18:10:27 <pboy> I'll participate
18:10:38 <pboy> aybe one or the other can still take part at short notice. A dinner is planned for Saturday evening.  :-)
18:10:53 <pboy> #topic 2. Add module cockpit-navigator to default Installation
18:11:03 <pboy> #link https://pagure.io/fedora-server/issue/111
18:11:17 <pboy> We have to decide whether we want to include the module in its current state and who will take care of it.
18:11:37 <pboy> I checked it shortly, I think it works fine.
18:11:45 <pboy> Did anybody check the module?
18:12:23 <sgallagh> I maintain it. I do want to point out that upstream hasn’t made a new release in over a year. I’m not sure whether they consider it stable or abandoned.
18:12:41 <cooltshirtguy> i completely missed it.
18:13:09 <pboy> sgallagh I think it is a new module, developed by an Google intern last sommer, isn't it?
18:14:12 <sgallagh> Maybe I’m confused. Are we not talking about the one from 45Drives?
18:14:54 <pboy> The name is cockpit-navigator and it is listed on the project page amoung the core modules, not the third party
18:15:18 <sgallagh> Ah, then I probably need to retire the 45Drives one and make sure the official one replaces it.
18:15:43 <pboy> Ok, to be sure I'll check with Martin Pit.
18:16:15 <pboy> Question, de we need a Change prososal to make it a part of our installtion media?
18:16:48 <sgallagh> https://github.com/cockpit-project/cockpit-navigator appears to be an updated version of the 45Drives one, but merged into the main Cockpit project.
18:17:14 <sgallagh> Need? No. It would be good to do it for publicity reasons though.
18:18:15 <pboy> Oh,thanks. First I'll check with Martin and come back next meeting with the topic. And if it is good for public, w'll make a proposal, I think.
18:18:35 <pboy> Any objections against this procedure?
18:18:49 <cooltshirtguy> nope
18:19:00 <pboy> OK, next topic.
18:19:04 <jwhimpel> sgallagh: The https:cockpit-project.org/applications page shows the 45Drives module is the Navigation feature for cockpit.
18:19:37 <sgallagh> It looks like Cockpit took over the maintenance
18:20:40 <pboy> Yes, and I had a wrong look at that page, sorry about it.
18:21:09 <pboy> I think I was so eager about navigator, I overlooked the most import item.
18:21:33 <pboy> Martin Pit advised against the module last sommer.
18:21:56 <pboy> Let us ask him again.
18:22:46 <pboy> Do we agree about asking Martin for advise and decide next meeting?
18:23:00 <jwhimpel> +1
18:23:20 <eseyman> +1
18:23:33 <eseyman> hi, folks. Sorry I'm laste
18:23:34 <cooltshirtguy> +1
18:23:39 <pboy> #agreed  pboy will ask Martin Pitt for advise about cockpit-navigator
18:23:40 <eseyman> s/laste/late/
18:23:47 <eseyman> .hello2 eseyman
18:23:48 <zodbot> eseyman: eseyman 'Emmanuel Seyman' <emmanuel@seyman.fr>
18:23:53 <pboy> eseyman welcome, better late then not
18:24:10 <pboy> well, next topic
18:24:22 <pboy> #topic 3. LLMNR should be disabled in systemd-resolved in f39 (and later)
18:24:33 <pboy> #link https://pagure.io/fedora-server/issue/114
18:24:35 <eseyman> sorry, the weather made biking a no-go and the bus went kind of nuts
18:24:51 <pboy> I'm completely  lost with this topic.
18:25:02 <pboy> But there is some severe discussion.
18:25:58 <pboy> eseyman I enjoy working from home
18:27:35 <eseyman> I like going to the office 40% of the time but it really needs to be by bike
18:29:00 <pboy> Any idea how to proceed with this topic?  We already had a discussion some time ago, but I don't remeber the details.
18:30:15 <pboy> And I think, there was a change proposal or a FESCo discussion. But I can't find it.
18:30:54 <eseyman> it does look sensible to disable LLMNR
18:31:14 <sgallagh> There’s a discussion on the devel list about a dnsmasq default change that’s conflicting with resolved. It may or may not be related.
18:32:41 <pboy> Well, maybe we postpone until the devel discussion comes to an end, and maybe FESCo says something abou it?
18:33:07 <pboy> And we should coordinate with CoreOS and IoT, I suppose.
18:33:44 <sgallagh> Probably best to start a new discussion on the devel list
18:34:15 <sgallagh> With the intent of getting FESCo to make a decision clearly stated.
18:34:29 <pboy> OK, that's a good idea.
18:34:45 <eseyman> yes, sounds fair
18:34:54 <cooltshirtguy> sound good
18:35:18 <cooltshirtguy> *sounds good
18:35:48 <pboy> proposal  #agreed  pboy will start a new discussion on the devel list and maybi involve FESCo to make a Fedora wide decision
18:36:14 <pboy> and a final decision
18:36:59 <pboy> I see no objections
18:37:38 <pboy> #agreed  pboy will start a new discussion on the devel list and maybe involve FESCo to make a Fedora wide final decision
18:37:53 <pboy> #topic 4. LVM configuration
18:38:04 <pboy> was  Aarch64 SBC Installation bug on Fedora Server
18:38:15 <pboy> #link  https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=2258764
18:38:23 <pboy> #link  https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=2246871
18:38:30 <pboy> ome info:
18:38:41 <pboy> It's clear now, it is not a bug, but a new 'feature' in LVM configuration.
18:38:51 <pboy> LVM is since F38 configured to just 'see' devices listed in /etc/lvm/devices/system.devices
18:39:02 <pboy> The arm-image-installer issues are a follow up of this re-configuration.
18:39:11 <pboy> You connect a new devise, usually an SD card or SD card adapter, and copy the installation image onto it.
18:39:20 <pboy> So the new SD card device has a partition with a new VG, which is now not visible for LVM by default configuration
18:39:28 <pboy> I suppose, if you use vgscan for new VGs there is a big chance it is on a new device.
18:39:38 <pboy> On the other hand I think, LVM maintainer had a good reason to change the default configuration. But I don't know what it could be.
18:39:48 <pboy> The proposal is, to switch back to the behavior of F37.
18:39:59 <pboy> Alternatively, arm-image-installer would have to reconfigure LVM temporarily. But I don't know if it's that easy.
18:40:06 <cooltshirtguy> So we dont know why the change was made?
18:40:22 <pboy> End of info
18:40:53 <pboy> At least I dopn't know. And there was no info in the bug reporet discussion.
18:40:59 <eseyman> yes, I wonder what the purpose of /etc/lvm/devices/system.devices is
18:42:09 <pboy> Well, we could try to get some information from the maintainers.
18:42:36 <pboy> I think, it could be helpful
18:42:58 <eseyman> I think it's critical before making a decision
18:43:10 <pboy> You arfe right.
18:43:13 <cooltshirtguy> i think it's important to know
18:43:45 <pboy> eseyman, could you try to make contact? E.g. by adding a comment /question to the bug report?
18:45:16 <pboy> (I'm still a bit annoyed about the many hours of wasted work just because no information was provided.)
18:45:44 <eseyman> pboy: yes, I can do that
18:45:55 <pboy> eseyman 1++
18:46:23 <pboy> #agreed eseyman will try to contact the maintainers and get information  why the change was made.
18:46:36 <pboy> #action eseyman will try to contact the maintainers and get information  why the change was made.
18:47:03 <pboy> We will pick up the topic next meeting
18:47:16 <pboy> Ready for next topic?
18:47:40 <eseyman> Go!
18:47:46 <pboy> no objections we go on
18:47:52 <cooltshirtguy> go on
18:47:55 <pboy> #topic 5. Test planning for F40
18:48:07 <pboy> #link https://pagure.io/fedora-server/issue/125
18:48:12 <pboy> Some input
18:48:22 <pboy> We should discuss and organize 2 topics, I think
18:48:31 <pboy> a) What do we want to manually test?
18:48:42 <pboy> At the very least, we should conduct a "smoke test" of the installation media and also of the most important functions.
18:48:53 <pboy> b) What are the potentially critical changes that we should specifically monitor and test?
18:49:01 <jwhimpel> what is the preferred method to install F40 Server for testing at this time?  Install F39 Server, then update from rawhide?
18:49:04 <pboy> I think, one of us should take the organisation of this in his hand.
18:49:42 <eseyman> A Test Day seems to be the best of doing this
18:49:47 <pboy> jwhimpel  I always installed from branched, ifavailable
18:50:11 <eseyman> it does require coordination with the QA team
18:50:23 <pboy> eseyman yes veery much agreed. We should prepare that for next release
18:50:35 <pboy> for f40 it is too late
18:50:38 <eseyman> I test the Workstation Beta but not the server. I should really include this in my workflow
18:50:56 <jwhimpel> Where would one find a new installable ISO?  Is the cli upgrade path ready to upgrade to F40?
18:51:34 <pboy> jwhimpel  there is a mail from rawhide regurlarly with all the links to server isos.
18:51:55 <pboy> I think, you have to subscribe the devel list
18:51:59 <eseyman> the isos are available when Beta lands, for sure
18:52:16 <pboy> Or maybe another list, let me have a look ....
18:52:51 <jwhimpel> pboy: Thanks for the info about the ISOs.  But Beta is getting awfully late to start testing.  I am subscribed to fedora-devel list.
18:54:27 <pboy> jwhimpel it is test-announce@lists.fedoraproject.org  there is a about biweekly mail with all the links. I forward the latest to you.
18:55:05 <jwhimpel> pboy: I subscribe to that list also, so I will pay more attention seeking out those emails.
18:55:30 <pboy> jwhimpel  ++1
18:56:28 <pboy> Anyone happy to watch the changeset and arganize our tests for f40 (NOT to do all the test. We should share that part)
18:57:22 <jwhimpel> If I wanted to test "DNS System Plugin Upgrade" from F39 to F40, which repository should I enable?
18:58:34 <pboy> I think, if you download the latest installation media friom said list, the correct repo is enabled.
18:58:51 <pboy> Have a look at that address.
18:58:57 <cooltshirtguy> I have zero knowledge on how any of this works.
18:59:41 <pboy> cooltshirtguy Best   occasion to make a first step  :-)  I had a steep learning curve
19:00:41 <jwhimpel> The docs for DNF System Plugin Upgrade say to use either "Branched" or "Rawhide".  Is there a rule of thumb or a timing constraint as to which one to use?
19:01:02 <pboy> Well, our time is up. We should continue on mailing list and next meeting in 14 days.
19:01:15 <jwhimpel> bye
19:01:46 <pboy> jwhimpüel yes, branched is available after the branch step is done, as far as I know. You see that on the name of the installation media.
19:01:57 <pboy> bye bye
19:02:06 <cooltshirtguy> l8r
19:02:12 <pboy> #endmeeting