18:00:35 <mattdm> #startmeeting Council (2021-12-09) 18:00:35 <zodbot> Meeting started Thu Dec 9 18:00:35 2021 UTC. 18:00:35 <zodbot> This meeting is logged and archived in a public location. 18:00:35 <zodbot> The chair is mattdm. Information about MeetBot at https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Zodbot#Meeting_Functions. 18:00:35 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic. 18:00:35 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'council_(2021-12-09)' 18:00:41 <mattdm> #meetingname council 18:00:41 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'council' 18:00:50 <mattdm> #chair bookwar dcantrell siddharthvipul1 riecatnor spot mattdm bcotton sumantrom marianab bt0 t0xic0der 18:00:50 <zodbot> Current chairs: bcotton bookwar bt0 dcantrell marianab mattdm riecatnor siddharthvipul1 spot sumantrom t0xic0der 18:00:57 <mattdm> #topic Introductions, Welcomes 18:01:12 <riecatnor[m]1> .hello riecatnor 18:01:13 <zodbot> riecatnor[m]1: riecatnor 'Marie Nordin' <mnordin@redhat.com> 18:01:17 <mattdm> .hello2 18:01:18 <zodbot> mattdm: mattdm 'Matthew Miller' <mattdm@mattdm.org> 18:01:32 <mattdm> Ben is out today so I am remembering how to chair a meeting :) 18:01:57 <spot> .hello2 18:01:58 <zodbot> spot: spot 'Tom Callaway' <spotrh@gmail.com> 18:02:40 <mattdm> hi marie and spot. let's see who else we have! 18:03:00 <riecatnor[m]1> heyyy mattdm spot 18:03:42 <mattdm> ah, there's someone else :) 18:03:49 <VipulSiddharth[m> .hello siddharthvipul1 18:03:50 <zodbot> VipulSiddharth[m: siddharthvipul1 'Vipul Siddharth' <siddharthvipul1@gmail.com> 18:04:12 <mattdm> I'll wait another minute and then agenda-time 18:04:42 <glb> Is this one of those situations where the PgMT members are supposed to fill in? 18:04:51 <riecatnor[m]1> today is one of those days for me with meetings starting at 8am and ending at 8pm :p 18:04:52 <mattdm> glb you're welcome to join if you like! 18:05:02 <mattdm> okay then let's get going :) 18:05:09 <mattdm> #topic Today's agenda 18:05:15 <glb> I'm sort of here, but I don't really know anything and don't feel that I should vote on anything. 18:05:43 <mattdm> glb Yeah, only council members vote but your input is welcome. 18:06:15 <mattdm> My idea for the agenda, as a kind of year-end-cleanup: go through our ticket queue from the oldest to newest 18:06:41 <mattdm> and close everything we can, or have a concrete next action 18:07:04 <mattdm> Anyone have an objection to that, or other things to include? 18:07:36 <mattdm> ok, let's go 18:07:48 <mattdm> #topic ticket cleanup 18:07:50 <mattdm> https://pagure.io/Fedora-Council/tickets/issues?status=Open&order_key=date_created&order=asc 18:07:55 <mattdm> and then the first one 18:08:12 <mattdm> #topic #196 Request permission to make and sell Fedora merchandise 18:08:19 <mattdm> https://pagure.io/Fedora-Council/tickets/issue/196 18:08:26 <riecatnor[m]1> I think we wanna do 18:08:28 <riecatnor[m]1> #link https://pagure.io/Fedora-Council/tickets/issue/196 18:08:58 <mattdm> I think møte will use either? but I'm not sure. we'll see if that one is duplicated, and I'll use #link for the future :) 18:09:00 <spot> feels like we can close that one and reopen if they ever appear again. 18:09:22 <mattdm> yeah, that. Gonna do that right now. Someone #topic and #link the next one while I do that. 18:09:54 <riecatnor[m]1> #topic #198 Let's clarify the trademark guidelines on modified hosted (cloud, vps, etc) Fedora OS images 18:10:00 <riecatnor[m]1> #link https://pagure.io/Fedora-Council/tickets/issue/198 18:11:33 <mattdm> Spot, any opinion on this? _My_ opinion is... close as "well, we tried"? 18:12:15 * riecatnor[m]1 wonders if this made it to legals hands 18:12:21 <mattdm> I'm trying to get someone from RH legal (they are new to Red Hat but not to open source, and have some optimism and energy that has not yet been drained from them?) to help us with this, once they are done with the current thing they are wroking on. 18:12:39 <mattdm> but by _this_ I mean "refresh the trademark guidelines entirely". 18:12:53 <mattdm> which would subsume this. 18:13:26 <mattdm> I'm not, like, more than 20% optimistic on that, but 20% is higher than the ... 2%? optimism I have for getting this revived. 18:13:45 <mattdm> Waiting on spot for opinion though 18:14:18 <spot> you'd need to talk to whomever handles trademark stuff these days at RH 18:15:00 <mattdm> yeah, sorry, I wasn't trying to make you do that. I mean, do you feel okay about closing this, or is this a thing I should push on? 18:15:02 <spot> i will say that in the recent past, RH Legal did not have much interest in overhauling this. 18:15:26 <mattdm> I know, I was there :-/ 18:15:45 <mattdm> see my optimism level post above :) 18:15:53 <spot> If it was me, I would focus on making incremental changes rather than trying to do a total refresh 18:16:02 <spot> I don't think what we have now is totally broken. 18:16:58 <spot> so maybe, leave this open and try to restart the conversation? 18:17:05 <spot> (with RH Legal) 18:17:09 <mattdm> It's clearly not broken, but I think we might get more interest in looking at it systematically. That makes it kind of into an interesting project rather than yet another todo item. 18:18:24 <mattdm> I can try, thoguh. How about this: I will ping bex, see where he left it, and then try to get followup from RH legal, and if I don't get that, or if they come back with disinterest/opposition, close this by the end of the year? 18:19:03 <spot> seems fine to me 18:19:17 <mattdm> #action mattdm ping bex, see where he left it, and then try to get followup from RH legal, and if I don't get that, or if they come back with disinterest/opposition, close this by the end of the year. 18:19:22 <spot> though, isn't shutdown just around the corner? 18:19:31 <spot> maybe end of year is too aggressive. 18:19:39 <mattdm> we've got two weeks. 18:19:42 <mattdm> :) 18:19:49 <mattdm> but okay... january. 18:19:55 * spot wonders if RH legal is more responsive since he's been gone... ;) 18:20:32 <mattdm> spot: conversation with beverages at next in-person event :) 18:20:45 <mattdm> #undo 18:20:45 <zodbot> Removing item from minutes: ACTION by mattdm at 18:19:17 : mattdm ping bex, see where he left it, and then try to get followup from RH legal, and if I don't get that, or if they come back with disinterest/opposition, close this by the end of the year. 18:20:58 <mattdm> #action mattdm ping bex, see where he left it, and then try to get followup from RH legal, and if I don't get that, or if they come back with disinterest/opposition, close this by the end of January. 18:21:22 <mattdm> riecatnor: load up the next one while I ping bex right away so I don't forget 18:22:11 <riecatnor[m]1> #topic #280 Add the Fedora goal of having complete integrated system 18:22:20 <riecatnor[m]1> #link https://pagure.io/Fedora-Council/tickets/issue/280 18:22:50 <mattdm> I think bookwar is too busy. Let's close this one as deferred and she can reopen as she has time? 18:23:25 <mattdm> wait no i have a better idea 18:23:48 <mattdm> This really fits into the New Three/Five Year Strategy thing we need to work on. 18:24:01 <mattdm> So I'm going to close it and say "bring these ideas to that". 18:24:05 <riecatnor[m]1> Yes! 18:25:33 <mattdm> ok writing message to that effect and closing. next? :) 18:25:47 <riecatnor[m]1> #topic #322 Document/delegate Freenode Group Registration to succeed Tom Callaway (IRC: spot) 18:25:52 <riecatnor[m]1> #link https://pagure.io/Fedora-Council/tickets/issue/322 18:26:53 <mattdm> I think this is waiting for someone to tell nirik how to update a "role handbook' for IRC? 18:27:09 <riecatnor[m]1> hackmd is fine 18:27:28 <mattdm> and then what? 18:27:58 <riecatnor[m]1> someone would need to push it onto the commops docs 18:28:27 <riecatnor[m]1> I am not involved in the writing for this, or the pushing- so it is really up to who is writing it how they want to go about it 18:29:09 <mattdm> if there were a row in the table for that role handbook, would that be sufficent tracking such that we could close this ticket? 18:29:56 <riecatnor[m]1> I am not sure how it will get written without this open- it looks like nirik nb and spot need to coordinate? 18:31:19 <riecatnor[m]1> if they agree to close the ticket and work on it somewhere else I support that! 18:31:22 <nirik> I'm happy to write something, I just didn't know where/what process? 18:31:32 <nirik> you want me to just add it to the hackmd and call it a day? 18:32:04 <riecatnor[m]1> this: https://pagure.io/fedora-docs/docs-fp-o ? 18:32:35 <mattdm> and riecatnor can you add a "Role: IRC / Libera Chat primary contact" row to that table? 18:33:15 <mattdm> and then put kevin in the "they said they'd do it!" column there 18:33:28 <riecatnor[m]1> sure 18:33:33 <mattdm> and then I think we can close this at the council level. 18:34:03 <nirik> sure, I hope to spend some time over the holidays getting up to speed with the docs process... it seems to have gotten complex. 18:35:47 <mattdm> ok then next.. 18:35:55 <mattdm> #topic two docs refactor tickets from jflory7 18:36:03 <mattdm> #link https://pagure.io/Fedora-Council/tickets/issue/337 18:36:15 <mattdm> #link https://pagure.io/Fedora-Council/tickets/issue/338 18:37:52 <mattdm> proposal for the second one: I think adding an Objectives section to the docs is not a bad idea, but I think we should hold off on it pending general restructure of docs (see docs list to help) 18:38:00 <mattdm> (close:deferred) 18:38:40 <mattdm> for the first... we aren't doing the dashboard anymore, and the two others are in the same repo 18:38:51 <mattdm> So that's just a close:noaction 18:40:50 <mattdm> i hear crickets so I'm doing those two things unless there is objection. 18:41:30 <mattdm> #topic #348 trademark request: DLN Store 18:41:37 <mattdm> #link https://pagure.io/Fedora-Council/tickets/issue/348 18:42:01 <mattdm> proposal: exact same resolution as the first one. 18:42:05 <mattdm> Anyone still with me here? :) 18:42:09 <spot> i am 18:42:22 <mattdm> just checking :) 18:42:27 <spot> +1 to your proposal 18:42:33 <mattdm> I assume you'll speak up if I'm making bad choices :) 18:42:44 <riecatnor[m]1> here :) I was distracted for a moment there tho 18:42:47 <spot> I am... concerned about a "Fedorable" mascot. 18:42:57 <spot> But sure. reopen if they awaken. 18:43:33 <riecatnor[m]1> Fedorable seems better than M'Distro? 18:43:41 <spot> yes, 10000x yes 18:43:43 <spot> but still 18:44:08 <mattdm> hehhhhhh. sigh 18:44:25 <spot> Fedorable could be fun, but it could also be "kiddy" and "toy". It needs the right balance. 18:44:45 <mattdm> Yeah. We definitely would want to specifically review and approve. 18:44:48 <spot> but lets move on. :) 18:45:02 <mattdm> fpca wheee 18:45:10 <mattdm> #topic #364 Are we/our infrastructure correctly checking whether the FPCA is signed before allowing contributions? (If not, should it?) 18:45:16 <mattdm> #link https://pagure.io/Fedora-Council/tickets/issue/364 18:45:40 <mattdm> Uh, Ben Cotton (he/him/his) had some sort of action item around this. 18:45:52 * glb fwiw, it is part of the fedora magazine workflow 18:46:11 <mattdm> glb: out of curiosity, how does it work there? 18:46:17 <mattdm> and particularly has it caused any friction? 18:46:24 <glb> it is just documented. 18:46:50 <glb> we have one article that someone wrote but we refused to publish because they never signed the fpca 18:47:05 <mattdm> one out of hundreds isn't bad 18:47:14 <glb> yeah, no problem i'd say 18:47:45 <glb> i might have a bot auto check the fpca sig durring weekly meeting if i can figure out how. 18:47:56 <mattdm> so, although my close-button trigger finger is itchy, I think we should wait for ben on this. I'll put a ping in the ticket. 18:47:59 <glb> not sure if there is a api for the fas system. 18:48:56 <mattdm> glb: https://github.com/fedora-infra/fasjson/ I think. but we talk about that later :) 18:50:29 <mattdm> #topic #377 Add legal geo restrictions to Council Policies documents 18:50:33 <mattdm> #link https://pagure.io/Fedora-Council/tickets/issue/377 18:50:51 <mattdm> This is on me to do. 18:51:05 <mattdm> FWIW, I'm also working with some other folks to push on what we can change here. 18:51:23 <mattdm> But there's nothing I can talk about at this point. 18:51:43 <mattdm> Keeping open, moving on 18:51:46 <mattdm> #topic #378 /r/Fedora using disallowed version of Fedora logo 18:51:57 <spot> i thought this one was resolved now 18:51:58 <mattdm> #link https://pagure.io/Fedora-Council/tickets/issue/378 18:52:25 <riecatnor[m]1> looks like it 18:52:47 <mattdm> And as I understand it, r/fedora is looking for more help with moderation 18:53:13 <mattdm> proposal: close with just "The logo issue is resolved." 18:54:26 * mattdm checks 🕐️ 18:54:42 <mattdm> five minutes left, and we're down to 8 open issues. 18:54:59 <mattdm> let's move on to next meeting and announcements 18:55:04 <mattdm> #topic Next Meeting 18:55:44 <mattdm> okay, so... this is Ben's wheelhouse :) 18:55:54 <mattdm> looking at the calendar, though, we don't have a meeting next week 18:56:06 <mattdm> and then the next scheduled one is on the 23rd? 18:56:14 <riecatnor[m]1> Yes the next one would be the 23rd 18:56:29 <riecatnor[m]1> (I will be on PTO by then tho ;) 18:56:32 <mattdm> I suggest we cancel that one. 18:56:45 <riecatnor[m]1> +1 18:56:48 <mattdm> Because, yeah. I will be around, but... in a holiday mood :) 18:56:52 <riecatnor[m]1> next one would be Jan 6th 18:57:16 <mattdm> that seems reasonable. do we want to meet next week just to close out the year? 18:58:04 <mattdm> I suspect we would not get good turnout anyways. 18:58:16 <mattdm> #info canceling the Dec 23rd meeting 18:58:22 <mattdm> #info next meeting, Jan 6, 2022 18:58:47 <mattdm> #info Please join council discussions on https://discussion.fedoraproject.org/ 18:58:48 <mattdm> #topic Announcements 18:59:02 <mattdm> Fedora elections, last few hours. 18:59:16 <mattdm> I'm going to post on Discussion and Ask as a last-minute reminder. 18:59:21 <mattdm> Anything else to annoucne? 18:59:57 <riecatnor[m]1> not me 19:00:29 <mattdm> ok then. thanks riecatnor glb spot nirik 19:00:34 <mattdm> #endmeeting