12:30:14 <bexelbie> #startmeeting Mindshare
12:30:14 <zodbot> Meeting started Mon Apr  9 12:30:14 2018 UTC.  The chair is bexelbie. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
12:30:14 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
12:30:14 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'mindshare'
12:30:19 <bexelbie> #chair jflory7 jsmith mleonova nb robyduck x3mboy
12:30:19 <zodbot> Current chairs: bexelbie jflory7 jsmith mleonova nb robyduck x3mboy
12:30:21 <bexelbie> .hello bex
12:30:22 <zodbot> bexelbie: bex 'Brian (bex) Exelbierd' <bexelbie@redhat.com>
12:30:24 <bexelbie> mleonova, yep :D
12:30:27 <jwf> s/jflory7/jwf :-)
12:30:31 <mleonova> cool :)
12:30:31 <jwf> .hello jflory7
12:30:32 <zodbot> jwf: jflory7 'Justin W. Flory' <jflory7@gmail.com>
12:30:39 <mleonova> .hello mleonova
12:30:40 <zodbot> mleonova: mleonova 'Maria Leonova' <marialeonova.design@gmail.com>
12:30:41 <jwf> Morning / afternoon!
12:30:52 <bexelbie> #chair jwf
12:30:52 <zodbot> Current chairs: bexelbie jflory7 jsmith jwf mleonova nb robyduck x3mboy
12:30:58 <jsmith> .hello2
12:31:00 <zodbot> jsmith: jsmith 'Jared Smith' <jsmith.fedora@gmail.com>
12:31:38 <jsmith> Happy Monday, everyone!  (if there is such a thing)
12:31:50 <x3mlinux> .hello x3mboy
12:31:51 <zodbot> x3mlinux: x3mboy 'Eduard Lucena' <eduardlucena@gmail.com>
12:32:28 <bexelbie> robyduck, nb ping?
12:32:39 <bexelbie> I'm going to give those folks a small amount of time
12:32:42 <bexelbie> #topic Rollcall
12:33:00 <bexelbie> While we wait, I've reviewed tickets
12:33:26 <bexelbie> I believe we should talk about 6, 8, 9, 12, 13, 14, 15
12:33:45 <bexelbie> the ones I omitted, 3 and 5 are both pending/blocked
12:33:55 <bexelbie> be thinking about anything you want to raise in open floor
12:34:18 * jwf needs to look at ticket numbers <=> name
12:34:44 <bexelbie> let's roll :D
12:34:50 <jwf> #3 and #5 are still blocked, as far as I know.
12:34:55 <bexelbie> #topic Ambassadors
12:35:03 <bexelbie> #link https://pagure.io/mindshare/issue/6
12:35:12 <bexelbie> #info Research other "representation" programs in other open source communities
12:35:18 <bexelbie> #link https://pagure.io/mindshare/issue/8
12:35:23 <bexelbie> #info Write draft "ambassadors plan" email for review
12:35:35 <jsmith> Ok, I have an update on this one
12:35:40 <bexelbie> like many others, I have not had time to put into this draft ...
12:35:47 * bexelbie looks at jsmith happily :D
12:35:50 <jsmith> I've updated the language, took some feedback into account
12:36:04 <jsmith> #link http://etherpad.osuosl.org/fedora-ambassadors-draft
12:36:14 <jsmith> There are still a couple of minor things we need to decide as a group
12:36:36 <jsmith> (including whether or not to include more detail about the budget process -- how many Mindshare people need to approve certain amounts, etc.)
12:37:04 <jwf> Ooh, I haven't seen the newest edits
12:37:06 <jsmith> Also, some details on what information we're expecting for release parties would be useful,  I think
12:37:13 * jwf is going through the revisions quickly
12:37:17 * jsmith worked on it over the weekend.
12:38:09 <bexelbie> I need to read this in detail, but my feeling is that we should probably include details so they can start as "edit" points
12:38:19 <bexelbie> as I know that many readers will be most curious about their specific detailed concern
12:38:22 <jsmith> That's my thought as well.
12:38:38 <jwf> I am leaning same way as bexelbie too
12:38:41 <jsmith> So if there aren't any objections, let's plan on additing those details in.
12:38:54 <x3mboy> +1
12:39:09 <x3mboy> I'm still reading it, but that info will be useful
12:39:14 <bexelbie> since we have this hour blocked, how about we check in other tickets and then shift to that etherpad.  jsmith can you clear hte attribution colors and then bold or mark with color where we need to focus?
12:39:18 <jsmith> I know we may no have quorum this morning, but can we get agreement between everyone here on those details?
12:39:31 <jsmith> bexelbie: Can do.
12:39:36 <jsmith> +1 to the plan :-)
12:39:37 <bexelbie> any objections?
12:39:49 <jwf> Nope, I like the idea of circling back around
12:39:50 <jwf> Also—
12:39:59 <jwf> Feel free to take a look through some of the details in #6
12:40:07 <robyduck> .hello robyduck
12:40:08 <zodbot> robyduck: robyduck 'Robert Mayr' <robyduck@gmail.com>
12:40:13 <bexelbie> exactly, I think we should think about #6 in reference to this
12:40:18 <jwf> bt0 put together some research on other programs across the open source world, and it was interesting to note the similarities
12:40:28 <jwf> We covered it last week too, but last week was a holiday for many of us
12:40:39 <bexelbie> so let's move forward and then give the balance of our time into this with the intent of shipping ASAP
12:40:57 * jwf nods
12:41:03 <bexelbie> #topic Design Issues
12:41:05 <bexelbie> #link https://pagure.io/mindshare/issue/9
12:41:12 <bexelbie> any updates mleonova ... are we blocking design?
12:41:52 <mleonova> hey, so no updates yet - been having visa issues last week
12:42:02 <mleonova> badge is ppushed and I will get to the logo asap
12:42:14 <bexelbie> mleonova, understand .. mine is also in progress.
12:42:20 <bexelbie> mleonova, as long as we aren't blocking, I am cool
12:42:24 <bexelbie> anyone have questions?
12:42:32 <x3mboy> Nope
12:42:32 <mleonova> bexelbie, okay
12:42:34 <jwf> None from me
12:42:38 <x3mboy> I like the ideas on the ticket
12:42:55 <x3mboy> #link https://pagure.io/design/issue/580
12:43:17 <bexelbie> #topic Standard footer for fedora websites and webapps
12:43:26 <bexelbie> #link https://pagure.io/mindshare/issue/13
12:43:33 <bexelbie> robyduck, can you tell us how we can help web here?
12:43:41 * robyduck was not able to speak to Ryan yet
12:44:07 <robyduck> The problem here is that the standard footer has much less links than we have in the websites actually
12:44:27 <robyduck> we need to find out which links we really need
12:44:30 <bexelbie> do we need to provide some advice on a recommended set?
12:44:47 <robyduck> Having footers with tons of links is rather useless IMHO
12:45:05 <robyduck> bexelbie: I like the proposed footer Ryan set up
12:45:44 <x3mboy> My only input in this is that CoC should be part of the footer
12:45:45 <bexelbie> robyduck, do you have a link with the proposed footer?
12:45:56 * bexelbie wants to make sure we are all talking about the same footer
12:46:07 <jsmith> bexelbie: Good call :-)
12:46:08 <robyduck> I think this is a good recommendation, but if we need some "must have" links, we should add them in the ticket
12:46:49 <robyduck> https://docs.fedoraproject.org/
12:46:55 <robyduck> This is the one he mentioned
12:47:12 <bexelbie> #link docs.fedoraproject.org
12:47:16 <bexelbie> #info recommended footer
12:47:36 <x3mboy> It's quite hard, and standard footer could be tricky, e.g.: we don't need documentation links in the docs' site, but we should have it in getfedora.org
12:47:37 <mleonova> does it make sense to have both Red Hat and Fedora logos there?
12:47:42 <jwf> I'm also +1 to x3mboy's suggestion
12:47:55 <robyduck> sure, we miss the CoC and some others, but they should not change the layout significally
12:48:06 <jsmith> I think the "Sponsors" and "Fedora is Sponsored by Red Hat." are redundant, as well
12:48:08 <bexelbie> I'd like to see both the CoC and the Docs site (I realize this is the docs site footer, but we need it elsewhere)
12:48:43 <bexelbie> jsmith, I'd like to see sponsors kept as we have more sponsorship than just RH
12:49:07 <jsmith> bexelbie: I agree -- it just seems redundant to have two links talking about sponsorship
12:49:10 <x3mboy> And as painful I think it is, we shouldn't drive "general visitors" to the wiki :'(
12:49:11 <bexelbie> I could see moving sponsors that area though
12:49:35 <bexelbie> something like "Fedora is sponsored by Red Hat and Others" and have that be the link?
12:49:44 <jsmith> bexelbie: Sounds great!
12:49:46 <robyduck> https://getfedora.org/en/ is what we have in all websites for now
12:49:50 <bexelbie> x3mboy, while I agree, I think we should not block this footer on getting all of those links moved around and edited
12:50:07 <x3mboy> Sure
12:50:23 <robyduck> and yes, I think we link to a Installation Guide which is rather useless now, just link to the new docs site would be better, as it is well structured now
12:50:29 <bexelbie> robyduck, agreed
12:50:41 <bexelbie> and we could link the developer portal from that site if we redesign to make that cleaner
12:50:44 <x3mboy> Agreed
12:50:51 <bexelbie> which would give us something to swap out in the docs.fp.o footer
12:51:00 <robyduck> +1
12:51:25 <bexelbie> I'd rather see a link to the commblog than FAS as wwell
12:52:31 <bexelbie> and that would allow us to eliminate the about column.  Legal could be a link over near the logos.  Get Fedora could be promoted to be next to the social media icons and the magazine link moved somewhere more logical
12:52:35 <x3mboy> I have a question, should the footer looks the same in all the sites, independent of the size of the page?
12:53:02 <bexelbie> I feel like "About Fedora" and "Fedora Magazine" have more in common and shoould be linked
12:53:04 <x3mboy> Like a fix size to pixels, instead of a percentage of proportion?
12:53:24 <bexelbie> x3mboy, I think we should let the web designers figure that out
12:53:36 <x3mboy> bexelbie, agreed
12:53:37 <robyduck> x3mboy: the same in all wensites with new layout (bootstrap)
12:53:46 <bexelbie> I am also -0.1 to having a link to Planet Fedora
12:53:50 <x3mboy> e.g. https://getfedora.org/en/sponsors vs https://getfedora.org/
12:53:52 <bexelbie> I am not sure the value is huge for every footer
12:54:04 <robyduck> bexelbie: agree with another -0.1
12:54:09 <x3mboy> I should prefer magazine than planet
12:54:10 <bexelbie> x3mboy, what do you mean by putting those two links togehter?
12:54:24 <x3mboy> Sorry, it was intended in my "size" comment
12:54:24 <robyduck> x3mboy: magazine is there
12:54:32 <bexelbie> magazine is also on docs.fp.o
12:54:39 <bexelbie> it is just hidden in "About"
12:54:46 <bexelbie> s/hidden/"hidden"
12:55:07 <x3mboy> I saw it now
12:55:14 <bexelbie> robyduck, do you have enough feedback and time to put together a proposal from this conversation?
12:55:30 <robyduck> bexelbie: yes :)
12:55:33 <bexelbie> sweet
12:55:36 <x3mboy> Cool!
12:55:47 <bexelbie> then rather than let this eat all of our time, let's look at the proposal robyduck comes back with :D
12:55:49 <bexelbie> cool?
12:55:58 <jsmith> WORKSFORME :-)
12:55:58 <bexelbie> I am going to move on, barring objection
12:56:09 <robyduck> jsmith: hehe
12:56:10 <x3mboy> +1 to move on
12:56:12 <mleonova> +1
12:56:33 <bexelbie> #topic Replace Docker with Container
12:56:43 <bexelbie> #link https://pagure.io/mindshare/issue/14
12:56:47 <bexelbie> robyduck, you're up again :D
12:57:06 <robyduck> I am also adding https://pagure.io/design/issue/590
12:57:58 <robyduck> Mo raised some concerns about making design of Containers, but Dan then came up with some help, a logo we could rely ojn
12:58:04 <robyduck> on*
12:58:46 <bexelbie> ok, anything we can do to help here?
12:59:03 <robyduck> Hopefully we are able to get something, in the meanhwile we are working from a web POV
12:59:15 <robyduck> bexelbie: the reason why I filed this, was coordination
12:59:24 <bexelbie> robyduck, I think that is great
12:59:26 <nb> I am here
12:59:31 <robyduck> we need to give inputs and get feedback from marketing roo
12:59:38 <robyduck> s/roo/too
12:59:43 <bexelbie> I am trying to understand if there is an active need for Mindshare to discuss this or if we are trakcing here
13:00:01 <jwf> From my POV, seems like tracking?
13:00:02 * bexelbie looks at x3mboy ... the Marketing roo :P
13:00:18 <robyduck> and maybe also Ambassadors have to be up to date with that change, which is not technical, but just about "communication"
13:00:26 <x3mboy> IMHO that's a good change to do. We need to make a great reading of everything to check when is accurate to use Docker and Containers
13:00:33 <robyduck> bexelbie: lol rooooo
13:01:18 * nb has some comments about the ambassadors changes when we get done
13:01:20 <bexelbie> x3mboy, a good rule of thumb is that docker is the command and technology.  Docker is the company.  That is little-d vs big-d.  We tend to not need big-D Docker in Fedora
13:01:44 <bexelbie> not need ... menas we tend to talk about the tech not the company
13:01:51 <bexelbie> not that we don't care about that company as a policy
13:02:16 <bexelbie> robyduck, x3mboy can you all connect regarding this topic?
13:02:26 <x3mboy> Sure
13:02:53 <robyduck> yes, should we keep this ticket for tracking or how do we deal with it?
13:03:03 <bexelbie> +1 to keeping the ticket for tracking
13:03:11 <robyduck> ok
13:03:17 * bexelbie notices the time and moves us along
13:03:18 <bexelbie> #topic table these?
13:03:34 <bexelbie> I'd like to table #15 about event reports and #12 about the mailing lists
13:03:38 <bexelbie> as we are short of people-power
13:03:52 <bexelbie> and those can hold or will hold in the case of #15 to be part of hte amby convo
13:03:55 <bexelbie> any objections
13:03:56 <bexelbie> ?
13:04:00 <jwf> #15 will be super helpful, but +1 to table. Takes more bandwidth than I think we have
13:04:09 <jwf> I'm more confused on what is blocking #12 though
13:04:23 <x3mboy> jwf, the definition of both lists
13:04:45 <jwf> We are trying to direct people to participate / follow along with Mindshare, so I think #12 has a higher priority
13:05:20 <jwf> x3mboy: Then maybe we need to figure that definition out as a first step
13:05:21 <x3mboy> I was wanting to ask, if we do mindshare public, and also mindshare-announce need to be public (as intended to make announcements)
13:05:22 <bexelbie> jwf, people power is blocking #12 unless you ahve time to do it
13:05:34 <bexelbie> x3mboy, both are public, aiui
13:05:46 <x3mboy> So, what's the problem with them?
13:05:56 <jwf> bexelbie: I'm not sure what the work to do here is, other than using the lists as described in x3mboy's comment
13:05:57 <bexelbie> x3mboy, do you ahve time to write the announcement?
13:06:13 <bexelbie> I was under the impression the ticket was about getting them announced
13:06:24 <bexelbie> sending the announcement to an empty mindshare-announce won't help :P
13:06:26 <jwf> Hmmm
13:06:44 <jwf> I would be in favor of making sure it is explained correctly on our docs page, and then continually pointing people to the -announce list in our monthly reports
13:06:53 <jwf> I don't think a standalone announcement is really necessary
13:07:07 <jwf> I think our monthly posts will do this work
13:07:10 <x3mboy> I can write an announcement in CommBlog
13:07:12 <jwf> And we are already obligated to do that work
13:07:35 <bexelbie> #proposal close #12 and just announce the -annouce in the monthly reports.  Meeting minutes to the -announce list
13:07:39 <x3mboy> Does CommBlog unscheduled dates to publish it this week?
13:08:08 <jwf> x3mboy: If you have the time and bandwidth, I guess it can't hurt, but I would rather use that energy for the monthly report instead :-)
13:08:12 <bexelbie> x3mboy, would you be ok with closing #12 and if you can get an announcement in the commblog it is a bonus?
13:08:14 <jwf> We could emphasize it in the report too
13:08:22 <x3mboy> Sure
13:08:26 <bexelbie> #proposal close #12 and just announce the -annouce in the monthly reports.  Meeting minutes to the -announce list
13:08:29 <bexelbie> any votes?
13:08:30 <x3mboy> +1
13:08:37 <jwf> bexelbie: Is the docs site up-to-date with the list difference?
13:08:44 <jwf> That needs to be part of the proposal too, if it is not
13:08:55 <bexelbie> jwf, I don't know, I thought that was being done by this ticket.  I thougth you indicated it was done
13:09:15 <jwf> https://docs.fedoraproject.org/fedora-project/subprojects/mindshare/mindshare.html#contact-info
13:09:19 <jwf> Doesn't look like it yet
13:09:36 <bexelbie> ok, then unless someone wants #12 .. it is blocked due to lack of people power
13:09:56 <jwf> bexelbie: Maybe update the ticket title to make the work more explicit for the docs site than a CommBlog post
13:10:04 <bexelbie> updating
13:10:12 <jwf> So we don't get caught backtracking next meeting
13:10:14 <x3mboy> I have a PR pending than modify this doc
13:10:14 <jwf> :+1:
13:10:36 <x3mboy> But as always I messed up with git and is in the middle with other page
13:10:44 <x3mboy> https://pagure.io/Fedora-Council/council-docs/pull-request/21
13:10:49 <bexelbie> x3mboy, let's coordinate after this meeting about the update
13:10:52 <bexelbie> I'll help you with git
13:10:55 <bexelbie> #12 is updated
13:10:56 <x3mboy> bexelbie, cool!
13:11:27 <bexelbie> ok, barring objection, I'd like to close this meeting and have us all work in the etehrpad to get this finished
13:11:33 <bexelbie> it'd be great if we could ship this on Thursday
13:11:43 * bexelbie is being aggressive with the timeline
13:11:43 <bexelbie> :D
13:11:47 <bexelbie> objections?
13:11:57 <x3mboy> None
13:12:11 <bexelbie> closing in 30 seconds
13:12:15 * bexelbie goes to start re-reading the etherpad
13:12:56 <bexelbie> .
13:13:00 <bexelbie> #endmeeting