06:32:42 <paragan> #startmeeting i18n
06:32:42 <zodbot> Meeting started Wed Jan 17 06:32:42 2018 UTC.  The chair is paragan. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
06:32:42 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
06:32:42 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'i18n'
06:32:43 <paragan> #meetingname i18n
06:32:43 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'i18n'
06:32:43 <paragan> #topic agenda and roll call
06:32:43 <paragan> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/I18N/Meetings/2018-01-17
06:32:45 <suanand> hi..
06:32:48 <mfabian_> ☺
06:32:52 <tagoh_> hi
06:33:23 <petersen> hello
06:33:25 <epico> hi
06:33:57 <bhavin192> hi
06:34:08 <paragan> let's start
06:34:28 <pravins> hi
06:34:43 <fujiwarat> hi
06:35:42 <paragan> hi all
06:35:54 <paragan> #topic Upcoming schedule
06:35:54 <paragan> #info 2017-11-14 	Fedora 27 Release
06:35:54 <paragan> #info 2018-01-09 	Change Checkpoint: Proposal submission deadline (System Wide Changes)
06:35:54 <paragan> #info 2018-01-09         Change Checkpoint: Proposal submission deadline (Changes requiring mass rebuild)
06:35:54 <paragan> #info 2018-01-30 	Change Checkpoint: Proposal submission deadline (Self Contained Changes)
06:35:55 <paragan> #info 2018-01-31 	Mass Rebuild
06:36:07 <paragan> so the current schedule is this
06:36:26 <paragan> Change proposal submission is going on
06:36:47 <paragan> I think mostly we are done with Change submission which we will discuss in next topic
06:37:07 <epico> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/ChineseDefaultFontsToNoto
06:37:21 * epico will submit it later.
06:38:35 <paragan> thanks epico
06:38:49 <epico> welcome
06:38:57 <paragan> let's move
06:38:58 <paragan> #topic No assignee issues
06:38:59 <paragan> #info #83: Tracker for Fedora 28 Changes (pnemade)
06:38:59 <paragan> #link https://pagure.io/i18n/issue/83
06:39:10 <paragan> so I have created per Change tickets today
06:39:29 <paragan> these are from tickets 87 to 91
06:39:48 <paragan> I have also assigned Change owners as these ticket owners
06:39:51 <petersen> ah thanks!
06:42:21 <paragan> so is there anyone want to discuss anything about Changes here?
06:42:40 <paragan> hopefully all the Changes will get completed on time and soon
06:43:14 <petersen> when do we plan to have the fonts changes in place?
06:43:37 <petersen> particularly JK :)
06:44:11 <tagoh_> petersen: I'm planning to finish my work in this month
06:44:41 <petersen> great
06:44:50 <tagoh_> so can be tested earlier
06:45:06 <petersen> are the mono fonts different between adobe and noto?
06:45:17 <petersen> tagoh_: that would be really good
06:46:46 <paragan> cool
06:47:12 <paragan> if no more questions on this ticket then we can move to next ticket
06:47:25 <tagoh_> petersen: strictly speaking no mono fonts in Source Han.
06:47:58 <epico> it has now...
06:48:26 <epico> it is called HW.
06:48:36 <epico> https://github.com/adobe-fonts/source-han-sans/tree/release/OTF/SimplifiedChineseHW
06:51:20 <petersen> what does HW stand for?
06:51:28 * epico dunno.
06:51:37 <epico> guess half width?
06:52:07 <petersen> ah
06:52:15 <tagoh_> hmm, that looks like not monospace
06:52:32 <epico> aha
06:52:40 <tagoh_> the document says: Font resources that include "HW" in their names use half-width glyphs for ASCII by default.
06:52:49 <tagoh_> they don't mention about mono for HW at all
06:53:55 <tagoh_> maybe relevant to the ambiguous characters in Unicode?
06:53:59 <tagoh_> dunno
06:55:14 <epico> it looks like the monospace in noto-cjk fonts.
06:57:24 <petersen> tagoh_: isn't it implied? :)
06:58:31 <tagoh_> petersen: I don't think so... non-ascii must have fixed width also in monospace.
07:01:14 <petersen> hmm okay, I dunno
07:01:33 <petersen> to me can't be half-width without being monospace but icbw
07:02:01 * epico think so
07:02:03 <petersen> maybe ascii means Latin here? :)
07:02:29 <petersen> seems worth testing anyway - though Noto should be fine
07:02:35 <petersen> Just curious how they compare
07:02:45 <petersen> they may be identical even??
07:02:48 <tagoh_> for instance, Adobe clearly says the Source Code Pro is a monospaced font. no need to imply anything. they could say it is if that is true
07:02:57 <petersen> that is true
07:03:07 <petersen> I don't think it is clear though
07:03:57 <petersen> the distinction is minor minor anyway IMHO
07:04:06 <petersen> erm s/minor//
07:04:27 <petersen> Code Pro has quite limited coverage I guess
07:04:38 <tagoh_> right
07:04:41 <petersen> I mean compared to the CJK fonts
07:04:54 <petersen> anyway let's move on :)
07:05:19 <petersen> we are discussing something that can be easily tested :-)
07:05:31 <tagoh_> and adobe has Source Han Code JP for japanese monospaced font. dunno why they didn't release it  as  a part of Source Han though
07:05:42 <petersen> tagoh_: right I wondered too
07:06:14 <petersen> how about CN and KR?
07:07:00 <tagoh_> no
07:10:51 <petersen> okay
07:12:40 <paragan> Maybe good to have some wiki page if we are comparing some fonts about their comparison
07:12:54 <petersen> true
07:13:27 <petersen> actually some scripts to generate screenshots for different fonts would be nice
07:13:59 <petersen> well script to generate for a given font I mean
07:14:00 <paragan> hm okay
07:15:02 <paragan> I think we have some package fntsample
07:15:24 <tagoh_> hm, dunno. we want to package HW too? at this moment we don't have them in Fedora right?
07:15:46 <petersen> are they released?
07:16:44 <tagoh_> there seems zip available.
07:18:55 <paragan> Okay we can continue discussion later on. Let's move to next issue
07:19:08 <paragan> #info #82: Fedora 28 i18n test day  (pnemade)
07:19:08 <paragan> #link https://pagure.io/i18n/issue/82
07:19:33 <paragan> I am not sure if we have any updates here to discuss
07:19:48 <paragan> if not I will keep this pending again for next meeting
07:22:22 <petersen> Is there more to discuss around the date?
07:22:46 <paragan> Well 13th March or 5th April
07:25:27 <paragan> I am still voting for 5th April (More late more updates get tested though I accept we get less time to fix and test but then we can request as a blocker/exception)
07:25:55 <pravins> it also means more time for preparation.
07:26:13 <paragan> but if rest team thinks early testing is good then 13th March also okay
07:26:53 * pravins checking schedule of Fedora
07:27:30 <pravins> Beta Freeze is happening on 6th March
07:28:17 <pravins> Why to wait till 5th April then?  We can extend Window of test day
07:28:26 <pravins> anyway, we never complete all testing on 1st day
07:28:38 <pravins> i think, good to go for 13th Marc
07:28:41 <pravins> March
07:29:16 <paragan> Please note many important changes lands around Beta release
07:29:32 <petersen> There may be slip
07:29:35 <paragan> but anyway early testing is always good
07:29:39 <petersen> true
07:29:48 <paragan> if we are unable to decide then I am going to mark
07:29:52 <petersen> I am okay either way - as long as we get lots of testing :)
07:29:57 <paragan> 13th March as our test day
07:30:07 <pravins> if we start early, we can get more testing :)
07:30:17 <tagoh_> may depends how many exceptions has been made after the freeze to break it.
07:30:25 <pravins> if it slips, then can we slip test day as well?
07:30:53 <paragan> pravins, yes that is why do test day as late as possible
07:31:22 <paragan> I think we should target dates not milestones
07:31:37 <paragan> as we are anyway using the recent working Live iso for testing
07:32:05 * petersen has to go to a meeting now
07:32:30 <tagoh_> if there was too much that "freeze" is meaningless in fact, better wait for the beta release perhaps. otherwise we could assume less drastic changes after freeze.
07:32:58 <tagoh_> and good to have more time for fixing then.
07:33:08 <tagoh_> in that sense I'd vote on earlier testing
07:33:41 <paragan> thanks. I am going to mark our decision as 13th March as i18n test day.
07:33:57 <pravins> tagoh_: good point. !!
07:34:10 <pravins> paragan: 👍
07:34:35 <paragan> #info we decided today 13th March as F28 i18n test day
07:35:51 <paragan> #info #84: Fedora 26 Bug triaging (pnemade)
07:35:51 <paragan> #link https://pagure.io/i18n/issue/84
07:36:04 <paragan> still there are many bugs
07:36:28 <paragan> bug list is at https://da.gd/sFmG
07:37:03 <paragan> keep triaging and fixing them
07:37:06 <paragan> :)
07:39:28 <paragan> #topic Open Floor
07:39:35 <paragan> anything to discuss here?
07:40:06 <paragan> if not will close the meeting. Thanks all who came to this meeting :)
07:43:21 <paragan> #endmeeting