14:00:28 <bcotton> #startmeeting Docs Project Meeting - Agenda: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Docs_Project_meetings
14:00:28 <zodbot> Meeting started Mon Jan 21 14:00:28 2013 UTC.  The chair is bcotton. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
14:00:28 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
14:00:34 <bcotton> #meetingname Fedora Docs
14:00:34 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'fedora_docs'
14:00:43 <bcotton> #topic Roll Call
14:01:12 <randomuser> g'morning
14:01:18 * bcotton waves
14:01:28 * pkovar is here
14:01:29 <joat> here (typing furiously)
14:01:39 <bcotton> i suspect our FUDcon attendees will be too conned to show up this morning
14:01:44 * Capesteve is here
14:01:48 <bcotton> which is okay, because the agenda is short
14:04:12 * Sparks is here
14:04:29 <bcotton> #chair Sparks
14:04:29 <zodbot> Current chairs: Sparks bcotton
14:04:56 <bcotton> Sparks: after your email, i was hoping you would be
14:05:20 <bcotton> okay, let's start
14:05:29 <bcotton> #info Participants are reminded to make liberal use of #info #link #help in order to make the minutes "more better"
14:05:38 <bcotton> #topic Follow up on last week's action items
14:05:46 <bcotton> i did mine, yay!
14:06:00 <bcotton> pkovar: to file a bug report against publican to see if the global change of the install dir is realistic ?
14:06:17 <pkovar> ah, well...
14:06:34 <pkovar> i thunk i will mail the publican list instead
14:06:47 <pkovar> since there have been several comments and concerns
14:06:52 <pkovar> regarding this change
14:06:52 <bcotton> okay, cool
14:06:57 <pkovar> and CC doc list
14:07:14 <pkovar> it is not about the path only
14:07:24 <pkovar> another problem would be lang codes
14:07:26 <bcotton> #action pkovar to mail the publican list and docs list to see if the global change of the install dir is realistic
14:07:40 <bcotton> solution: no more translation :-p
14:07:40 <pkovar> so these all need to be addressed somehow
14:07:51 <pkovar> right! :-)
14:08:25 <pkovar> will see what others think...
14:08:33 <bcotton> sounds good
14:08:36 <bcotton> any other action item follow ups i've missed?
14:08:49 <pkovar> from me, i think that's it for now
14:08:58 <Sparks> bcotton: I sent an email?
14:09:15 <bcotton> Sparks: you did, that's correct. want to bring it up here or as a separate topic?
14:09:29 <Sparks> bcotton: I don't know what email you speak of
14:09:39 <bcotton> Sparks: oh
14:10:01 <bcotton> Sparks: the one froma few minutes ago about publican 3
14:10:27 <Sparks> Oh, yeah I can talk about that one
14:10:41 <pkovar> ah, was about to ask re: publican3
14:10:47 <Sparks> Sorry, I actually wrote that yesterday but it was just sitting in my outbox
14:10:50 <bcotton> #topic Publishing docs with Publican 3 andkoji
14:10:57 <bcotton> the floor is yours, Sparks
14:11:00 <Sparks> Okay
14:11:08 <Sparks> So...
14:11:31 <Sparks> Publican >= 2.8 can package docs up into SRPMs
14:12:04 <randomuser> multi-lang packages?
14:12:11 <Sparks> The Publican backend that makes the docs.fp.o can then just install these docs
14:12:26 <jjmcd> One menu entry per language
14:12:31 <Sparks> This makes the web git repo unnessecary
14:13:10 <Sparks> And, thus, we won't need to mess with any of that anymore.
14:13:32 <Sparks> To make all this happen we need a tag on Koji
14:13:37 <Sparks> and our own repo
14:14:11 <Sparks> We've had a ticket open in RELENG to make this happen for a while but we didn't *need* it until after F18 was released as so to not mess up things right before the release
14:14:21 <jjmcd> The idea being that anything in the repo shows up on docs.fp.o?
14:14:28 <Sparks> Of course we didn't know that such a delay was even possible for the release so it's been a while
14:14:44 <Sparks> I spoke with Dennis and Kevin about this and this should happen soon.
14:14:56 <Sparks> EOF
14:15:15 <jjmcd> Sparks: Question - The idea being that anything in the repo shows up on docs.fp.o?
14:15:53 <jjmcd> and we back of via a yum downgrade?
14:16:47 <Sparks> jjmcd: Yes
14:17:05 <Sparks> jjmcd: The backend would generally do a 'yum update' on a regular basis
14:17:05 <randomuser> So, we'd end up with the same workflow as any other package, with per-rpm ACLs and such?
14:17:15 <jjmcd> And does it mean that anyone who publishes has to put up with the torrent of Nagios messages?
14:17:17 <Sparks> randomuser: Not exactly.
14:17:44 <Sparks> randomuser: we could but we aren't putting this into the Fedora repo but rather our own repo
14:17:59 <Sparks> Nagios?
14:18:23 <jjmcd> Ahhh, OK, so I don't have to log on to update a doc, the backend just deals with it - OK
14:19:08 <jjmcd> I was thinking we would need infra privs to log on and say yum update
14:20:21 <Sparks> jjmcd: I don't think so but I'll have to refer you to Rudi as I've not seen this thing work.
14:20:32 <Sparks> This is how they do it for Red Hat implementations, though.
14:20:42 <jjmcd> Sounds pretty decent
14:20:51 <bcotton> Sparks: do you have a wiki page for information ont his?
14:21:48 <Sparks> I do not
14:22:03 <Sparks> I don't have specific knowledge of the magic
14:22:28 <bcotton> would you mind starting one? we can fill in info as we get it
14:24:50 <bcotton> i'll take that as a "sure, i'll do exactly that" :-)
14:25:14 <bcotton> #action Sparks to start a wiki page for collecting information on publishing via Publican 3 and koji
14:25:19 <bcotton> anything else on this topic?
14:25:39 <pkovar> this will also need the RN RPM will have to change i guess?
14:25:58 <pkovar> like one lang per rpm instead of multi-lang RPM?
14:26:07 <bcotton> that's a good question.
14:26:46 <pkovar> running publican package with publican 3 produces one lang RPM, fwiw
14:27:05 <jjmcd> d-p-r doesn't use Publican's packaging because 1 lang per RPM means one menu entry per language
14:27:21 <pkovar> e.g. Fedora-System_Administrators_Guide-17-web-en-US-1-0.fc17.src.rpm
14:27:28 <jjmcd> d-p-r gives menu entry and doc depending on your selected lang
14:27:40 <Sparks> Sorry, I'm on every other channel this morning
14:27:55 <pkovar> d-p-r?
14:27:58 <Sparks> Yeah, I can try to start one although I think Rudi has all the answers so far
14:28:08 <jjmcd> The outfit that makes the RN RPM
14:29:13 <pkovar> i guess you could still make your own RPMs with different layout, but publican seems to default to one lang per RPM
14:29:34 <jjmcd> Yes, very un-Fedora-like
14:29:46 <pkovar> yes, it's different
14:29:59 <jjmcd> Good releases we have 40 languages for RNs, do you want 40 menu entries?
14:30:10 <pkovar> we would need our own doc category e.g. in gnome shell then...
14:30:32 <pkovar> ok, so i will send that mail :-)
14:30:54 <pkovar> to get more feedback on this particularly interesting topic :-)
14:31:06 <jjmcd> pkovar: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Getting_the_release_notes_to_Bodhi
14:31:28 <pkovar> ty
14:32:30 <bcotton> okay, anything else on this topic?
14:33:02 <bcotton> #topic Docs Leader election
14:33:12 <bcotton> #info randomuser is the only candidate
14:33:27 <bcotton> In the proud docs tradition of leaving one person out to dry...
14:33:32 * bcotton plays trumpet
14:33:45 <jjmcd> how nice
14:33:48 <bcotton> #info randomuser is your new glorious leader
14:33:53 <bcotton> #chair randomuser
14:33:53 <zodbot> Current chairs: Sparks bcotton randomuser
14:34:12 * Capesteve claps and waves
14:34:17 * randomuser cringes exaltedingly
14:34:17 <bcotton> randomuser: if you're still here, the rest of the meeting is yours :-)
14:34:25 <iambryan> Congrats randomuser
14:34:27 <chuckf> all hail randomuser
14:34:34 <randomuser> I shouldn't have said anything!
14:34:38 <joat> heh
14:34:48 <bcotton> randomuser: that'll teach you
14:34:52 <randomuser> lol
14:35:08 <jjmcd> pkovar, also https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/What_did_doc-publican-rpm_do
14:35:20 <randomuser> really, it is great to be part of a group of such competent people
14:35:25 <pkovar> jjmcd: ty
14:35:27 <randomuser> </speech>
14:36:16 <randomuser> so, funcon then?
14:36:20 <randomuser> #topic FUDcon NA
14:36:46 <randomuser> We're all green with envy for those who were able to attend, anything to share?
14:36:59 <Sparks> ASCIIDoc
14:37:17 <Sparks> That is all
14:37:56 <jjmcd> There was lots of streaming on G+, but I didn't get to watch a lot of it
14:38:12 <jjmcd> Was all day Saturday in training
14:40:00 <randomuser> nothing else?
14:40:32 <randomuser> #topic Outstanding BZ Tickets (5 minutes)
14:40:39 <randomuser> #link http://tinyurl.com/lbrq84
14:40:47 <Sparks> I'm going to write up something for ASCIIDoc but I think it has the potential to make life easier for new writers
14:41:09 <randomuser> oh, sorry Sparks
14:42:24 <Sparks> no worries
14:42:27 <randomuser> Any comments on bugs, then?
14:44:07 <Sparks> We don't have no stinking bugs
14:44:34 * randomuser shakes a fist
14:44:48 <randomuser> #topic Open floor discussion
14:45:21 <jjmcd> Fo we have anything in firewalld yet?
14:45:32 <jjmcd> s/Fo/Do
14:45:46 * zoglesby is awake
14:45:48 <randomuser> i've looked at it, and gotten confused :/
14:46:15 <jjmcd> Yeah, I still hadn't gotten my head around systemd
14:46:24 <Capesteve> I may be able to help with firewalld
14:46:28 <jjmcd> and there they go breaking my firewalls
14:47:21 <randomuser> Capesteve, i think even a basic high level overview would be great
14:48:01 <Capesteve> I have also been asked to do that for DNSSec
14:48:22 <jjmcd> A map for getting from iptables even better
14:48:33 <randomuser> jjmcd, +1
14:48:49 <Capesteve> today I am busy with chrony, hope to get back onto DNSsec this week
14:48:58 <jjmcd> Right now I seem to have to disable it and start iptables, but I'm sure that will go away at some point
14:49:26 <randomuser> Capesteve, are you making wiki pages, or working on a guide?
14:49:32 <Capesteve> firewalld is on my TODO list but ....
14:49:37 <Capesteve> I am working on a guide
14:49:45 <jjmcd> cool
14:49:58 <Capesteve> but at some point guide material can be duplicated to other guides
14:50:38 <randomuser> the system administrator's guide, i assume. Is it participation-friendly, or would we step on your toes at this point?
14:51:09 <Capesteve> ..I am waiting for a colleague to help with a draft doc on firewalld, I was just going to clean it up etc,
14:51:26 <randomuser> okay, cool
14:51:28 <Capesteve> but DNSSec I will do mostly myself
14:51:58 <Capesteve> randomuser: proof reading is always welcome
14:52:22 <Capesteve> expcially from someone who can actually try some of it out
14:52:44 <randomuser> I have a brand new fileserver here that could use some firewalld attention
14:52:52 <Capesteve> I think sparks is going to be my new friend
14:53:04 <Sparks> Capesteve: firewalld needs to go into the security guide
14:53:12 <randomuser> although adventures with `teamd` have brought it off the network
14:53:17 <Sparks> if you can write up a chapter for that I'll happily include it
14:53:18 <Capesteve> yes, understand
14:53:39 <Capesteve> teamd is also on my ToDO list
14:54:08 <randomuser> Capesteve, if I figure it out enough to write something up, i'll let you know
14:54:26 <Capesteve> OK, keep in touch then
14:55:06 <zoglesby> jsmith and I are going to be working on ARM guides if anyone wants to help
14:55:19 <zoglesby> and we also need to add an arm beat to the release notes
14:55:38 <randomuser> #info jsmith and zoglesby are working on ARM guides if anyone wants to help
14:55:38 <zoglesby> just fyi
14:55:47 <randomuser> zoglesby, I'll make that happen
14:56:10 <randomuser> #action randomuser to add ARM beat for release notes
14:56:25 <randomuser> add it to the wiki list of beats, i mean
14:56:54 <jjmcd> randomuser, +1
14:57:26 <jjmcd> zoglesby, If I had more cycles, got both a Pi and a Beagle here doing usefulwrk
14:58:09 <jjmcd> zoglesby, did you see my planet post the other day?
14:58:20 <zoglesby> jjmcd: no worries, if you do you do, if you don't I'll make jsmith do it all
14:58:36 <zoglesby> jjmcd: no I did not
14:59:18 <jjmcd> http://jjpmcd.livejournal.com/21226.html
15:00:26 <Capesteve> jjmcd: excellent
15:01:04 <randomuser> We're at the end of our block of time - shall we take this party to #fedora-docs ?
15:01:20 * Capesteve bye
15:01:25 <jjmcd> Sounds like a plan grand master
15:01:28 <randomuser> #endmeeting