22:02:19 <cwickert> #startmeeting FAmSCo 2012-03-28
22:02:19 <zodbot> Meeting started Wed Mar 28 22:02:19 2012 UTC.  The chair is cwickert. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
22:02:19 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
22:02:26 <cwickert> #meetingname famsco
22:02:26 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'famsco'
22:02:41 <cwickert> #chair kaio herlo zoltanh7211
22:02:41 <zodbot> Current chairs: cwickert herlo kaio zoltanh7211
22:02:59 <cwickert> more famsco members around?
22:03:20 <igorps> yep!
22:03:55 <kaio> hi
22:04:07 <cwickert> #chair igorps
22:04:07 <zodbot> Current chairs: cwickert herlo igorps kaio zoltanh7211
22:04:24 <cwickert> that is five and we have a quorum
22:04:32 * herlo is here
22:04:43 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: what about you?
22:04:58 <zoltanh7211> here
22:05:14 <cwickert> ok, then lets start
22:05:41 <cwickert> the agenda for todays meeting can be found at https://fedorahosted.org/famsco/report/9
22:05:47 <cwickert> lets start with the budget tickets
22:05:54 <cwickert> they are urgent and should be quick
22:06:04 <cwickert> so the order we use is https://fedorahosted.org/famsco/report/9?sort=component&asc=1&page=1
22:06:22 <cwickert> #opic Reimbursment request for FSF-OSSC event (12.11.2011)
22:06:31 <cwickert> #topic Reimbursment request for FSF-OSSC event (12.11.2011)
22:06:40 <cwickert> .fasco 235
22:06:49 <herlo> .famsco 235
22:06:49 <zodbot> https://fedorahosted.org/famsco/ticket/235
22:08:05 <herlo> seems liek we don't need to do anything?
22:08:12 <cwickert> hold on
22:08:19 <cwickert> page doesn't load for me
22:08:35 <herlo> okay
22:09:36 <zoltanh7211> I have filled the ticket, but lost my report, all I have is pictures about the event on my external drive
22:09:50 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: why did you attach the same receipt twice?
22:10:07 <cwickert> there are three attachments
22:10:15 <cwickert> and the first and the third are the same
22:10:18 <cwickert> or am I mistaken?
22:10:33 <herlo> #chair yn1v
22:10:33 <zodbot> Current chairs: cwickert herlo igorps kaio yn1v zoltanh7211
22:11:00 <zoltanh7211> Let me check
22:11:48 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: ok, my fault
22:11:56 <cwickert> browser got confused
22:12:02 <zoltanh7211> No, it's your fault
22:12:16 <zoltanh7211> All three are different
22:12:27 <cwickert> ok, but how does the math go?
22:12:47 <cwickert> usually when you file a ticket
22:13:00 <cwickert> you add a comment with a small calculation
22:13:18 <cwickert> with all the numbers as they are on the tickets
22:13:22 <cwickert> erm, attachments
22:13:34 <cwickert> and the last step is to convert this to EUR or USD
22:13:58 <zoltanh7211> ok - I will do it
22:14:11 <cwickert> #action zoltanh7211 to add numbers in ticket #235
22:14:29 <cwickert> everybody fine with approving this?
22:14:33 <cwickert> +1
22:14:50 <herlo> +1
22:14:54 <igorps> +1
22:15:03 <yn1v> +1
22:15:07 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: when you are done mark it "READ FOR PAYMENT" in the title
22:15:17 <zoltanh7211> ok +1
22:15:17 <cwickert> #agreed #235 is approved
22:15:33 <cwickert> #topic Fedora disks for first half of 2012 (Chile and Argentina)
22:15:41 <cwickert> .famsco 263
22:15:41 <zodbot> https://fedorahosted.org/famsco/ticket/263
22:16:03 <cwickert> no news for 2 weeks
22:16:11 <cwickert> yn1v: was this discussed in the LATAM meeting?
22:16:35 <yn1v> I wasn't able to attend latam meeting because of my work shift
22:16:49 <igorps> I can ping Antonio about this
22:16:53 <cwickert> please do
22:16:59 <igorps> ok
22:17:07 <cwickert> igorps: did you attend the last meeting?
22:17:12 <cwickert> LATAM I mean
22:17:23 <igorps> Unfortunately not either
22:17:58 <cwickert> #action igorps to make sure #263 gets discussed in the LATAM meeting
22:18:09 <cwickert> #undo
22:18:09 <zodbot> Removing item from minutes: <MeetBot.items.Action object at 0x25e0e850>
22:18:20 <cwickert> #action igorps to make sure #263 gets discussed in the LATAM meeting and get back to Antonio
22:18:41 <yn1v> probably best to ping Luis Bazan to take this into the meeting
22:18:48 <yn1v> latam meeting
22:19:05 <cwickert> yn1v: I don't care, just make sure it gets discussed
22:19:24 <igorps> I would like to ping Antonio to know if he's still interested
22:19:39 <igorps> I mean, F17 release is really near
22:19:40 <cwickert> how about pinging him in the ticket and adding Luis as CC?
22:19:51 <cwickert> igorps: agreed
22:20:00 <yn1v> yes, better
22:20:00 <cwickert> #topic Sponsorship request for Linuxwochen Vienna 2012 and LGM (2-6)
22:20:01 <igorps> cwickert, good idea
22:20:10 <cwickert> .famsco 267
22:20:10 <zodbot> https://fedorahosted.org/famsco/ticket/267
22:20:24 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: this looks like it needs more input form you
22:21:17 <zoltanh7211> We currently trying to find the appartment, and we would like to book by fedora as last year
22:21:22 <herlo> cwickert: seems like some of these could be removed from the meeting while we wait for documentation.
22:21:34 <cwickert> herlo: agreed
22:21:44 <zoltanh7211> I'll update them as we have the costs
22:21:47 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: last year I booked and I paid from my money
22:21:53 <zoltanh7211> oh
22:21:58 <cwickert> what is blocking you?
22:22:12 <zoltanh7211> money
22:22:15 <cwickert> AFAIK you have sorted out the apartment thing already
22:22:35 <cwickert> well, if you don't give us any real numbers, then it's hard to do something
22:22:51 <zoltanh7211> I did it
22:22:59 <zoltanh7211> I have modified the ticket
22:23:08 <zoltanh7211> and added the estimated amount
22:23:22 <cwickert> I don't see anything after my latest edit
22:23:37 <cwickert> please try to understand
22:23:45 <cwickert> we cannot just give you money
22:23:59 <herlo> nor do I
22:24:13 <herlo> zoltanh7211: which comment is the estimate in on that ticket?
22:24:33 <zoltanh7211> It seems we edited together the ticket
22:24:40 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: either you tell us what to book or you need to book yourself, pay for it and come up with a receipt sp we can reimburse you
22:24:43 <zoltanh7211> and my comment is earlier
22:24:45 <herlo> I think I see a number 440 EUR?
22:24:48 <zoltanh7211> yes
22:25:10 <cwickert> can you at least give us a link or anything?
22:25:25 <herlo> cwickert: there is also a link in that same comment
22:25:36 <zoltanh7211> https://fedorahosted.org/famsco/ticket/267#comment:4
22:25:45 <herlo> https://fedorahosted.org/famsco/ticket/267#comment:3
22:26:18 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: can you pay or not?
22:26:24 <herlo> zoltanh7211: how many people will be staying?
22:26:29 <zoltanh7211> I can't sorry
22:26:29 <cwickert> 4
22:26:44 <cwickert> then you need to tell us to book
22:26:51 <cwickert> or at least provide the details
22:26:59 <cwickert> but kital cannot just give you 400 EUR
22:27:29 <zoltanh7211> jreznik, sesivany, me, gergely
22:27:44 <cwickert> so, how do we move on here?
22:27:48 <herlo> also, is that the full cost? If you want travel or other things, like train passes, you may need to pay and get reimbursed
22:28:33 <herlo> cwickert: I think we can
22:28:41 <igorps> zoltanh7211, can't you get at least a document, like a pre-order?
22:28:41 <cwickert> how?
22:29:13 <herlo> cwickert: oh, I misread your previous statement
22:29:17 <zoltanh7211> I will update it soon as I received the appartment owner response
22:29:35 <zoltanh7211> We still awaiting the awailability
22:29:36 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: it says when you book you need to at least pay 30%. will you be able to do this?
22:30:09 <cwickert> can we please sort out these kind of things *before* filing a ticket?
22:30:26 <herlo> or at least before we bring them to a meeting
22:30:30 <zoltanh7211> yes, I'll do
22:30:51 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: can you book and pay the 30%, yes or no?
22:31:04 <zoltanh7211> yes - hopefully
22:31:13 <cwickert> I want a clear statement
22:31:27 <cwickert> if it causes you problems I can do it
22:31:34 <cwickert> but I need a clear statement from you
22:31:37 <zoltanh7211> not sure
22:31:56 <cwickert> do you want me to book, yes or no?
22:32:43 <zoltanh7211> please wait till I receive the owner response
22:33:01 <zoltanh7211> then yes
22:33:03 <cwickert> yes, but given the owner's response...
22:33:53 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: when do you think you will get it?
22:35:08 <zoltanh7211> Possibly tomorrow, or aftertomorrow
22:35:21 <cwickert> when did you ask?
22:35:26 <zoltanh7211> tonight
22:35:31 <cwickert> great :)
22:35:41 <cwickert> next time, please sort things out earlier
22:35:51 <zoltanh7211> my fault
22:36:06 <cwickert> #action zoltanh7211 to provide cwickert all details for booking the apartment in Vienna. that is names and dates etc.
22:36:35 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: it's not about who's fault it is, it's about getting shit done
22:36:52 <cwickert> no need to apologize, just go ahead and do stuff
22:37:03 <cwickert> #topic Sponsorship for dmaphy for Grazer LinuxTage 2012
22:37:11 <cwickert> .famsco 274
22:37:11 <zodbot> https://fedorahosted.org/famsco/ticket/274
22:37:27 <cwickert> as we have no alternative, I think we should approve this one
22:37:40 <cwickert> I still think it is bad to send somebody from Hamburg to Graz
22:37:57 <cwickert> but I was not able to find an Austrian or Swiss ambassador
22:38:02 <cwickert> even I mailed all of them
22:38:13 <cwickert> if Dominic wants to do it, so be it
22:38:36 <cwickert> and compared to last year, where Gerold did it, it's still cheap
22:38:40 <cwickert> only half of the costs
22:38:46 <cwickert> opinions?
22:39:17 <herlo> I am fine with it
22:39:23 <yn1v> me too
22:39:28 <zoltanh7211> me too
22:39:32 <igorps> +1
22:39:35 <cwickert> +1
22:39:36 <kaio> +1
22:40:16 <cwickert> #agreed: #274 is approved. maximum amount we are willing to spend is 500 EUR
22:40:28 <cwickert> #topic Transit flight from KL to Hong Kong to start Fedora contacts with HKLUG.
22:40:33 <cwickert> .famsco 277
22:40:33 <zodbot> https://fedorahosted.org/famsco/ticket/277
22:40:46 <cwickert> kaio: this is something that needs input from you I think
22:40:55 <cwickert> is there a wiki page in the meantime?
22:41:10 <kaio> cwickert: from me or from the organiser?
22:41:20 <cwickert> kaio: from you
22:41:28 <cwickert> in the fedora wiki
22:41:36 <kaio> I don't have it because I thought you want organiser's page.
22:41:42 <cwickert> no
22:41:47 <kaio> I can create one today.
22:41:48 <cwickert> you are requesting budget from Fedora
22:41:51 <kaio> yes
22:42:03 <cwickert> that's why we need this event in our wiki
22:42:12 <herlo> kaio: is that $200US?
22:42:19 <cwickert> #action kaio to create a wiki page for the event of the HKLUG
22:42:31 * herlo agrees with cwickert
22:42:32 <kaio> herlo: $2xx now, was $1xx in promo period.
22:42:50 <herlo> kaio: mostly curious about whether it was in US dollars, but that answers it I think
22:43:15 <kaio> okay
22:43:30 <cwickert> kaio: I still don't understand the route and how the costs are devided
22:43:52 <cwickert> normally you would go from where to KL?
22:44:06 <kaio> KL is a mid point.
22:44:34 <herlo> kaio: ahh, I see the price increase in USD.
22:44:51 <kaio> I go to KL (as airasia based in KL), then transit to HK immediately. And return to KL on THU.
22:44:54 <cwickert> kaio: I thought the mid point is HK?
22:44:54 <herlo> cwickert: seems like the layover is in KL to / from brisbane and hong kong
22:45:06 <kaio> prices are same but promo prices are all gone.
22:45:15 <herlo> cwickert: he's going to HK to give a presentation, from what I read
22:45:35 <kaio> presentation and get in touch with ambassadors in HK
22:45:53 <herlo> indeed
22:46:29 <kaio> as there had been no FAD happened there, I thought I am not creating an event wiki page
22:47:13 <cwickert> kaio: I am still having a hard time to understand all this
22:47:25 <cwickert> is herlo right? Brisbane - HK - KL?
22:47:31 <igorps> kaio, you can create wiki pages for every event, even the small ones. :)
22:47:48 <cwickert> We NEED wiki pages for every event
22:48:01 <cwickert> because that is what our statistic is based on
22:48:07 <kaio> Brisbane -> KL (transit) -> HK (Event) -> KL (FUDCon) -> Brisbane
22:48:45 <herlo> cwickert: btw, that's not quite what I said
22:48:50 <cwickert> last year's FAMSCo messed this up and kital was not able to make the statistic. nobody knows how many events we did - so please for the love of Christ - make wiki pages
22:49:08 <rbergeron> the love of FLYING SPAGHETTI MONSTER
22:49:13 * rbergeron shuts up
22:49:18 <herlo> lol
22:49:20 <rbergeron> (sorry)
22:49:27 <cwickert> rbergeron: sorry, I did not intent to discriminate anybody ;)
22:49:34 <cwickert> for the love of the HOLY COW
22:49:35 <cwickert> :)
22:49:36 <kaio> cwickert: I love wiki - FSM will bless me for the event page creation. XD
22:49:37 <cwickert> anyway
22:49:42 <herlo> rbergeron: we needed the tension breaker, had to be done
22:49:59 <rbergeron> herlo: glad i can be of use in some way
22:50:01 <rbergeron> ;)
22:50:05 * kaio loves meatball spaghetti so much.
22:50:25 <kaio> okay I should let you guys move on
22:50:29 <cwickert> kaio: ok, just to get this straight: it does not impact traveling to FUDcon
22:50:38 <kaio> long meeting is torturing us
22:50:43 <cwickert> right? you only want to do it because you are in KL anyway?
22:51:05 <cwickert> well, complain to the people who file tickets that are not ready ;)
22:51:17 <cwickert> and yes, this includes you ticket, too :P
22:51:28 <herlo> cwickert: it appears that the return trip has him stopping at fudcon, so it should be fine
22:51:43 <igorps> herlo, +1
22:51:53 <kaio> cwickert: Brisbane - KL is like one flight per week. transit to HK also save hotel costs.
22:51:56 <cwickert> given that it is say USD 200, is everybody fine with approving this?
22:52:04 <herlo> +1 approve it
22:52:09 <yn1v> +1
22:52:14 <zoltanh7211> +1
22:52:19 <cwickert> +1, under the condition that we get a decent wiki page
22:52:36 <igorps> +1, let's not complicate this more :)
22:52:54 <cwickert> #agreed #277 is approved, but we still need a wiki page for the event
22:53:14 <cwickert> #undo
22:53:14 <zodbot> Removing item from minutes: <MeetBot.items.Agreed object at 0x28ad31d0>
22:53:24 <cwickert> #agreed #277 is approved up to USD 200, but we still need a wiki page for the event
22:53:31 <cwickert> #action kaio to create a wiki page about the HKLUG event
22:53:48 <cwickert> ok, what should we do next?
22:54:00 <cwickert> we did all budget requests
22:54:08 <yn1v> Can I squeeze one more?
22:54:08 <cwickert> should we speak about FUDCon?
22:54:18 <cwickert> yn1v: have you filed it already?
22:54:21 <yn1v> https://fedorahosted.org/famsco/ticket/278
22:54:48 <yn1v> yes, but I don't know why it dosen't show up on meeting agenda
22:55:06 <cwickert> because it has 2 keywords
22:55:16 <herlo> yn1v: on 278, we need estimated costs, maybe?
22:55:24 <herlo> I think you can comma separate keywords
22:55:24 <cwickert> yn1v: for some reason it only works if "meeting" is the only keyword
22:55:34 <cwickert> herlo: they are comma separated
22:55:43 <yn1v> $496.62
22:55:53 <herlo> maybe it's space separated then
22:55:54 <cwickert> if anybody knows how to fix this in trac, he is welcome to help
22:56:04 <cwickert> herlo: doesn't work either
22:56:08 <cwickert> anyway
22:56:09 <herlo> hmm, k
22:56:19 <herlo> yn1v: please put that in the ticket? Or did I miss it?
22:56:32 <herlo> ahh, I missed it
22:56:33 <yn1v> it is in the field amount
22:56:51 <cwickert> looks good to me
22:56:53 <cwickert> +1
22:57:28 <herlo> +1
22:58:02 <igorps> We have numbers and proper information, so +1
22:58:06 <zoltanh7211> +1
22:58:33 <kaio> +1
22:58:35 <yn1v> should I vote +1 too ?
22:58:42 <cwickert> #agreed #278 is approved up to an amount of USD 500
22:58:50 <cwickert> yn1v: of course ;)
22:58:58 <herlo> always vote for your own :)
22:59:00 <cwickert> btw: do we need to approve this? I mean, can't the LATAM community handle this on their own?
22:59:24 <cwickert> herlo: how do you in NA deal with these requests? You fund it from your regional budget, right?
22:59:27 <yn1v> it is a budget issue
22:59:39 <igorps> FAmSCo usually approve budget issues
22:59:46 <herlo> I think it might be for larger budget information
22:59:57 * rbergeron thinks there seems to be confusion aobut where people approve things, and maybe it's just region by region
23:00:00 <herlo> cwickert: in NA, we just get our budget and use it as we see fit.
23:00:14 * cwickert agrees with Herlo
23:00:20 <herlo> If there is a question about how much is left, we approach spevack, or harish now
23:00:30 <yn1v> Latam has not given the budget to dispose of it :(
23:00:43 <igorps> yn1v, +1
23:00:45 <cwickert> yn1v: what do you mean?
23:00:49 <rbergeron> i think it's up to famsco to figure out how to divvy up the pot.
23:00:52 <herlo> yn1v: same question
23:00:54 <rbergeron> cwickert: they don't know how much they can spend.
23:01:04 <cwickert> herlo: how do you actually pay? credit card?
23:01:11 <herlo> cwickert: depends on the items
23:01:26 <cwickert> we really need to work on this...
23:01:28 <herlo> for most things it's cc, but for things like media and larger purchases it's by po
23:01:37 <yn1v> It has not been said that we can dispose of it
23:01:49 <igorps> This is the same issue that affects the ticket about FISL
23:02:02 <cwickert> yn1v: spevack always said this should be handled by the local communities
23:02:04 <herlo> cwickert: I agree. I think the real question is whether the annual budget has been set. I think it was said that we'll have what we had last year
23:02:06 <rbergeron> what do youneed to have said
23:02:11 <cwickert> igorps: which one?
23:02:23 <cwickert> herlo: yes, basically the same
23:02:31 <herlo> if that's the case, I say we divvy it up the same as last year for now and give approval to go ahead nd get stuff purchased
23:02:39 <herlo> let's not stand in the way of getting things done
23:02:44 <igorps> cwickert, #276
23:03:23 <herlo> cwickert: maybe we need a ticket on the agenda for next week to discuss budget allocations to regions?
23:03:39 <cwickert> herlo: yes, please file it
23:03:42 <herlo> should be short, base it upon demand from the previous year based upon the amount we got last year.
23:03:49 <herlo> cwickert: will do shortly
23:03:50 <cwickert> #action herlo to file a ticket on budget allocation
23:04:11 <rbergeron> herlo: add me to ticket, i will be happy to show up and make the blanket statement about how the money really does exist and to please spend.
23:04:12 <igorps> we can use the previous reports to base the division
23:04:14 <cwickert> alright
23:04:21 <cwickert> do we wand to move on?
23:04:30 <cwickert> shaiton_: are you there? still awake?
23:05:04 <cwickert> ok, it is really late
23:05:17 <cwickert> for me and zoltanh7211 it is 1 a.m.
23:05:25 <zoltanh7211> yeah
23:05:26 <herlo> rbergeron: k
23:05:29 <cwickert> and we have two important things to discuss
23:05:33 <cwickert> one is FUDCon
23:05:44 <cwickert> and the other are the new trademark guidelines
23:05:48 <herlo> cwickert: ticket filed, #279
23:05:52 <cwickert> what do you guys prefer?
23:05:58 <cwickert> herlo: cheater ;)
23:06:02 <herlo> lol
23:06:13 <cwickert> don't file tickets during the meeting, dare you!?
23:06:20 <herlo> um, I vote for tm guidelines
23:06:21 <zoltanh7211> lol
23:06:23 * shaiton_ on late, sorry
23:06:34 <shaiton_> (I was busy)
23:06:35 <herlo> cwickert: at least I am filing them
23:06:38 <herlo> :P
23:06:46 <cwickert> ok, now that we have both shaiton_ and zoltanh7211 here, lets discuss FUDCon
23:06:51 <herlo> ok, sounds good
23:06:53 <cwickert> everybody fine with this?
23:07:02 <cwickert> shaiton_: sorry I did not call for the meeting
23:07:09 <cwickert> but I was traveling all the time
23:07:15 <cwickert> an unplanned travel that was
23:07:17 <igorps> yes, we are a week late on discussing FUDCon
23:07:18 <shaiton_> no prob
23:07:34 <cwickert> igorps: because you did not meet last week when I was absent
23:07:45 <igorps> cwickert, exactly
23:07:46 <cwickert> shaiton_: can you quickly explain the situation with the venue?
23:08:03 <shaiton_> cwickert: ok, same as weeks ago:
23:08:16 <cwickert> #topic FUDCon bids 2012
23:08:28 <cwickert> .famsco 258
23:08:28 <zodbot> https://fedorahosted.org/famsco/ticket/258
23:08:45 <cwickert> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FUDCon:Bid_for_Paris_2012
23:08:55 <shaiton_> The first venue is shared with the OWF on the Saturday. With booked rooms and auditorium time slot.
23:09:59 <shaiton_> The second venue, on Sunday and Monday would be at Universciences, a huge building where we would have some rooms for us. And the auditorium on Monday (still not sure about Sunday)
23:10:09 <shaiton_> all is free of charge
23:10:34 <shaiton_> So the budget is only about accomodation and lunch
23:10:39 <shaiton_> eof. Questions
23:10:41 <shaiton_> ?
23:11:03 <cwickert> IIRC you said something could really get expensive?!
23:11:55 <shaiton_> cwickert: I said that the auditorium at Universciences could be impossible to book because it has some huge fees usually (they rent it for private meeting)
23:12:16 <shaiton_> but we are usual guests…
23:12:24 <cwickert> well, I don't think we need a big auditorium on Sunday and Monday
23:12:33 <cwickert> but we need one on Saturday for the keynote
23:12:47 <cwickert> when rbergeron is to deliver her "state of the union" talk
23:12:51 * herlo agrees with cwickert, It really won't make a difference. Saturday is in a different building then?
23:12:53 <shaiton_> ok great :). Cause on Saturday at the OWF it is really big
23:13:13 <shaiton_> herlo: yes.
23:13:22 <shaiton_> we won't be disturbed
23:13:33 <cwickert> how big are the rooms we have on sun and mon?
23:13:59 <cwickert> and how many of them?
23:14:04 <shaiton_> cwickert: like small classrooms. 3 are bigger
23:14:29 <shaiton_> cwickert: I'll find a map and add it to the wiki.
23:14:36 <igorps> shaiton_, how many classrooms in total?
23:15:11 <yn1v> small classroom is for how many chairs? 15? 20?
23:15:17 <shaiton_> igorps: 8-9
23:15:20 <shaiton_> (I need to check)
23:15:33 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: how many rooms would we have in Bud?
23:15:56 <cwickert> and would we have a big one for the keynote?
23:16:05 <igorps> sounds a reasonable amount to me, even if they are small
23:16:07 <zoltanh7211> one auditorium and at least 4 but possible 5 30-40 person capacty
23:16:28 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: ok, that should do
23:17:55 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: the preferred hotel is 89 EUR per night and person?
23:18:03 <cwickert> that is 178 for a double?
23:18:25 <zoltanh7211> no it's 89 for 2 person with breakfast
23:18:26 * rbergeron will be disturbed but that's pretty normal :)
23:18:30 * rbergeron grins
23:19:14 <zoltanh7211> and we have an 20 eur/room  option for more wider possibilities
23:19:22 <cwickert> ok, say 90
23:19:28 <zoltanh7211> the list is above
23:19:47 <cwickert> yeah, but you wrote "89 EUR/room/day person"
23:20:57 <zoltanh7211> ok fixing it
23:22:24 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: but something cannot be right there
23:22:33 <zoltanh7211> yes?
23:22:35 <cwickert> 6675 / 89 per night is 75
23:22:51 <cwickert> this means only one night?
23:23:16 * cwickert is trying to get a common base to compare hotel prices
23:23:39 <shaiton_> we both have prices for a twin per night
23:23:51 <cwickert> yes, but I want the totalsa
23:25:13 <cwickert> shaiton_: and I don't get your math either ;)
23:25:21 <shaiton_> ? :)
23:25:37 <cwickert> in the list you have something with 7200 EUR
23:25:43 <cwickert> but the text says 9141
23:25:55 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: ?!
23:26:09 <zoltanh7211> yes, the calculation is for one night with 75 room
23:26:26 <shaiton_> yes cwickert "could increase if the prefered hostel is full…" I got many quotes
23:26:36 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: but you know that FUDCon takes a little longer? ;)
23:26:44 <zoltanh7211> yes of couse
23:26:48 <zoltanh7211> course
23:27:01 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: can you please do 30 double rooms? not everybody is sponsored
23:27:12 <zoltanh7211> yes
23:27:23 <cwickert> shaiton_: so which one is the 7200?
23:27:58 <shaiton_> cwickert: 81€/twin/night for 30 twins (60 people) for 3 nights if I remember
23:28:20 <cwickert> but this hotel does not show up on the list anywhere, correct?
23:28:22 <shaiton_> which is 12150€ for 3 nights and 100 guys.
23:28:28 <shaiton_> it is…
23:28:42 <shaiton_> "Accomodation (7290€ for 30 twins for 3 nights"
23:29:08 <cwickert> ah, ok
23:29:19 <cwickert> alright
23:29:32 <cwickert> any more questions to either shaiton_ or zoltanh7211?
23:29:40 <herlo> nope
23:29:43 <cwickert> are you guys still awake?
23:29:47 <zoltanh7211> yes
23:29:55 <herlo> it's only 4:30pm here
23:29:56 <igorps> Yes :)
23:29:57 <yn1v> no questions, yes awake
23:29:57 <herlo> :P
23:30:01 <cwickert> ok, cool
23:30:02 <shaiton_> ;)
23:30:10 <cwickert> does anybody have a preference?
23:30:16 <herlo> yes
23:30:21 <zoltanh7211> my calculation is for 3 days and with 30 twins are 8010
23:30:22 * cwickert is having a hard time to decide
23:30:39 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: we need 4 nights, but anyway
23:30:48 <cwickert> doesn't really matter now
23:31:04 <cwickert> herlo: shoot
23:31:19 <herlo> I've said this before, but it's just based on personal preference
23:31:33 <cwickert> shaiton_: oh, you just calculated 3 nights, too
23:31:39 <shaiton_> yes
23:32:04 <herlo> Budapest would be better for me. There is, I guess, one thing that makes it better than paris though, no combined event. shaiton_ has done a good job of showing that it probably won't bother FUDCon too much
23:32:32 <igorps> I like the way the Paris bid has been planned. Only with one day together with OWL and the other as a standalone event. I think this could be a valuable experience.
23:32:40 <shaiton_> we should define that in the fudcon fid process page (defining quotes for 100 peoples and 4 nights)
23:33:29 <zoltanh7211> yes define quotes
23:33:43 <zoltanh7211> to get some comparing base
23:33:48 <cwickert> well, I don't think we need to worry about the costs so much now
23:34:00 <shaiton_> no, it's just for further bids
23:34:11 <shaiton_> (no, I don't plan anymore)
23:34:15 <yn1v> I was favoring first Budapest for conflicting event, but now I am clear that it is not an issue. I am incline for Paris
23:34:26 <cwickert> Budapest may be cheaper, but if we get the venue for free at Paris, both are nearly the same
23:34:43 <cwickert> I am really having a hard time to decide
23:35:10 <cwickert> there is one thing I dislike about Paris: the overlap with OWF
23:35:33 <igorps> Worth to say that both are really good bids and we appreciate all the effort of the proposers
23:35:55 <cwickert> and on the other hand there is one thing I love about Budapest: that its next to Brno and all the skilled RH folks can just come by bus
23:36:01 <shaiton_> yes igorps. I would have hard time to decide also ;)
23:36:04 <cwickert> this will save us a ton of money
23:36:07 <zoltanh7211> I think we could offer new experiences
23:36:28 <zoltanh7211> and lot of people want to help us at Corvin university
23:36:58 <igorps> Have Paris hosted a FUDCon before?
23:37:49 <cwickert> not that I know of
23:37:54 <cwickert> shaiton_: have you?
23:38:05 <shaiton_> igorps: nope. never
23:38:28 <shaiton_> always wanted but never proposed any bid
23:38:35 <igorps> So neither have Budapest, right zoltanh7211?
23:38:48 <cwickert> so given the 2 reasons I just outlined, I really should be for Budapest
23:38:48 <zoltanh7211> never before
23:38:57 <cwickert> but frankly speaking I am not quite convinced
23:39:32 <shaiton_> saving ton of money is not really defined. We also have *MANY* skilled devels here
23:39:37 * herlo needs to head out
23:39:42 <shaiton_> that never joined any FUDCons
23:39:55 <cwickert> shaiton_: why not?
23:40:18 <shaiton_> because they can't leave with there job
23:40:22 <shaiton_> (only one reason)
23:40:34 <shaiton_> s/there/their
23:40:48 <cwickert> well, FUDCon is on a weekend, where is the problem?
23:41:31 <shaiton_> yes, because you can't leave on friday night and come back on sunday
23:41:31 <igorps> Actually traveling takes more than the event days frequently
23:41:34 <shaiton_> it's too short
23:41:39 <shaiton_> yes.
23:41:51 <igorps> This is a tough decision but I would go for Paris
23:42:07 <zoltanh7211> I would like to say that opening new territoires isn't a bad thing
23:42:22 <shaiton_> goto russia :)
23:42:23 <cwickert> shaiton_: but if they are really into Fedora, why didn't they attend a FUDCon? I don't recall any French folks on a FUDCon
23:42:26 <zoltanh7211> and I could offer supporting compnies
23:42:31 <zoltanh7211> companies
23:42:48 <cwickert> shaiton_: I think Xavier was the only French who has ever attended a NA FUDCon
23:43:04 <cwickert> we even had more people from Czech or from Hungary there
23:43:10 <shaiton_> cwickert: there was me at least. also pingou. also nchauvet (kwizart) also many others. but not all that should do.
23:43:22 <shaiton_> cwickert: probably.
23:43:27 <cwickert> shaiton_: you mean Milan, right?
23:43:35 <cwickert> yes, there were 3 or 4 of you
23:43:36 <shaiton_> cwickert: milan and zurich
23:43:46 <cwickert> I mean, I know the French community is big
23:43:59 <cwickert> but I wonder why the rest of EMEA hardly ever sees them
23:44:08 <shaiton_> cwickert: I will speak for myself, but for me attending FUDCon is expensive.
23:44:08 <cwickert> I mean, you are the only one to attend our meetings
23:44:14 <shaiton_> I pay all by myself…
23:44:20 <shaiton_> I am not the only one
23:44:24 * yn1v has to leave in 15 minutes
23:44:28 <cwickert> and the rest of the French guys are doing their French meetings
23:44:43 <zoltanh7211> only
23:45:02 <shaiton_> cwickert: to really. In the french meeting we are 5-9. all are only in devel. or so on.
23:45:16 <shaiton_> s/to/not/
23:45:21 <cwickert> I am not sure if we can make a final decision today. I am feeling very uncomfortable and would like to discuss this next Wednesday with the EMEA community first
23:45:21 * shaiton_ need to sleep also ;)
23:45:35 <shaiton_> cwickert: mailing list?
23:45:37 <cwickert> ok, lets make a quick vote
23:45:43 <cwickert> but lets not make this final
23:46:04 <cwickert> I really feel the EMEA community needs to discuss this
23:46:12 <cwickert> and I don't know if this has happened last week
23:46:17 * cwickert looks for the meeting log
23:46:18 <shaiton_> waiting for a meeting let us wait for a week. We always postpone.
23:46:41 <igorps_> Isn't better to get the feedback first and then cast votes?
23:48:03 <cwickert> shaiton_: please give us one more week
23:48:14 <cwickert> nothing has happened last week
23:48:26 <cwickert> I cannot change it, I was traveling
23:48:35 <shaiton_> cwickert: sure. I only said that it should be more efficient to discuss on the mailing list than waiting to start at next meeting
23:49:04 <cwickert> shaiton_: ok, which one do you propose?
23:49:18 <shaiton_> which mailing list? hum.
23:49:32 <cwickert> ambassadors or fudcon-planing?
23:49:40 <cwickert> lets go with ambassadors
23:49:49 <cwickert> I will write a mail about this
23:49:49 <shaiton_> yes. better.
23:49:53 <zoltanh7211> agree
23:49:54 <shaiton_> thanks
23:50:04 <igorps_> Please post the meeting logs on the ticket or a link to the mailing list thread
23:50:10 <cwickert> #action cwickert to write a mail about FUDCon to ambassadors list
23:50:34 <cwickert> igorps_: I think the meeting logs are not relevant, everything is in the wiki
23:50:50 <cwickert> and I want people to make their own decision and not have them take over ours
23:51:13 <igorps_> cwickert, the feedback they provide might be important for us to base our votes
23:51:14 <cwickert> ok, lets leave it at this
23:51:20 <cwickert> igorps_: right
23:51:29 <cwickert> ok, one last thing for today
23:51:52 <cwickert> #topic New trademark guidelines and their impact on the ambassadors swag production
23:51:59 <cwickert> .famsco 264
23:51:59 <zodbot> https://fedorahosted.org/famsco/ticket/264
23:52:13 <cwickert> there was some progress
23:52:15 <cwickert> finally!
23:52:29 <cwickert> as you can see at https://fedoraproject.org/w/index.php?title=User%3APchestek%2FTMGuidelinesDraft&action=historysubmit&diff=279136&oldid=268651 some changes were made to the guidelines
23:52:43 <cwickert> I want all FAmSCo members to read that draft by next week
23:52:51 <zoltanh7211> ok
23:52:52 <cwickert> and add their questions and concerns to the ticket
23:53:05 <cwickert> I am not quite happy with it, but at least it's getting better
23:53:35 <igorps> Great. I'll read it for next meeting.
23:53:57 <cwickert> #action all FAmSco members to read https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Pchestek/TMGuidelinesDraft and add their questions and concerns at https://fedorahosted.org/famsco/ticket/264 by next week
23:54:03 <cwickert> ok, I think that's it
23:54:13 <cwickert> #topic Open Floor
23:54:31 * cwickert will close the meeting in 3 minutes if there are no further questions
23:56:41 <cwickert> #endmeeting