20:02:06 <cwickert> #startmeeting EMEA ambassadors meeting 20:02:06 <zodbot> Meeting started Wed Mar 23 20:02:06 2011 UTC. The chair is cwickert. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 20:02:06 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic. 20:03:04 <liknus> #meetingname emea_ambassadors 20:03:04 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'emea_ambassadors' 20:03:15 <cwickert> liknus: ppft 20:03:20 <cwickert> welcome everybody to the EMEA ambassadors meeting 20:03:22 <liknus> cwickert: :) 20:03:26 <jsmith> Thanks cwickert 20:03:34 <cwickert> #chair liknus 20:03:34 <zodbot> Current chairs: cwickert liknus 20:03:53 <cwickert> #topic roll call 20:03:57 <GeroldKa> .fas geroldka 20:03:58 <zodbot> GeroldKa: geroldka 'Gerold Kassube' <gerold@lugd.org> 20:04:00 <liknus> .fas ppapadeas 20:04:02 <zodbot> liknus: ppapadeas 'Papadeas Pierros' <ppapadeas@gmail.com> 20:04:03 <cwickert> Please say your name so we know you are here 20:04:03 <jsmith> .fas jsmith 20:04:06 <zodbot> jsmith: jsmith 'Jared Smith' <jsmith.fedora@gmail.com> - mikejsmith11 'Mike J. Smith ' <mikejsmith11@gmail.com> 20:04:09 <cwickert> .fas cwickert 20:04:10 <zodbot> cwickert: cwickert 'Christoph Wickert' <christoph.wickert@googlemail.com> 20:04:15 <ardian> .fas ardian 20:04:17 <zodbot> ardian: ardian 'Ardian Haxha' <ardian.haxha@gmail.com> - gunma 'Mardian Gunawan' <gunawanmardian@gmail.com> - guardian 'Stephan Kürpick' <guard@gmx.net> - rmsc 'Renato Caldas' <seventhguardian@gmail.com> - dansguardian 'Dansguardian' <dansguardian@linuxmail.org> 20:04:19 <dmaphy> .fas dmaphy 20:04:19 <zoltanh7211> .fas zoltanh721 20:04:21 <zodbot> dmaphy: dmaphy 'Dominic Hopf' <dmaphy@gmail.com> 20:04:25 <zodbot> zoltanh7211: zoltanh721 'Hoppár Zoltán' <hopparz@gmail.com> 20:04:36 <gentth> .fas gentth 20:04:36 <zodbot> gentth: gent 'Gent Thaci' <gentthaqi@gmail.com> 20:05:05 <t2hot> .fas t2hot 20:05:06 <zodbot> t2hot: twohot 'Onyeibo Oku' <twohotis@gmail.com> 20:05:23 <cwickert> ok, thanks everybody for coming 20:05:40 <cwickert> the agenda for todays meeting is at https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Meeting:EMEA_Ambassadors_2011-03-23 20:06:16 <cwickert> I#d like to remind everybody of the meeting protocol, see https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/IRCHowTo#Protocol 20:06:30 <cwickert> #topic Announcements 20:06:44 <cwickert> ok, here is a quick update on the EMEA media distribution 20:06:54 <cwickert> we had a total of 3118 media 20:07:02 <cwickert> which were delivered last week 20:07:21 <cwickert> we have managed to distribute most of the media 20:07:34 <GeroldKa> ?! 20:07:40 <cwickert> the packages are either on their way or already packaged waiting to be shipped 20:07:45 <cwickert> hold on, GeroldKa 20:07:59 <cwickert> in fact we are running out of media a little 20:08:09 <cwickert> but I will make sure everybody gets what they need 20:08:27 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: you can only get 400 you asked for but not 600 20:08:34 <cwickert> t2hot: you will get 400 as well 20:08:49 <cwickert> liknus: 400 are estimated for Greece too 20:09:10 <cwickert> all upcoming events till mid april have media shipped 20:09:11 <liknus> ok nice :) 20:09:37 <cwickert> and I like to keep 300 media with me for Linuxtag because I guess F15 will be delayed 20:09:45 <cwickert> ok, time for questions 20:09:51 <zoltanh7211> thank you chris 20:09:52 <cwickert> GeroldKa: your turn 20:09:59 <GeroldKa> just a thought, this time very late providing (producing) and shortly before the next release. Imho we need Medias shortly AFTER the release and not shortly before next release; but as I said just my opinion 20:10:02 <GeroldKa> eof 20:10:46 <cwickert> GeroldKa: did you follow the process? 20:10:57 <GeroldKa> what do you mean? 20:11:11 <cwickert> are you aware of the difficulties we had? 20:11:22 <GeroldKa> yes, I am 20:12:25 <cwickert> ok, we all agree on that, so what is the use in stating the obvious here? 20:12:25 <GeroldKa> my idea is in that case 20:12:25 <cwickert> as long as the people in charge are not here 20:12:26 <GeroldKa> as I said 20:12:26 <GeroldKa> it was my personal opinion 20:12:26 <GeroldKa> and i want to say that 20:12:26 <cwickert> ok, what is your idea 20:12:26 <cwickert> ? 20:12:26 <GeroldKa> that's all 20:12:26 <GeroldKa> from my POV 20:12:26 <GeroldKa> I would have another process in generell 20:12:31 <cwickert> tell us more 20:12:46 <GeroldKa> I guess Media are still important everywhere 20:13:01 <biertie> cwickert: is mine on it's way or not? because I have an event this weekend :) 20:13:03 <GeroldKa> not the media itself, but the "professional" look and production 20:13:27 <GeroldKa> we must have the media at the same time, release is announced 20:13:32 <GeroldKa> so maybe it makes sense 20:13:36 <biertie> GeroldKa: +! 20:13:38 <biertie> 1 20:13:38 <cwickert> biertie: please follow the meeting protocol and the guidelines for events, I'll get back to you in a minute 20:13:53 <GeroldKa> to maybe reschedule 20:13:59 <GeroldKa> first media 20:14:04 <GeroldKa> and then announce release 20:14:17 <GeroldKa> and give public FTP free for everyone 20:14:21 <t2hot> ! 20:14:35 <GeroldKa> so that you can hand out media to that persons who NEED really a media 20:14:40 <cwickert> GeroldKa: you are aware of the fact that this will slow down development? 20:14:43 <GeroldKa> that's my idea in short 20:14:52 <GeroldKa> why? 20:14:55 <t2hot> ?? 20:15:03 <cwickert> the development cycle is 26 weeks 20:15:04 <GeroldKa> nothing is slowed down in that case 20:15:19 <cwickert> media production takes at least 9 days 20:15:29 <cwickert> with shipping two weeks 20:15:54 <cwickert> this means the ISOs must be ready 2 weeks before Fedora can be released 20:16:05 <cwickert> and during this time nothing can happen 20:16:12 <cwickert> not even bugfixes 20:16:23 <GeroldKa> why? 20:16:29 <GeroldKa> if I install it now 20:16:40 <GeroldKa> I have to download tons of updates 20:16:47 <GeroldKa> why not the same here? 20:16:55 * t2hot wonders why we're having this discussion 20:16:58 <cwickert> right, and with the delay of 2 weeks it will even be more updates 20:17:01 <GeroldKa> RC1 will be produced and shiped out 20:17:07 <liknus> GeroldKa: I think that this is not a meeting to discuss releng 20:17:46 <GeroldKa> I'm not discussing releng 20:17:47 <cwickert> ok, lets take a look at the schedule 20:17:48 <GeroldKa> I'm start discussing processes to get SWAG and/or media 20:17:52 <GeroldKa> sorry 20:17:55 <GeroldKa> eof 20:17:55 <cwickert> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Schedule 20:18:09 <cwickert> the final RC is composed on May 3rd 20:18:14 <cwickert> then it is tested 20:18:23 <cwickert> and then we have a go/nogo meeting 20:18:35 <cwickert> only after this has happened we know the release date 20:18:45 <cwickert> and if we can use the ISOs or not 20:18:52 <cwickert> understood? 20:19:24 <cwickert> we also need to prepare for release, this means mirrors must get populated and so on 20:19:29 <cwickert> this takes another 3 days 20:19:42 <GeroldKa> there is nothing more to add from my side; thanks 20:20:07 <cwickert> so from May 3rd till release on 17th is effectively only 5 days or something 20:20:16 <cwickert> not enough to produce media 20:20:44 <cwickert> GeroldKa: I agree we need to start media production earlier, for example with the artwork 20:20:48 <inode0> ! 20:20:55 <cwickert> but we cannot delay a release just because of the media 20:21:08 <cwickert> ok, t2hot, then inode0 20:21:21 <t2hot> nothing much to add 20:21:27 <cwickert> ok, inode0 20:21:40 <t2hot> not done sir 20:21:44 <cwickert> sorry 20:21:49 <inode0> we can get the images to the vendor before release if we are really well prepared to get the media as soon as possible 20:22:12 <inode0> that requires cooperation on several levels 20:22:15 <inode0> eof 20:22:53 * t2hot is now done ...eof 20:23:03 <cwickert> ok 20:23:09 <cwickert> so lets summarize 20:23:19 <cwickert> we all agree we'd like the media ASAP 20:23:36 <cwickert> we can start with artwork and try to get the images from rel-eng 20:23:50 <cwickert> but we cannot delay a release for the media 20:23:55 <cwickert> does everybody agree? 20:23:59 <inode0> +1 20:24:03 <zoltanh7211> +1 20:24:04 <ardian> +1 20:24:06 <liknus> before that we also need budget approval and tickets in RH EMEA ready 20:24:06 <GeroldKa> -1 20:24:12 <liknus> +1 for me on the rest 20:24:18 <jsmith> +1 from me 20:24:23 <jsmith> ! 20:24:23 <dmaphy> +1 20:24:39 <gentth> +1 20:24:39 <cwickert> liknus: yes, max said he will approve it earlier 20:24:46 <cwickert> jsmith please 20:24:47 <liknus> cwickert: nice 20:25:00 <jsmith> If I have to drive to Raleigh and beat Max over the head, I'll make sure we have the PO in place for media before GA 20:25:06 <jsmith> eof 20:25:29 <cwickert> jsmith: thanks for the offer, but I guess nobody wants max to be beaten 20:25:37 <liknus> jsmith: well before GA 20:25:42 <liknus> we have a schedule for that 20:26:08 <GeroldKa> ! 20:26:17 <cwickert> GeroldKa: go ahead 20:26:39 <GeroldKa> sometimes it makes sense to rethink about a process or a schedule if it's a proper way 20:26:56 <GeroldKa> eof and nothing more from myself to that issue 20:27:04 <jsmith> ! 20:27:07 <t2hot> ! 20:27:32 <cwickert> GeroldKa: so what is your proposal? you want the release to wait for a call from mediabit in munich? what about the other regions? 20:28:33 <cwickert> ok, jsmith, then t2hot 20:28:35 <GeroldKa> Christoph, to be honest to everybody and the meeting 20:28:45 <GeroldKa> let's maybe discuss this later in open floor 20:28:50 <cwickert> ok, agreed 20:28:59 <GeroldKa> and go forward with the 2important scheduled" issues 20:29:15 <jsmith> Just a heads up -- FESCo approved an exception for NM 0.9 today, which means the schedule will slip at least one more week. 20:29:27 <jsmith> Please keep that in mind as we're discussing schedules 20:29:28 <jsmith> eof 20:29:44 <cwickert> jsmith: thanks for the info, this means that F15 will not be ready for LinuxTag Berlin 20:30:03 <cwickert> #info F15 will slip one more week, this means that F15 will not be ready for LinuxTag Berlin 20:30:08 <jsmith> cwickert: Unfortuantely, that's correct :-( 20:30:11 * jsmith is not very happy about it 20:30:34 <cwickert> #agreed media production needs to start earlier and we'll try to get the images from rel-eng, but we cannot hold up the release until media are ready 20:30:45 <cwickert> t2hot: you also on media? otherwise we go on... 20:31:19 <t2hot> I wait for Geroldka case @ open floor eof 20:31:25 <cwickert> ok 20:31:33 <cwickert> #topic F15 media production 20:31:42 <cwickert> so we should plan early for F15 20:31:56 <cwickert> I hope we'll have the multi-desktop DVD for F15 20:32:02 <liknus> we should already push POC of media 20:32:12 <cwickert> liknus: ? 20:32:32 <liknus> http://rbergero.fedorapeople.org/schedules/f-15/f-15-ambassadors-tasks.html 20:32:50 <liknus> We need to push 3 things until next week 20:32:52 <cwickert> can we follow the meeting agenda? 20:33:04 <liknus> cwickert: it is in the topic 20:33:19 <cwickert> well, schedule is another topic on the agenda 20:33:45 <liknus> F15 media is controlled by it cwickert :) 20:33:57 <cwickert> liknus: what exactly do you mean by "POC for media"? 20:34:49 <liknus> production coordinator 20:34:52 <liknus> media wrangler 20:34:53 <cwickert> I see 20:34:59 <cwickert> ok 20:35:23 <cwickert> does anybody volunteer for doing the media wrangler? otherwise I'll do it for a second time 20:36:11 <cwickert> ok, let me put it different 20:36:17 <liknus> you were excellent on that :) I am +1 for cwickert :) 20:36:21 <cwickert> is everybody happy with me as the media wrangler? 20:36:26 * t2hot ... a rhetoric, heheh 20:36:26 <gentth> +1 20:36:35 <cwickert> t2hot: ;) 20:36:36 <zoltanh7211> cwickert: ++++1 20:36:39 <ardian> ++1 20:36:49 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: ok, you get 500 media now ;) 20:36:50 <GeroldKa> yes, you all get again one who "get shit done" :-) 20:37:13 <cwickert> #agreed cwickert will be the F15 media wrangler 20:37:19 <t2hot> what's your problem GeroldKa??? 20:37:26 <cwickert> ok, back to the actual media production 20:38:03 <zoltanh7211> ! 20:38:03 <cwickert> we need to vote on quantities of media so I can request the budget from FAmSCo 20:38:11 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: go ahead 20:38:40 <zoltanh7211> just a suggestion: not only media wrangler - else swag too if possible 20:39:18 <GeroldKa> rofl 20:39:28 <GeroldKa> but also +1 20:39:37 <GeroldKa> one wrangler to fit all 20:39:45 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: this will become a part time job then 20:39:52 <cwickert> but I'll do what I can 20:39:56 <cwickert> back to the toic 20:39:59 <cwickert> topic 20:40:17 <cwickert> for F14 we have 3000 media 20:40:39 * t2hot thinks cwickert is taking on too much 20:40:51 <cwickert> and paid ~ 2376 EUR 20:41:00 * cwickert diggs the numbers for F13 20:41:19 <jlaska> win10 20:41:24 <jlaska> oops :( 20:41:32 <cwickert> for F13 we paid 3857 EUR 20:41:58 <zoltanh7211> ! 20:42:09 <cwickert> for 5000 media 20:42:14 <cwickert> ok, these are the numbers 20:42:32 <cwickert> we generally have a budget of up to 5000 EUR 20:42:42 <cwickert> and this time we want to try something new 20:42:51 <cwickert> the multi-desktop dual arch DVD 20:43:06 <cwickert> in fact we wanted to try this already for F14, but it was blocked by the board 20:43:22 <cwickert> if we do it, we only need ONE media to rule them all 20:43:26 <cwickert> and can save money 20:44:14 <cwickert> I don't have the quotes yet 20:44:32 <cwickert> but I wanted to ask you if we want to do try the multi desktop media a 2nd time 20:44:41 <GeroldKa> ? 20:44:50 <t2hot> +1 20:44:52 <cwickert> zoltanh7211, then GeroldKa 20:45:21 <gentth> +1 20:45:36 <zoltanh7211> so the the money what we have left - we will have multi desktop DVD's? 20:45:50 <ardian> +1 20:46:12 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: there is no money left, we cannot use money from one budget for something else 20:46:28 <cwickert> because we only have one purchase order 20:46:50 <zoltanh7211> ok, eof 20:46:51 <cwickert> and this was last year because the financial year ends Feb 28th 20:47:00 <cwickert> GeroldKa: your turn 20:47:05 <GeroldKa> can we verify that every people who will get that media will be able to use it? Or what is the intension for that multi-desktop dual arch DvD? Is that the need and request of our target audience? Sorry if it looks like I have a bad day and request everything?! 20:47:24 <GeroldKa> and before you start asking; yes I had a very bad day 8at work) :-P 20:47:50 <cwickert> GeroldKa: it's not a problem that you ask, but we discussed all these things already back in october last year 20:47:56 <cwickert> long story short 20:48:08 <cwickert> we don't need to ship different media through EMEA 20:48:18 <cwickert> we don't need to worry about the architecture 20:48:23 <cwickert> we save money 20:48:31 <cwickert> we do something new and innovative 20:49:17 <dmaphy> i like this idea 20:49:25 <cwickert> GeroldKa: imagine you are in Graz and you only have GNOME left but people want KDE. what do you do? 20:49:38 <t2hot> +1 again (are we still first in this area?) 20:49:55 <dmaphy> as long the media will work with "usual" dvd-rom drives 20:50:48 <cwickert> dmaphy: there are a few disc creators that cannot burn Dual Layer, but practically every DVD drive can read them 20:51:10 <cwickert> but we are not talking about burning media here, we are distributing them 20:51:12 <dmaphy> well.. then, why not? :) 20:51:15 <cwickert> ok 20:51:29 <cwickert> if soembody still has questions, please read 20:51:31 <cwickert> #lin http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Cwickert/MultiDesktopDVD 20:51:38 <cwickert> #link http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Cwickert/MultiDesktopDVD 20:51:53 * cwickert gives people 2 minutes to read.... 20:51:56 <cwickert> then we vote 20:53:03 <t2hot> my browser is still trying to open it .... 2mins unrealistic :) 20:54:07 <cwickert> ok, question number one: do we want to try the dual layer dvd? 20:54:13 <cwickert> and question number 2 20:54:26 <cwickert> do we still want install dvds 20:54:37 <cwickert> I think yes, but first lets vote on one 20:54:48 <cwickert> should we do the multi desktop spin? 20:54:53 <zoltanh7211> +1 20:54:55 <underscores> +1 20:54:56 <dmaphy> +1 20:54:58 <cwickert> +1 (obviously) 20:55:04 <gentth> +1 20:55:06 <ardian> +1 for the first question 20:55:10 <jsmith> +1 20:55:25 <liknus> +1 20:55:40 <cwickert> #agreed we want the Multi-Desktop Spin for F15 20:56:06 <cwickert> ok, do we still want traditional install DVDs or only livemedia? 20:56:11 <cwickert> +1 for install DVDs 20:56:17 <jsmith> +1 for install DVDs 20:56:23 <gentth> +1 for install DVDs 20:56:37 <cwickert> because the livemedia have some problems, they don't allow custom installs 20:56:38 <jsmith> (as the multi-desktop DVD contains essentially live images) 20:56:40 <liknus> +1 for DVD installs 20:56:47 <dmaphy> +1 20:56:48 <ardian> +1 for install DVDs 20:56:49 <GeroldKa> +1 for install DvDs 20:56:54 <zoltanh7211> +1 but bit lower amount 20:57:13 <cwickert> #agreed we also want traditional install DVDs and not only the livemedia 20:57:25 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: ok, good point 20:57:38 <cwickert> media are usually made in batches of 1000 20:58:18 <cwickert> how about 1000 install DVD 32 bit, 1000 install DVD 64 bit and the rest is multi-desktop spins, say 3000 20:58:35 <ardian> sounds good 20:58:38 <underscores> sounds good to me 20:58:42 <cwickert> just a rough guess, I still need to get the exact numbers 20:59:16 <gentth> exact number for the another 1000 multi-desktop spins!? 20:59:41 <cwickert> gentth: I suggested 3000, but this is open to discussion 20:59:48 <gentth> ok 20:59:55 <zoltanh7211> +1 if we'll know the correct amount, but 1:1:3 sounds great 20:59:55 <gentth> sounds good to me 21:00:01 <cwickert> #action cwickert to get quotes for 1000 install media in 32 and 64 bit and the Multi-Desktop Spin from mediabit company 21:00:25 <cwickert> perhaps we can also combine the install DVDs, 32 and 64 bit on one disc 21:00:50 <zoltanh7211> possibly 21:00:52 <cwickert> because we have an exiting new feature: isolinux will automatically pick the right arch depending on your computer 21:00:53 <t2hot> sounds good 21:01:11 <cwickert> and you can still select 32 or 64 manually 21:01:13 <GeroldKa> how much is the price for such a media? 21:01:21 <GeroldKa> do you have any glue? 21:01:53 * t2hot ... exiting then glue ... funny day 21:01:54 <cwickert> GeroldKa: slightly higher than for the normal DVD, but because of the larger number, it is roughly the same 21:02:15 <cwickert> I'll get the quotes and we discuss the details next week, ok? 21:02:59 <cwickert> ok, on we go 21:03:12 <cwickert> #topic Ambassadors schedule 21:03:16 <cwickert> #link http://rbergero.fedorapeople.org/schedules/f-15/f-15-ambassadors-tasks.html 21:03:33 <cwickert> as you can see we are just in time 21:03:46 <cwickert> "Regional Team Meetings and Select POC for Swag/Media production" - done 21:04:05 <cwickert> "Regional Teams Submit Funding Request For Swag/Media Production" - I'll do this after this meeting 21:04:16 <liknus> excellent :) 21:04:21 <cwickert> #action cwickert to file a budget request for the media production 21:04:25 <zoltanh7211> cool 21:04:51 <cwickert> liknus: any news from FAmSCo? how about "FAmSCo heads Ambassador Wide Meetings Preparing For Fedora 15" and "FAmSCo and Regional teams call for Preparation of Media/SWAG"? 21:05:19 * cwickert notes that we'll come to swag later 21:05:30 <liknus> the first one is already underway 21:05:51 <liknus> media was today a topic (and will be on regional meetings this or next weeks worldwide) 21:06:06 <liknus> and swag for EMEA is a bit stalled (waiting for credit cards) 21:06:08 <liknus> eof 21:06:16 <cwickert> yes, I'll get to that 21:06:32 <cwickert> #topic Events 21:06:43 <cwickert> last weekend there was CLT 21:06:49 <cwickert> nice event, yada yada yada 21:07:00 <dmaphy> yep, indeed :) 21:07:00 <cwickert> you can ready about it on the planet 21:07:28 <cwickert> and we have LinuxTag coming up 21:07:45 <cwickert> I've written an invitation and it caused some confusion about funding 21:07:53 <cwickert> if somebody has questions, please ask 21:08:41 <cwickert> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/LinuxTag_2011 21:09:12 <jsmith> ! 21:09:19 <cwickert> #info if you want to attend LinuxTag, please add yourself in the wiki. if you need funding, file a ticket and add "cwickert" as CC. for more info ask cwickert 21:09:25 <cwickert> jsmith: yes please 21:09:50 <jsmith> I've received yet another email from the LinuxTag organizers, asking for someone to speak on Fedora in the distributions track. Any volunteers? 21:09:53 <jsmith> eof 21:10:09 <cwickert> jsmith: I have already volunteered :) 21:10:18 <jsmith> cwickert: Awesome, thanks :-) 21:10:41 <cwickert> #info if you file a ticket for funding, you only need to request funding for travel. hotel is handled by the linuxtag organizational team 21:10:53 <ardian> that's awesome 21:10:59 <cwickert> jsmith: I might have to talk about gnome-shell then :( uuuhaaaa 21:11:08 <cwickert> anyway, lets go on 21:11:25 <cwickert> #topic Fudcon Bids 21:11:47 <cwickert> the bidding peroid is closed and we have 3 21:11:58 <cwickert> Dublin (Gerold Kassube and Fabian Affolter) 21:11:59 <jsmith> ! 21:12:07 <cwickert> Budapest (Zoltan Hoppar and Jörg Simon 21:12:24 <cwickert> Milan (Francesco Crippa plus other italian Ambassadors) 21:12:37 <cwickert> jsmith: go ahead 21:12:48 <jsmith> Didn't we also receive a bid from Zurich again? 21:13:10 <jsmith> #info https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FUDCon:Bid_for_Zurich_2011 21:13:35 <cwickert> interesting 21:13:40 <GeroldKa> ? 21:13:43 * jsmith would love to schedule a meeting to pick the location 21:13:43 <cwickert> has this been announced? 21:13:44 <jsmith> eof 21:13:57 <jsmith> cwickert: It was announced on the fudcon-planning list on March 10th 21:14:07 <GeroldKa> Wasn't it standing policy that no country get it twice? 21:14:20 <cwickert> GeroldKa: right, twice in a row seems odd 21:14:24 <jsmith> Not that I know of 21:14:32 <jsmith> It does seem a bit odd, but I don't know of any rule against it 21:14:59 <cwickert> well, in the past we even had a rule to not do the same country again 21:15:02 <cwickert> at least in EMEA 21:15:23 <inode0> ! 21:15:32 <cwickert> #info Fudcon bidding period is closed and we have 4 biddy: Budapest, Dublin, Milan, Zurich 21:15:37 <cwickert> inode0: yes please 21:15:40 <inode0> wasn't it in Berlin 3 years in a row? 21:15:50 <GeroldKa> one time 21:15:55 <GeroldKa> and not a second 21:16:07 <GeroldKa> please don't mix FUDCon and FAD 21:16:07 <inode0> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FUDCon <- is wrong? 21:16:10 <GeroldKa> :-) 21:16:19 <cwickert> inode0: nope, this was Linuxtag, this has nothing to do with FUDCon. there only was one FUDCon attached to LinuxTag 21:18:03 <cwickert> inode0: well, 2 of the events were just Fedora tracks as part of LinuxTag. we had a devroom there and called it FUDCon, but just for getting more visitors 21:18:04 <inode0> that page tells me FUDCon Berlin in 2007-2009 - if that is incorrect please fix it for the record 21:18:04 <cwickert> take a look at the individual pages and the schedules 21:18:05 <cwickert> one room, 6 talks, you can hardly call this a FUDCon 21:18:39 <inode0> Ok, I wasn't there and I hope you can see why I thought it was in Berlin 3 years in a row 21:18:53 <cwickert> yes, I do 21:18:59 <jsmith> ? 21:19:12 <cwickert> but it was just marketing and only 1 real fudcon 21:19:20 <cwickert> jsmith: go 21:19:47 * t2hot is worried ... laptop will be out of juice in 10mins (no power here) 21:20:02 <jsmith> I hate to make this meeting longer, but can we pick a time that EMEA Ambassadors + liknus + FPL + FESCo representative can meet to decide winning location for FUDCon EMEA 2011? 21:20:35 <cwickert> jsmith: I think this is famsco business 21:20:49 <cwickert> they will do an evaluation 21:20:55 <cwickert> so this is not on us to decide 21:21:02 <cwickert> so lets move on, ok? 21:21:06 <jsmith> cwickert: In times past, it's been FAMSCo + FPL + Max 21:21:27 <cwickert> ok, but nothing for us today 21:21:32 <jsmith> cwickert: This time, Max asked to be taken out of the loop, and some of the ambassadors suggested that FESCo be involved as well 21:21:40 <cwickert> #topic Swag 21:21:49 <jsmith> Since I have many of the EMEA ambassadors here, I'd like to at least schedule a meeting 21:21:52 <jsmith> eog 21:21:55 <jsmith> eof (sorry) 21:22:29 <liknus> I am sorry all, I have to leave 21:22:40 <cwickert> again, FAmSCo has experience with this, they did it in the past, so I suggest to let them schedule the meeting 21:22:50 <cwickert> back to swag: the overall swag situation is bad in EMEA 21:22:51 <liknus> I will do 21:22:56 <cwickert> we hardly have any swag left 21:23:09 <liknus> #action liknus arranges the FUDCon EMEA bid pick meeting 21:23:09 <cwickert> and have no money to produce new 21:23:10 <liknus> ok? 21:23:12 <cwickert> ok 21:23:17 <liknus> thanks all 21:23:22 <liknus> i will go through the logs 21:23:28 <liknus> thanks cwickert for chairing this 21:23:32 <cwickert> we need credit cards in order to produce swag 21:23:56 <cwickert> otherwise we'll have to pay in advance and wait for reimbursement 21:24:02 <cwickert> and this takes quite some time 21:24:28 <cwickert> any ideas here? 21:25:01 <jsmith> Short of having Max open purchase orders, I know of no other simple solution 21:25:36 <cwickert> purchase orders suck, we've seen that with the media and now again with the sponsoring of CLT 21:25:50 <cwickert> but there was at least some progress with the credit cards 21:26:06 <cwickert> I know that kital has been sent the documents 21:26:29 <cwickert> #info some progress on credit cards, but we still need a bank account 21:26:49 <ardian> We don't have a bank account ? 21:26:52 <jsmith> cwickert: From everything I've learned, having access to a bank account is going to be impossible 21:26:59 <ardian> yup 21:27:11 <cwickert> ardian: not the ambassadors because we don't have a legal entity 21:27:22 <jsmith> cwickert: I'll continue to push for it, but I don't expect any change 21:27:36 <cwickert> jsmith: I know, lets not discuss this here now 21:27:42 <cwickert> one more thing on swag 21:27:43 <jsmith> cwickert: +1 21:27:43 * t2hot is leaving ... low battery. This is embarrasing. Be good Gerold, lets move forward. 21:27:56 <ardian> Is the problem that we don't have enough money ? 21:27:57 <cwickert> I need help with the swag tracker 21:28:13 <cwickert> ardian: we can get money but need to wait to long 21:28:48 <cwickert> #info cwickert needs help with the swag tracker, please help him by going through the tickets and pick the ones you can serve 21:29:00 <cwickert> and there is a page for new swag ideas now 21:29:10 <cwickert> #lin https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Ambassadors:Swag 21:29:18 <ardian> ok 21:29:25 <cwickert> please do not yet add content, this is still work in progress 21:29:45 <cwickert> for the future, we gather all swag there: who has it and so on 21:30:06 <cwickert> #topic Budget 21:30:15 <cwickert> there is a few budget items we need to approve 21:30:21 <cwickert> one is GeroldKa's CheatCubes 21:30:27 <cwickert> GeroldKa: still with us? 21:30:39 <GeroldKa> it's not my cheatcube 21:30:50 <GeroldKa> I wanted to have that swag for CLT 21:30:54 <GeroldKa> and for Graz 21:30:54 <dmaphy> typo in the link-command above 21:30:56 <GeroldKa> and linuxtag 21:30:56 <cwickert> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Marketing_collateral#Fedora_Cheat_Cubes 21:31:01 <GeroldKa> and LinuxSolution 21:31:03 <GeroldKa> and much more 21:31:26 <cwickert> GeroldKa: it's yours because you are driving it forward 21:31:47 <cwickert> hahaha (SCNR) 21:32:27 <cwickert> GeroldKa: how much of these do you want to produce and how much budget it that? 21:33:23 <cwickert> GeroldKa: ? 21:33:31 <GeroldKa> I put the prices to the ticket for which you advised me 21:33:46 <cwickert> ok, but the quote has different numbers 21:33:56 <cwickert> 1000 for 1265 EUR 21:34:08 <cwickert> 5000 for 2025 EUR 21:34:21 <cwickert> 10.000 for 3000 EUR 21:34:28 <cwickert> I don't think we need 10.000 ;) 21:34:32 <GeroldKa> that's right 21:34:39 <cwickert> but 5000 seems reasonable to me 21:34:41 <GeroldKa> with the numbers :-) 21:34:42 <dmaphy> not yet ;) 21:35:00 <cwickert> GeroldKa: what do you suggest? 5000? 21:35:19 <GeroldKa> I have no idea yet 21:35:21 <cwickert> as you can see 1000 is very expensive 21:35:24 <GeroldKa> but I kno 21:35:32 <GeroldKa> s/kno/know 21:35:51 <GeroldKa> on every event you will go, every second will have one 21:36:11 <GeroldKa> so 5000 can be thrown away in a week at Linuxtag e.g. 21:36:21 <GeroldKa> Linuxsolution has also 10k visitors 21:36:42 <cwickert> so make a proposal please 21:36:50 <cwickert> do you suggest to do 10.000? 21:37:05 <GeroldKa> Christoph, to be honest, I have really no idea 21:37:16 <GeroldKa> but 10k seems a huge amount to produce and pay 21:37:16 <cwickert> ok, lets try a different approach 21:37:24 <GeroldKa> I guess 5k will be enough to start 21:37:40 <cwickert> people, do you like the CheatCubes? Should we produce some? 21:37:47 <cwickert> +1 to CheatCubes 21:37:53 <zoltanh7211> ! 21:38:03 <cwickert> one thing I like about them is that people have something to play 21:38:10 <cwickert> and this will catch attraction 21:38:20 <cwickert> they can build them at the Fedora booth 21:38:21 <ardian> yup +1 CheatCubes 21:38:35 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: yes please 21:39:17 <zoltanh7211> I have 1k order between tickets, and liknus will cover the costs 21:39:36 <zoltanh7211> 500 german and 500 english by Ritter 21:39:50 <cwickert> sorry, I don't understand 21:39:52 <dmaphy> +1 for the cheatcubes 21:40:26 <GeroldKa> it's that easy cwickert 21:40:42 <GeroldKa> Pierros has approved that zoltanh7211 is able to produce 1k 21:40:53 <cwickert> 1k of what? 21:40:59 <GeroldKa> and guaranteed that he will be payed 21:41:04 <GeroldKa> cheatcube 21:41:05 <cwickert> wtf? 21:41:18 <cwickert> can we first vote *if* we want them and then how much and where to buy? 21:41:49 <GeroldKa> to be honest; are you FAMSCO chair? 21:42:11 <cwickert> no, but the famsco chair cannot decide this either I guess 21:42:34 <GeroldKa> as you can read, he has 21:42:38 <cwickert> so, who wants CheatCubes? 21:42:44 <GeroldKa> am i wrong zoltanh7211 ? 21:42:51 <ardian> +1 CheatCubes 21:42:59 <dmaphy> +1 21:43:21 <GeroldKa> +1 21:43:31 <cwickert> +1 21:43:39 <gentth> +1 21:43:49 <cwickert> #agreed we want Fedora CheatCubes 21:44:06 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: can you give us more details about your quote? 21:44:40 <zoltanh7211> yes - I did it, and made samples too what has been sent to liknus and to Gerold 21:44:59 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: numbers please 21:45:23 <zoltanh7211> right now the order is 1000 pcs 72 HUF/ sheet, with VAT is 90 / sheet 21:45:31 <cwickert> in EUR? 21:45:52 <zoltanh7211> totally for 1000 is cca 350 EUR 21:46:14 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: this is way cheaper 21:46:31 <cwickert> GeroldKa: did you see zoltanh7211s? how was the quality 21:46:32 <cwickert> ? 21:47:19 <cwickert> I think our FAmSCo chair has just made us waste time and money 21:47:34 <cwickert> If zoltanh7211s are cheaper, we should have ordered more 21:47:48 <GeroldKa> it was another produktion and another qualtity and weight 21:47:56 <cwickert> but either way, two people put work into that 21:48:07 <cwickert> I feel we cannot decide this today, sorry 21:48:35 <cwickert> I'd like all parties involved, this is zoltanh7211, GeroldKa and liknus to discuss this together 21:48:58 <GeroldKa> pictures are here: http://geroldka.fedorapeople.org/cheat/ 21:49:03 <cwickert> GeroldKa: we cannot approve your budget request now if we get something much cheaper 21:49:53 <GeroldKa> maybe we can produce it also in VRC much cheaper than in Hungary 21:50:05 <GeroldKa> should I ask for a quote? 21:50:08 <zoltanh7211> GeroldKa: VRC? 21:50:13 <GeroldKa> China 21:50:13 <cwickert> #action zoltanh7211, GeroldKa and liknus to discuss the CheatCubes again to avoid confusion and frustration 21:50:41 <cwickert> does anybody think we should approve one or the other budget now? 21:51:11 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: do you have a ticket in FAmSCo's trac? 21:51:29 <dmaphy> too difficult to decide without having seen both 21:51:29 <cwickert> zoltanh7211: and did you already order or did you just ask for a quote? 21:51:40 <cwickert> dmaphy: agreed 21:51:52 <dmaphy> thus the people who have seen those should decide 21:51:53 <cwickert> -1 for making a decision tonight 21:52:30 <cwickert> #info FAmSCo chair must not approve items that have not been discussed by the regional teams yet 21:52:44 <cwickert> hope he reads this in the summary 21:53:39 <cwickert> hello people, are you still there? 21:53:46 * rbergeron can see you typing 21:53:47 * ardian is here 21:54:02 * gentth is here 21:54:09 * dmaphy also 21:54:39 <cwickert> I think it's hard to make decisions when only a few people are present 21:55:11 <cwickert> nevertheless I'll give it a try 21:55:15 <cwickert> #topic Funding for sending Gerd to YAPC::Europe 21:55:22 <ardian> yes can we make a decision next time ? 21:55:22 <dmaphy> well, we have almost two hours of meeting now... not that i'd say this is a problem ;) 21:56:00 <cwickert> dmaphy: we are almost through the agenda and if people followed the meeting protocol, we'd be faster 21:56:12 <zoltanh7211> cwickert: it has been ordered, and the company awaiting the first half amount 21:56:22 <cwickert> damn 21:56:30 <cwickert> this really sucks 21:56:43 <cwickert> anyway, lets move on 21:57:05 <cwickert> I'd like to send our parrot and rakudo maintainer to Riga to the european perl conference 21:57:31 <cwickert> and requested a budget of 600 EUR for it 21:57:44 <cwickert> I don't know why the ambassadors need to approve this 21:58:01 <cwickert> because he is not an ambassador and the event is not an ambassador's event either 21:58:14 <cwickert> but max said the ambassadors are to decide 21:58:34 <GeroldKa> who's Gerd? 21:58:37 <cwickert> so is everybody happy with granting the funding for Gerd? 21:58:53 <cwickert> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Gerd 21:59:19 <cwickert> GeroldKa: Gerd is maintainer of rakudo, parrot and rakudo star 21:59:43 <cwickert> rakudo and parrot was a feature of F12 21:59:49 <dmaphy> +1 21:59:54 <cwickert> and rakudo star was a feature of F14 22:00:04 <zoltanh7211> +1 22:00:06 <cwickert> I think he deserves a little from us 22:00:12 <ardian> ^^ +1 22:00:35 <cwickert> sending someone to this conference also shows that we care about our people and care about perl 22:00:53 <cwickert> and it gives Gerd the chance to meed with many of his developers 22:01:04 <cwickert> because he also is the release manager of rakudo 22:01:04 <zoltanh7211> ...and we could have important feedback 22:01:13 <gentth> +1 22:01:22 <cwickert> ok, +1 fro mme as well 22:01:28 <ardian> yes fedora stands for friends :D 22:01:32 <ardian> friends help each other 22:01:37 <cwickert> anybody not happy with giving money to a non-ambassador?! 22:02:37 <cwickert> I take this as a no 22:02:54 <cwickert> #agreed we'll provide funding of 600 EUR for Gerd 22:03:09 * inode0 thinks this is both a really nice thing to do and something that will benefit for Gerd and the Fedora Project 22:03:10 <cwickert> #topic Open Floor 22:03:22 <cwickert> anything for open floor? 22:03:34 <cwickert> otherwise I'll close the meeting in 3 minutes 22:04:45 <ardian> cwickert, I have a question about the funding for LinuxTag 22:05:08 <cwickert> ardian: yes please 22:05:30 <ardian> How does the procedure go 22:05:51 <cwickert> ardian: did you read the wiki pages? 22:05:56 <ardian> yes 22:06:17 <ardian> I wrote a ticket and cc you too 22:06:24 <cwickert> ardian: what exactly is your question then? 22:06:38 <cwickert> ardian: you did right, now you need to wait 22:07:20 <ardian> ok, cause if "I get" something I have to look for a visa 22:08:39 <cwickert> how long does this take? 22:09:39 <ardian> Hmm I never had to get one so I guess to 3 weeks maybe 22:09:52 <gentth> 30 days before depart 22:09:58 <gentth> for short visits visas 22:10:16 <cwickert> gentth: ok, good to know 22:10:25 <cwickert> anyway, we'll notify you in advance 22:10:35 <cwickert> I think that's all 22:10:41 <cwickert> thanks everybody for coming 22:10:42 <ardian> yes thank you 22:10:46 <cwickert> #endmeeting