16:01:09 <geppetto> #startmeeting fpc
16:01:09 <zodbot> Meeting started Thu Mar 18 16:01:09 2021 UTC.
16:01:09 <zodbot> This meeting is logged and archived in a public location.
16:01:09 <zodbot> The chair is geppetto. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
16:01:09 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
16:01:09 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'fpc'
16:01:09 <geppetto> #meetingname fpc
16:01:09 <geppetto> #topic Roll Call
16:01:09 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'fpc'
16:01:36 <mhroncok> .helloc churchyard
16:01:39 <mhroncok> .hello churchyard
16:01:40 <zodbot> mhroncok: churchyard 'Miro Hrončok' <mhroncok@redhat.com>
16:01:40 <geppetto> #chair mhroncok
16:01:40 <zodbot> Current chairs: geppetto mhroncok
16:01:58 <carlwgeorge> .hello2
16:01:58 <zodbot> carlwgeorge: carlwgeorge 'None' <carl@redhat.com>
16:02:06 <geppetto> #chair carlwgeorge
16:02:06 <zodbot> Current chairs: carlwgeorge geppetto mhroncok
16:04:11 <mhroncok> decathorpe?
16:05:57 <geppetto> Eh, it's confusing … we can blame DST and meet again when it's fixed. AFAIK there's nothing to do, and I could do with the extra 50 mins.
16:06:27 <mhroncok> I could do with the extra 50 mins as well, as I'll attend the go-nogo meeting after that
16:06:36 * geppetto nods
16:06:51 <decathorpe> sounds good
16:07:06 <Eighth_Doctor> hey
16:07:08 <Eighth_Doctor> .hello ngompa
16:07:09 <zodbot> Eighth_Doctor: ngompa 'Neal Gompa' <ngompa13@gmail.com>
16:07:15 <mhroncok> hey
16:07:21 * decathorpe also has short supply of time lately
16:07:25 <geppetto> #chair Eighth_Doctor
16:07:25 <zodbot> Current chairs: Eighth_Doctor carlwgeorge geppetto mhroncok
16:07:35 <geppetto> Just in time to say goodbye :)
16:07:47 <geppetto> #chair decathorpe
16:07:47 <zodbot> Current chairs: Eighth_Doctor carlwgeorge decathorpe geppetto mhroncok
16:07:57 <geppetto> #topic Open Floor
16:08:12 <geppetto> Unless anyone speaks up quickly I'm going to close in 2 mins.
16:08:24 <Eighth_Doctor> there's something I want to bring up
16:08:43 <geppetto> Eighth_Doctor: gogogo
16:08:46 <Eighth_Doctor> I'd like for us to take up getting tilde+caret versioning guidelines
16:08:54 <mhroncok> right
16:08:59 <Eighth_Doctor> we're now at a point where caret works in RHEL 8 too
16:09:04 <geppetto> Eighth_Doctor: There's already an open ticket about that
16:09:04 <decathorpe> I think tibbs had a draft for it?
16:09:07 <mhroncok> Eighth_Doctor: I admire that you remember that from the meeting yesterday :D I forgot
16:09:10 <geppetto> Eighth_Doctor: tibbs did a bunch of work
16:09:23 <Eighth_Doctor> and we can structure the guidelines to allow backwards compatibility for RHEL 7 using the "+" character
16:09:48 <Eighth_Doctor> by e.g. using <scm><date> rather than <date><scm>
16:09:52 <geppetto> Hmm … ok, I think generally people used .0.<blah>
16:10:32 <geppetto> But, yeh, feel free to speak with tibbs about it
16:10:34 <decathorpe> the benefit of using ~ and ^ over stuffing everything into Release is that it makes automation easier.
16:10:50 <Eighth_Doctor> e.g. 1.2.3(~|^|+)git20201231.deadbeef
16:11:17 <mhroncok> Eighth_Doctor: where ~ means this is not yet 1.2.3
16:11:26 <geppetto> mhroncok: yeh
16:11:27 <mhroncok> Eighth_Doctor: ^ means this is after 1.2.3
16:11:28 * nirik hates ~ for nitpicky reason.
16:11:34 <Eighth_Doctor> mhroncok: yeah
16:11:37 <mhroncok> hi nirik
16:11:45 <mhroncok> Eighth_Doctor: what does + mean in here?
16:11:48 <Eighth_Doctor> technically + doesn't mean anything
16:11:54 <mhroncok> where does it sort?
16:12:04 <Eighth_Doctor> but RPM's version sorting means that 1.2.3+git sorts higher than 1.2.3
16:12:04 <geppetto> mhroncok: that would be instead of 1.2.3-0.1.git20201231.deadbeef … or something
16:12:07 <Eighth_Doctor> since it's equivalent to 1.2.3.git
16:12:08 <nirik> double clicking on package names with ~ doesn't select the entire name. :) But thats a terminal issue I know...
16:12:14 <decathorpe> + sorts same as . I think.
16:12:17 <Eighth_Doctor> yup
16:12:34 <Eighth_Doctor> and using the word as the prefix instead of the number means that 1.2.3.1 sorts higher
16:12:47 <Eighth_Doctor> so it handles legacy case (RHEL 7) and modern case (RHEL 8+) just fine
16:12:57 <geppetto> Yeh, + for back compat. doesn't work there … it has to be in release
16:13:22 <Eighth_Doctor> other distributions have been using + this way for a while
16:13:26 <Eighth_Doctor> e.g. openSUSE and Debian
16:13:30 <mhroncok> 1.2.3.git-1 == 1.2.3+git-1 > 1.2.3^git-1 > 1.2.3-1 > 1.2.3~git-1
16:13:46 <Eighth_Doctor> yep
16:13:47 <geppetto> But 1.2.3 < 1.2.3+git20200300
16:13:58 <Eighth_Doctor> indeed
16:14:27 <Eighth_Doctor> my original draft (pre ^) did this: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/PackagingDrafts/TildeVersioning
16:14:57 <Eighth_Doctor> we can basically take that, update it for caret, and ship it
16:15:32 <Eighth_Doctor> though I think tibbs did a bunch of cleanup and explanation work in the tildecaretversioning doc: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Tibbs/TildeCaretVersioning
16:15:52 <geppetto> As I said, I know tibbs did a bunch of work based off of discussions here … but still felt it needed more work, I think
16:16:17 <mhroncok> Eighth_Doctor: if you work on a PR, I'll gladly give feedback when you ping me
16:16:23 <geppetto> So, yeh, if we could get something cleanedup that we'll all +1 that'd be awesome
16:16:33 <Eighth_Doctor> can do
16:16:39 <geppetto> Eighth_Doctor++
16:16:51 <geppetto> No ++ bot here
16:16:51 <Eighth_Doctor> FAS doesn't know that nick yet :D
16:16:52 <geppetto> ha
16:16:57 <Eighth_Doctor> try ngompa :)
16:17:14 <geppetto> ngompa++
16:17:14 <zodbot> geppetto: Karma for ngompa changed to 8 (for the current release cycle):  https://badges.fedoraproject.org/tags/cookie/any
16:17:27 <geppetto> 👍
16:17:45 <geppetto> #action Eighth_Doctor will fix versioning ;)
16:17:52 <geppetto> haha
16:17:53 <mhroncok> :D
16:17:56 <Eighth_Doctor> haha
16:18:10 <Eighth_Doctor> that's a Herculean task if I've ever heard one :)
16:18:26 * pingou votes +1 on fixing that
16:19:35 <Eighth_Doctor> but otherwise, I got nothing :)
16:19:41 <Eighth_Doctor> just wanted to make sure that was brought up
16:19:41 * geppetto nods
16:19:58 <mhroncok> Eighth_Doctor: thanks
16:20:06 <mhroncok> let's end?
16:20:11 <geppetto> Ok, ya only got 40 mins. now … but still something.
16:20:15 <geppetto> #endmeeting