19:31:41 <darknao> #startmeeting docs
19:31:41 <zodbot> Meeting started Wed Jan 25 19:31:41 2023 UTC.
19:31:41 <zodbot> This meeting is logged and archived in a public location.
19:31:41 <zodbot> The chair is darknao. Information about MeetBot at https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Zodbot#Meeting_Functions.
19:31:41 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
19:31:41 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'docs'
19:31:49 <darknao> #topic Roll call
19:31:55 <darknao> #chair pboy darknao pbokoc py0xc3[m]
19:31:55 <zodbot> Current chairs: darknao pbokoc pboy py0xc3[m]
19:31:59 <pboy> .hi
19:32:00 <zodbot> pboy: pboy 'Peter Boy' <pboy@uni-bremen.de>
19:32:17 <AnthonyMcGlone[m> Hi
19:34:25 <hankuoffroad[m]> .hello hankuoffroad
19:34:25 <zodbot> hankuoffroad[m]: hankuoffroad 'None' <allegrovelo@gmail.com>
19:35:08 <darknao> hi everyone
19:35:13 <darknao> #topic Agenda
19:35:19 <darknao> #link https://discussion.fedoraproject.org/t/docs-meeting-agenda-2023-01-25/46156
19:35:21 <darknao> #info Announcements
19:35:23 <darknao> #info Previous action items
19:35:25 <darknao> #info Tickets review
19:35:27 <darknao> #info GitLab Guide update
19:35:29 <darknao> #info Quick docs update
19:35:31 <darknao> #info Open Floor
19:35:33 <darknao> #topic Announcements
19:35:35 <darknao> #info The category system for Quick Docs has been deployed on PROD
19:35:37 <darknao> #link https://docs.stg.fedoraproject.org/en-US/quick-docs/categories/administration/
19:35:39 <darknao> #info Next milestone is F38 (2023-04-18)
19:35:41 <darknao> #info We use GitLab to track work: https://gitlab.com/groups/fedora/docs/-/boards
19:35:56 <darknao> I believe the poll for the new meeting time is over
19:36:27 <pboy> Yes, we should discuss it today
19:37:07 <darknao> hankuoffroad[m]: would you be able to post the 2 or 3 most favorites timing in the discussion topic?
19:37:56 <darknao> then maybe we can open a real poll on discussion with those time slot, and make the final decision?
19:38:07 <pboy> see https://discussion.fedoraproject.org/t/poll-docs-meeting-time/45647/2
19:38:18 <hankuoffroad[m]> darknao: We have 8 respondents with no match.
19:38:18 <hankuoffroad[m]> Most match found: 3 preferred 18:00 UTC on Tuesdays or Thursdays.
19:39:03 <darknao> is that the only time slot with more than 1 response?
19:39:29 <hankuoffroad[m]> yes.
19:40:14 <darknao> mmh ok, so I see 2 options here
19:40:43 <darknao> it's either the current time or this new one
19:40:56 <hankuoffroad[m]> Those who responded already attend the meeting. This means we found a better timeslot, but doesn't attract more people
19:41:48 <pboy> Maybe, it is best to keep the current one?
19:42:09 <pboy> We had often more then 3 participants
19:42:17 <darknao> alright, so what do people here want to do?
19:43:25 <darknao> if we can't agree for a new time today, maybe we can just create a discourse poll with the 3 options and see the results next week?
19:43:54 <hankuoffroad[m]> if the new time slot does not suit other people, there is no need to change for now.
19:44:07 <pboy> I am indecisive
19:44:50 <darknao> poll then? 3 options are: keep the old one, 18pm Tuesdays, or 18pm Thursday
19:44:53 <pboy> My cfredo: Don’t touch a running system, unless there is reals improvement
19:45:19 <pboy> darknao +1
19:45:33 <AnthonyMcGlone[m> +1
19:45:50 <hankuoffroad[m]> pboy: +1
19:46:42 <darknao> if I remember correctly, someone asked for a new slot, so I think it's best to propose options before dismissing it
19:47:09 <darknao> hankuoffroad[m]: can you create the poll on your topic?
19:48:13 <hankuoffroad[m]> darknao: Poll in Discussion? Don't know how
19:49:00 <darknao> when you reply, click on the gear button in the toolbar (the last one), there is a Build Poll option there
19:49:16 <hankuoffroad[m]> ok will do
19:49:19 <darknao> thanks!
19:49:52 <darknao> #action hankuoffroad to create a poll with the 3 options for the meeting time
19:50:04 <darknao> #topic  Previous action items
19:50:22 <darknao> #info pboy was to try the -b (build) & -p (preview) options of docsbuilder on mac
19:50:48 <pboy> I did and ended in an error
19:51:05 <pboy> Doesn't work on Mac, currently
19:51:40 <darknao> pboy: I've seen your answer on discussion, but can you post the result on the Gitlab issue as well?
19:52:06 <pboy> Yes, I'll do it after our meeting.
19:52:14 <darknao> good, thanks
19:52:43 <darknao> ok, I don't think there is anything else, so let's move the next topic
19:53:03 <darknao> #topic GitLab Guide update
19:53:17 <darknao> #link https://gitlab.com/fedora/docs/community-tools/documentation-contributors-guide/-/merge_requests/23
19:54:25 <pboy> I have full sympathy with those who find the GitLab UI too cluttered and confusing.    :-)
19:54:57 <darknao> A decision must be made regarding this guide whether we move the new UI, or the old simple one
19:55:00 <hankuoffroad[m]> I quickly recovered from it.
19:55:34 <pboy> I think, the alternative is the new GUI or a (simple) editor?
19:56:07 <pboy> And the editor is different from the old GUI?
19:56:46 <darknao> so i don't really feel that I'm the right audience for this guide, but I would think the simple UI is better for this kind of guide
19:57:26 <darknao> using the new VSCode kind of editor seems a bit overkill for a casual contribution
19:57:44 <darknao> so I vote +1 for the simple one
19:57:53 <pboy> me too
19:58:31 <hankuoffroad[m]> Due to the default experience of GitLab, we need to move to the new UI in the Docs. Including myself there were two other people spotted the UI change. I realized it is stripped down version of VS code.
19:58:40 <pboy> But I think, Chris and hankuoffroad know better as me and should decide.
19:59:19 <hankuoffroad[m]> I would go for the new UI and Anthony McGlone already submitted MR for that.
20:00:03 <darknao> pboy: +1 I think it's up to hankuoffroad and Chris (and Anthony) to make the final decision
20:00:28 <pboy> Can we get data, how many user used or tried to use the Web editor?
20:00:43 <pboy> Web UI
20:01:47 <darknao> I don't think we have such data?
20:02:13 <pboy> The idea is: can we compare how many used it and how many MRs we get?
20:03:44 <darknao> well, the new UI is currently not documented on our side, so the result will most likely lean toward the old UI
20:05:17 <pboy> Yes, but as I understand, the old UI is "out", i.e. will vanish in 2-3 months?
20:05:35 <darknao> since we already have a PR for the new UI, my only recommendation would be to merge and use it, then if users feel like it's too complicated, move back to the old simple UI.
20:05:46 <hankuoffroad[m]> pboy: that's correct
20:05:56 <pboy> darknao +1
20:06:06 <pboy> maybe we can do a small survey (in 3 months) of who has used the WebUI and with what experience?
20:06:13 <hankuoffroad[m]> darknao +1
20:06:24 <AnthonyMcGlone[m> +1
20:07:03 <darknao> pboy: sure why not. In the end, that should be the ones that actually use that UI that should give their feedbacks on this
20:07:08 <darknao> not me :)
20:08:48 <hankuoffroad[m]> sorry i have to leave now. will catch up on action/PR
20:09:19 <pboy> Yeah, and if it is too awkward, we should optimize and encourage  the local authoring system
20:10:16 <pboy> Maybe, we offer a kind of remote local authoring opportunity.
20:13:19 <darknao> I'm going to comment on the PR with this:
20:13:30 <darknao> Following today's meeting, we recommend using the new WebUI as the guide has already been written here. Then if users complain about the new one and find it too complicated, then we should move back to the simple editor.
20:13:32 <darknao> In the end, we leave the final decision to you to figure out the best course of action.
20:13:40 <darknao> agreed?
20:13:51 <pboy> agreed
20:14:00 <AnthonyMcGlone[m> +1
20:14:04 <darknao> done
20:14:15 <darknao> next topic then
20:14:20 <darknao> #topic Quick docs update
20:14:29 <darknao> floor is yours pboy
20:14:43 <pboy> From my side there is nothing new at the moment.
20:14:59 <pboy> I'm currently blocked due to technical issues.
20:15:59 <pboy> There are a lot of nearly ready results of various open issues  which only need a bit of work to get published
20:16:21 <pboy> I hope next week we have more results and more new actions.
20:16:46 <pboy> <eot>
20:17:17 <darknao> regarding your issue, you said the old script was working right$
20:17:19 <darknao> ?
20:17:50 <darknao> maybe you can use the old one instead for the time being, if that helps?
20:17:53 <pboy> Yes, but they are overwritten as soon as I pull a repo with the uopdated UI
20:18:41 <pboy> Therefore, I'm setting up a remote working environment.
20:19:01 <darknao> you can download the old one here if you want https://pagure.io/fedora-docs/template/tree/main
20:19:32 <darknao> (just the file, you don't need to checkout the complete git repository)
20:19:43 <pboy> Ok, I'll try it I get it u and running
20:20:40 <darknao> not sure if it'll work as I believe the command used here is the same as the one in the new script
20:21:09 <pboy> Well, I'll see.  :-)
20:21:29 <darknao> right :) final topic for today then:
20:21:39 <darknao> #topic Open Floor
20:22:00 <pboy> Just a question: Is someone of as on Fosdem Febr. 4./5. in Bruessel?
20:22:31 <darknao> no plan to attend right now
20:23:24 <pboy> I'm considering to attend.
20:24:02 <pboy> Would be nice to meet  face-to-face if there is an opportunity.
20:24:11 <darknao> I think there will be a lot of Fedorans here
20:24:41 <pboy> Yes, of course, Fedora has a booth there
20:26:31 <darknao> that should be fun, maybe next time for me
20:27:35 <pboy> I never attended Fosdem before, so I'm curious
20:28:49 <darknao> is there a virtual part or is it only on-person kind of event?
20:28:56 <darknao> in-person*
20:29:42 <pboy> II don't know, I did read about a virtual track or so. But I'll check again.
20:29:57 <pboy> did ->  didn't
20:31:04 <pboy> And I need a new vi cup. :-)
20:31:40 <pboy> for help with Fedora docs writing. :-)
20:32:14 <darknao> alright, we reach the end of the meeting time. Thank you everyone for today, and see you all next week!
20:32:17 <darknao> #endmeeting