17:10:17 <geppetto> #startmeeting fpc
17:10:17 <zodbot> Meeting started Thu Feb 20 17:10:17 2020 UTC.
17:10:17 <zodbot> This meeting is logged and archived in a public location.
17:10:17 <zodbot> The chair is geppetto. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
17:10:17 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
17:10:17 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'fpc'
17:10:18 <geppetto> #meetingname fpc
17:10:18 <geppetto> #topic Roll Call
17:10:18 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'fpc'
17:10:33 <decathorpe> geppetto: I thought so :D
17:10:39 <omajid> please sirs, may i have an exception for https://pagure.io/packaging-committee/issue/946 ?
17:10:39 <decathorpe> hello!
17:10:39 * limburgher here
17:10:44 <geppetto> #chair decathorpe
17:10:44 <zodbot> Current chairs: decathorpe geppetto
17:10:45 <tibbs> Hello.
17:10:46 <geppetto> #chair limburgher
17:10:46 <zodbot> Current chairs: decathorpe geppetto limburgher
17:11:22 <decathorpe> #chair tibbs
17:11:22 <zodbot> Current chairs: decathorpe geppetto limburgher tibbs
17:11:23 <geppetto> #chair tibbs
17:11:23 <zodbot> Current chairs: decathorpe geppetto limburgher tibbs
17:11:29 <decathorpe> whoops sorry :)
17:11:35 <geppetto> Hey, enjoy your birthday?
17:11:39 <geppetto> decathorpe: no problem
17:13:15 <tibbs> Yeah, it was relaxing.  But I came back to two weeks of messes and a pile of dental work.
17:15:35 <geppetto> yeh, that's what happens :) … I remember speaking to a friend a year or two ago and he said that he liked vacations but felt like he was working twice as hard the week before and the week after, so he wasn't sure it was doing much :)
17:17:34 <geppetto> #topic #946 Bootstrap Exception for .NET Core 3.1 (dotnet3.1)
17:17:39 <geppetto> .fpc 946
17:17:40 <zodbot> geppetto: Issue #946: Bootstrap Exception for .NET Core 3.1 (dotnet3.1) - packaging-committee - Pagure.io - https://pagure.io/packaging-committee/issue/946
17:17:52 <geppetto> Ok, wre don't have 5 … but a few people not here have voted already
17:18:05 <tibbs> +1 from me.  (Will add that to the ticket.)
17:19:51 <decathorpe> I think that makes +5/0/-0 now?
17:20:04 <tibbs> Yes, I believe so.
17:20:17 <geppetto> yeh
17:20:33 <geppetto> Figure I'd give limburgher a couple of minutes to vote too
17:20:45 <limburgher> Sorry, briefly afk.
17:20:50 <limburgher> +1
17:21:05 <ignatenkobrain> +1
17:21:11 <geppetto> #chair ignatenkobrain
17:21:11 <zodbot> Current chairs: decathorpe geppetto ignatenkobrain limburgher tibbs
17:21:20 <geppetto> ignatenkobrain: You already voted in the ticket :)
17:21:47 <ignatenkobrain> now I have doublevoted :D
17:21:51 <geppetto> #action Bootstrap Exception for .NET Core 3.1 (dotnet3.1) (+1:6, 0:0, -1:0)
17:22:02 <geppetto> ignatenkobrain: fair enough
17:22:04 <geppetto> :)
17:22:35 <geppetto> #topic #pr-940 Revisit the Python guidelines
17:22:42 <geppetto> https://pagure.io/packaging-committee/pull-request/940
17:23:14 <geppetto> We have  couple of votes here too
17:23:38 <ignatenkobrain> +1
17:25:29 <tibbs> +1
17:25:31 <geppetto> tibbs: That leaves you
17:25:37 <geppetto> #action Revisit the Python guidelines (+1:4, 0:0, -1:0)
17:25:44 <geppetto> #undo
17:25:44 <zodbot> Removing item from minutes: ACTION by geppetto at 17:25:37 : Revisit the Python guidelines (+1:4, 0:0, -1:0)
17:25:50 <geppetto> #action Revisit the Python guidelines (+1:5, 0:0, -1:0)
17:25:55 <tibbs> Frankly at least some of it didn't really need to go through the committee process.
17:25:59 <geppetto> Gah, I'm too out of it today
17:26:12 <geppetto> #topic Open Floor
17:26:28 <nim-nim> Hi
17:26:33 <nim-nim> .hello2
17:26:34 <zodbot> nim-nim: Sorry, but you don't exist
17:26:38 <geppetto> Ok, we have 5 … but nothing changed on anything else … anyone want to talk about anything?
17:26:49 <nim-nim> some open floor questions from me
17:26:53 <geppetto> nim-nim: hey, even though you don't exist :)
17:27:14 <geppetto> nim-nim: Sure
17:27:16 <nim-nim> people are asking a backport of forge macros to EL8
17:27:33 <nim-nim> can FPC finally publish the related doc ?
17:27:49 <nim-nim> it’s been on the todo liste for more than a year
17:28:13 <decathorpe> It's only a question of merging the PR, right?
17:28:38 <nim-nim> merging it or amending it then margin it as FPC feels
17:28:40 <ignatenkobrain> yes, docs are built automatically
17:28:41 <ignatenkobrain> somehow, somewhere
17:29:02 <nim-nim> the templates in the year old PR apply today as is
17:29:31 <decathorpe> yeah, the PR should apply cleanly, looking at the diff.
17:29:46 <tibbs> This goes back to the same old issue of whether the packaging guidelines are a good place to put documentation.
17:30:50 <decathorpe> in this case, I'm fine with it - because you seem to need a certain amount of domain knowledge to package fonts correctly ...
17:31:26 <nim-nim> at least some part of the guidelines should trace FPC approved the macros (because it did and we have lots of packages in the distro using them)
17:31:54 <tibbs> I don't have a particular problem with it, except that document needs to be able to evolve and having a committee process in front of it makes that more difficult.
17:32:29 <nim-nim> I was writing about the **forge** not fonts macros (last year’s changed)
17:33:03 <decathorpe> ah, sorry, I misunderstood.
17:33:05 <geppetto> nim-nim: Can you point to the ticket or PR?
17:33:16 <decathorpe> .fpc 719
17:33:18 <zodbot> decathorpe: Issue #719: Simplify packaging of forge-hosted projects - packaging-committee - Pagure.io - https://pagure.io/packaging-committee/issue/719
17:33:27 <tibbs> And certainly the forge macros need to be visibly documented somewhere (besides what's in the macro files themselves, which I suppose would be the ultimate reference).
17:33:34 <decathorpe> nim-nim: is this the correct one?
17:33:50 <nim-nim> https://pagure.io/packaging-committee/issue/719
17:34:16 <nim-nim> yes that’s the one, it’s been waiting for a long time
17:34:43 <geppetto> yeh, things aren't usually in writeup that long
17:34:48 <geppetto> not sure what happened
17:34:49 <decathorpe> I think we forgot about this one 🙈
17:35:06 <tibbs> Generally I would think that every feature supported by RPM and redhat-rpm-config and its dependencies would be fair game for packagers unless the guidelines include restrictions on their use.
17:35:52 <tibbs> But good curated packaging documentation needs a place.  Somewhere in the guidelines would, I suppose, be fine as long as we are willing to explicitly have less formality around merging things there.
17:35:58 <nim-nim> redhat-rpm-macros maintainers rejected the PR documenting them within the package so right now it’s documented nowhere
17:36:19 <nim-nim> except in the rejected redhat-rpm PR and the stuck guidelines PR
17:37:13 <decathorpe> I mean, there's already general RpmMacros documentation in the packaging guidelines, so ...
17:37:36 <decathorpe> the macros should be documented somewhere, so it might as well be here
17:38:55 <nim-nim> so please merge it (or convince redhat-rpm-config people to accept the doc their side)
17:39:43 <geppetto> decathorpe: it's currently assigned to you … you want to merge it?
17:40:09 <decathorpe> it is? oh my.
17:40:41 <decathorpe> if I remember correctly, I wanted to add some additional documentation, but not change anything.
17:41:10 <decathorpe> so ... yeah I should have merged this ages ago
17:41:58 <decathorpe> uh, wait a minute
17:42:01 <decathorpe> .fpc 826
17:42:07 <zodbot> decathorpe: An error has occurred and has been logged. Please contact this bot's administrator for more information.
17:42:11 <tibbs> ...
17:42:13 <decathorpe> lol
17:42:14 <decathorpe> https://pagure.io/packaging-committee/pull-request/826
17:42:28 <decathorpe> the PR itself is assigned to igor :)
17:42:34 <tibbs> Maybe it only does tickets, not PRs.
17:42:46 <geppetto> It does
17:43:04 <geppetto> decathorpe: Not sure nim-nim cares either way … :)
17:43:16 <geppetto> ignatenkobrain: Did you want to do anything with the PR before merging?
17:43:45 <ignatenkobrain> No
17:43:51 <decathorpe> there's a comment about wrong info. redhat-rpm-templates package does not exist
17:44:07 <nim-nim> I don’t care either way, I sad for Fedora packagers that do no know they can use this because it is documented nowhere official
17:45:05 <nim-nim> decathorpe: it would have existed if the redhat-rpm-config PR had been merged.
17:45:22 <nim-nim> just merge the templated somewhere :(
17:45:42 <nim-nim> so people have a clean example on how to use the macros
17:46:50 <nim-nim> I’m not going to fiht to the death for redhat-rpm-templates if redhat-rpm-config maints do not want to create a template subpackage
17:47:05 <geppetto> Any volunteers to click merge on 826, or should I do it?
17:47:13 <limburgher> Take it away. :)
17:47:29 <decathorpe> just do it ... we can fix the broken redhat-rpm-templates dependency later :D
17:48:08 <nim-nim> thanks!
17:48:11 <geppetto> Ok, done
17:48:32 <nim-nim> My second open floor question was on the fonts side
17:49:07 <nim-nim> can anyone FPC side review the macro package or indicate in the bugzilla ticket FPC is ok with someone else reviewing it?
17:49:30 <tibbs> Which macro package are you referring to?
17:49:32 <nim-nim> I fear the guidelines connexion makes it radioactive for non-FPC reviewers
17:49:55 <decathorpe> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1803281
17:50:09 <tibbs> I would but I don't know when I will have time.
17:50:12 <tibbs> I will bookmark it.
17:50:30 <limburgher> I'll do it.
17:51:02 <nim-nim> limburgher: thanks
17:51:05 <tibbs> nim-nim: Only tangentially on topic, have you seen https://github.com/rpm-software-management/rpm/pull/1063 ?
17:51:21 <tibbs> "Make parametric macro arguments available as native Lua table"
17:51:40 <nim-nim> tibbs: I hadn’t, thanks for the pointer
17:52:25 <nim-nim> tibbs: I actually though about filling thie exact request this week, except I was busy in the fontconfig issue tracker
17:52:39 <tibbs> I wish it went further but it's still an improvement.
17:52:58 <nim-nim> that would definitely cut down some of the boilerplate in forge, go and fonts macros
17:53:06 <geppetto> #action limburgher Will review macros in https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1803281
17:53:32 <nim-nim> (implementation side, for users it won’t change anything)
17:54:01 <tibbs> Aargh, clamav.  On update it dumps this in %post to stderr: "Now we provide clamav-freshclam.service systemd unit instead old scripts and the cron.d entry."
17:54:22 <tibbs> And tells you that it's broken your installation in a place almost nobody will ever see it.
17:54:59 <decathorpe> tibbs: wonderful! :D
17:55:05 <geppetto> bonus
17:55:05 <tibbs> Why do maintainers insist on doing things like that?  In F30, no less.
17:57:40 <geppetto> on that note … unless there is anything super important I'll end the meeting
17:58:12 <decathorpe> +1
17:58:15 <tibbs> Thanks.  Glad to have gotten something done.  Hopefully the trend will continue.  (Though I will be out of town again in two weeks.)
17:58:54 * geppetto nods
17:58:57 <geppetto> #endmeeting