15:00:12 <sgallagh> #startmeeting Server SIG Weekly Meeting (2016-03-29)
15:00:12 <zodbot> Meeting started Tue Mar 29 15:00:12 2016 UTC.  The chair is sgallagh. Information about MeetBot at
15:00:12 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
15:00:12 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'server_sig_weekly_meeting_(2016-03-29)'
15:00:12 <sgallagh> #meetingname ServerSIG
15:00:12 <sgallagh> #chair sgallagh mizmo nirik stefw adamw simo danofsatx mhayden jds2001
15:00:12 <sgallagh> #topic roll call
15:00:12 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'serversig'
15:00:12 <zodbot> Current chairs: adamw danofsatx jds2001 mhayden mizmo nirik sgallagh simo stefw
15:00:37 <nirik> morning
15:01:01 <jds2001> .hello jstanley
15:01:01 <zodbot> jds2001: jstanley 'Jon Stanley' <>
15:01:27 <mizmo> .hello duffy
15:01:28 <mhayden> .hello mhayden
15:01:28 <zodbot> mizmo: duffy 'Máirín Duffy' <>
15:01:31 <zodbot> mhayden: mhayden 'Major Hayden' <>
15:01:31 <sgallagh> .hello sgallagh
15:01:34 <zodbot> sgallagh: sgallagh 'Stephen Gallagher' <>
15:02:21 <adamw> ahoy
15:02:24 <adamw> .hello adamwill
15:02:29 <zodbot> adamw: adamwill 'Adam Williamson' <>
15:03:02 <sgallagh> #topic Agenda
15:03:18 <sgallagh> I had the Talking Points on the agenda, but they were due yesterday.
15:03:24 <danofsatx> oh, it's that time already. I'm here!
15:03:24 <sgallagh> Thanks to the folks who covered that.
15:03:30 <danofsatx> .hello dmossor
15:03:32 <zodbot> danofsatx: dmossor 'Dan Mossor' <>
15:04:12 <sgallagh> #info Agenda Topic: Upcoming Open WG Seat
15:04:13 <stefw> .hello stefw
15:04:14 <zodbot> stefw: stefw 'Stef Walter' <>
15:04:31 * danofsatx needs to go look at a model number real quick, back in a sec
15:04:50 <sgallagh> Any other agenda items for today?
15:05:35 <sgallagh> #topic Upcoming Open WG Seat
15:05:55 <sgallagh> As previously announced, I'm going to be stepping down from the Server WG, effective at the end of this meeting.
15:06:10 * danofsatx is back
15:06:22 * mhayden is sad
15:06:28 * jds2001 too
15:06:32 <danofsatx> sgallagh: why is that? You're the one developing the Server product - I'd hate to see you go
15:06:33 <mhayden> thanks for what you've done with the group, sgallagh :)
15:07:14 <sgallagh> danofsatx: A combination of burn-out and my day-job at Red Hat changing.
15:07:46 * nirik is also sad. Hopefully you can still be around some, or come back refreshed later.
15:08:02 <sgallagh> Yeah, that's my general plan.
15:08:10 <sgallagh> You've not seen the last of me.
15:08:32 <jds2001> sgallagh: darn, I though we were getting rid of you for good! :D
15:08:39 <danofsatx> Well, if your day job at RH is changing, is the old position you're leaving opening up?
15:08:43 <sgallagh> /me shakes fist.
15:08:50 * danofsatx still needs a job, preferably with RH
15:09:21 <adamw> jds2001: don't worry, i have the anti-sgallagh devices primed and ready for installation as soon as he leaves
15:09:24 <adamw> :P:
15:09:38 <sgallagh> Annnnnyway...
15:09:49 <mizmo> danofsatx: i think its more a reorg kind of thing
15:10:25 <sgallagh> Anyway, I'd like for us to prep a plan at least for the "chair/FESCo liaison" role that I currently hold.
15:10:50 <jds2001> sgallagh: what all is involved in that role?
15:10:52 <sgallagh> Someone needs to prep the meeting agendas and run the meetings and someone needs to keep FESCo apprised of important information when it comes up.
15:10:57 <sgallagh> Those do not need to be the same person.
15:11:53 <sgallagh> It's most convenient if the FESCo liaison is also a sitting member of FESCo, but not a strict requirement (as Paul Frields serves that function for the Workstation WG)
15:12:31 <danofsatx> that leaves us with nirik, doesn't it?
15:12:55 * danofsatx can't recall current FESCo peeps
15:13:00 <sgallagh> jds2001: The role of the FESCo liaison is mainly to be a go-between who makes sure that FESCo is aware of anything we change (or want to change) that might affect the rest of the project. And vice-versa.
15:14:01 <sgallagh> If the liaison is not a sitting member of FESCo, it really just means they are a non-voting member but should still be attending the meetings.
15:14:22 <adamw> the other thing is we need people to actually have a plan to do actual interesting work on Server. otherwise we're just sitting here every morning for no great reason.
15:14:31 <adamw> er, every Tuesday morning.
15:15:26 * nirik nods.
15:15:30 <sgallagh> adamw: I think that goes to more of a charter discussion.
15:15:30 * adamw is not volunteering.
15:15:31 <danofsatx> until it becomes my day-job again (which should happen real soon now), I won't be able to even have good ideas on what to do with Server.
15:15:52 <sgallagh> Which is probably a good thing to have (perhaps on the list?), particularly with a change in leadership.
15:17:17 <sgallagh> Today at least we should figure out who will be chairing the next meeting.
15:17:56 <nirik> I'd be happy to help someone else do it, but I run enough other meetings that I dont want to commit to running another one.
15:18:32 <sgallagh> An option of course is to do things like FESCo, with someone writing up an SOP document and sharing the chair around
15:19:20 * jds2001 is happy to do it, lacking other volunteers :)
15:19:35 <sgallagh> #info jds2001 to chair the next meeting
15:19:43 <adamw> go jds
15:20:10 <jds2001> then we can decide what we want to do.
15:20:24 <danofsatx> I'd be willing to do the SOP/share thing
15:20:35 <nirik> hurray. thanks jds2001
15:22:03 * jds2001 can likely not be the FESCo liason though - though my Wednesday $DAYJOB calendar is generally somewhat light
15:22:11 <jds2001> what time does the meeting happen at?
15:22:17 <sgallagh> jds2001: FESCo meets on Fridays
15:22:29 <nirik> friday at 17UTC
15:22:47 <jds2001> sgallagh: um, ok?
15:23:09 * jds2001 suggests updating the wiki in that case :)
15:24:43 <sgallagh> nirik: Given that you are still on FESCo, do you want to just handle acting as go-between?
15:25:02 <nirik> I guess I could sure.
15:26:14 <sgallagh> #info nirik to serve as FESCo liaison
15:26:58 <sgallagh> #topic Open Floor
15:27:15 <jds2001> now that ee havr logistics taken care of, do we want to talk about filling the open slot itself?
15:27:46 <sgallagh> Currently, we have one self-nomination on the mailing list.
15:28:58 <sgallagh> I've also been told that RHT engineering management is looking (internally) to find someone to put on Fedora Server full-time, but I suspect that's a multi-month process.
15:29:27 * danofsatx needs a job
15:29:28 <jds2001> anything like that moves glacially :D
15:29:31 <danofsatx> hint, hint
15:31:55 <sgallagh> While my opinion still counts, I'll admit to being in favor of expanding our sphere of influence to include people with non-x86 expertise.
15:32:15 <nirik> that would be nice.
15:32:32 <nirik> having someone full time to add new roles/etc would be nice too
15:32:39 <sgallagh> That said, I don't really know anything about Michael Wolf, though pbrobinson recommended him for the spot.
15:33:00 * adamw doesn't know anything about him
15:33:07 <danofsatx> from his intro, he has the experience at least of packaging, and he works for IBM....
15:33:20 <jds2001> and he lives in Minnesota
15:33:21 <nirik> I've interacted with him a bit, he seems nice. I don't know too much about him tho
15:33:27 <jds2001> which makes him crazy enough for us :D
15:35:04 <nirik> perhaps we should put out a wider call for folks? announce list? or blogs? or ?
15:35:20 <sgallagh> nirik: Phoronix? ;-)
15:35:23 <nirik> or just be happy we found one and accept him. ;)
15:35:30 <nirik> sgallagh: we would have to slant it right...
15:36:26 <danofsatx> magazine, commopsblog
15:36:42 <mhayden> i don't mind sending a query out to folks i know to see if we have more people interested
15:36:46 <sgallagh> OK, does anyone want to vote on Michael's nomination today, or shall we leave it for consideration at next week's meeting?
15:37:12 * danofsatx votes for a 1 week nomination period
15:38:09 <jds2001> do we have anyone specific, or any specific skillset, that we'd like to see in the WG?
15:38:31 <sgallagh> jds2001: I'd *really* like to see people who are prepared to dive in and make changes.
15:39:17 <sgallagh> We talk a great game, but we really need to make sure the WG is comprised of effective "do-ers"
15:39:56 <nirik> yep
15:40:07 <danofsatx> decause says we can get the call for noms posted within 24 hours if he has text
15:40:10 * jds2001 agrees
15:40:50 <mhayden> you said noms and now i am hungry
15:41:03 <jds2001> nom nom
15:41:06 <danofsatx> nomnomnomnom
15:41:24 <sgallagh> jds2001: If mjwolf walked in and said "OK, I've got this aarch64 farm and I want this to be a primary arch and my team has kernel patches", I think I'd vote him in on the spot (for example)
15:42:44 <mhayden> haha
15:42:47 <jds2001> sgallagh: that furthers Fedora as a whole.
15:42:56 * decause will bring it up at the commops meeting after this one
15:43:02 <jds2001> sgallagh: but does it do anything *specifically* for the Server product?
15:43:30 <jds2001> (of course, aarch64 is useful with Server)
15:43:31 <sgallagh> jds2001: Right, that's my point. I want whoever steps into the seat I'm vacating to be actively improving Fedora as a whole and Server in specific.
15:43:34 <decause> if folks have example text you've used in the past for calls for nominations, that would *signficantly* reduce the time needed to post the clal
15:43:37 <decause> call*
15:43:54 * danofsatx searches the inbox
15:43:59 <decause> danofsatx++
15:44:06 <sgallagh> jds2001: Well, I doubt it particulary aids Workstation and Cloud is dubious
15:44:12 * decause goes back to prepping the commops meeting agenda
15:44:20 <sgallagh> jds2001: aarch64 is far more likely to be a Server deliverable
15:44:45 <sgallagh> But I was providing that as a straw-man to indicate the level of involvement I'd be hoping for
15:45:02 <pbrobinson> sgallagh: he's the IBM lead for linux and community, he's actively involved in Server from a PPC perspective, there's quite a team behind him working on Fedora
15:45:03 * nirik notes we have some aarch64 stuff, just haven't had time to really bring it up yet. ;)
15:46:27 <sgallagh> pbrobinson: Thanks, so in essence he would potentially bring (human) resources to the table?
15:46:40 <pbrobinson> sgallagh: yes
15:46:59 <pbrobinson> sgallagh: and other things
15:47:08 <sgallagh> /me nods
15:47:42 <pbrobinson> sgallagh: that team regularly tests all sorts of things across server that is useful for server in general, things like enterprise storage and multipathing etc
15:48:12 <sgallagh> That would indeed be helpful.
15:48:33 <sgallagh> /me wonders if they could help us get some real-world continuous deployment testing going
15:48:44 <danofsatx> .tiny
15:48:45 <zodbot> danofsatx:
15:49:00 <danofsatx> ^^ sgallagh's call for nomination from november 2014
15:52:09 <sgallagh> Proposal: Accept additional nominations for Server WG seat until April 12th and issue a request for nominations on CommBlog.
15:52:22 <nirik> +1
15:53:08 <pbrobinson> sgallagh: it's been discussed briefly with them, we have some Power8 resources going into the Fedora Cloud which I'm hoping to eventually get nightly testing running on
15:53:09 <danofsatx> While I appreciate mjwolf volunteered, and he brings considerable value to the team, the announcement was released solely to the server list at this point.
15:53:17 <sgallagh> (this certainly isn't ruling Michael Wolf out, just offering some time to look around)
15:53:32 <jds2001> +1
15:53:39 <sgallagh> +1
15:53:45 <danofsatx> I would like to get wider eyes on our team, which is why I want CommOps to announce it - at the moment, mjwolf has my vote anyhow
15:54:11 <danofsatx> +1
15:54:40 <sgallagh> danofsatx: I'm in exactly the same boat. If we had to vote today, I'd vote for him.
15:54:54 <sgallagh> But I agree that we didn't really make the opening sufficiently widely known.
15:55:09 <sgallagh> (Who knows, maybe Linus would nominate himself ;-) )
15:55:37 <danofsatx> heh....he'd probably loose. he's kinda busy elsewhere
15:56:25 <sgallagh> I'll be absolutely clear: I'm not against mjwolf at all. We just don't seem to have consensus yet and I think there's no harm in waiting a couple weeks.
15:56:48 <jds2001> sgallagh: same here
15:56:57 <danofsatx> agreed
15:57:27 <pbrobinson> I would question how suitable or committed a candidate is if they're not already on the server list and actively reading it
15:58:16 <adamw> +1
15:58:24 <sgallagh> pbrobinson: I'd love for that to be true, but the subscription count on the Server list is very small.
15:58:31 <sgallagh> I suspect we probably need to remind people that it exists.
15:59:03 <jds2001> pbrobinson: to be completely honest, i wasnt on the list prior to joining the WG
15:59:19 <jds2001> (more of an oversight than anything....)
16:00:05 <sgallagh> mizmo: This is kind of your area of expertise: how do we remind people that Server has its own list and that it's actively used?
16:00:30 <mizmo> well what kind of people do you want to reach
16:00:40 * adamw running blocker review, not really around any more
16:00:49 <sgallagh> mizmo: Fedora Contributors :)
16:01:58 <sgallagh> mizmo: Basically, anyone who might have a vested interest in the direction that Fedora Server goes and would want to have input on that direction
16:02:33 <mizmo> sgallagh: the fedora community blog is a good bet but you're already talking about that; devel@lists.fpo might be worthwhile too, and maybe the public anaconda list bc a lot of sysadmins follow that
16:03:51 <sgallagh> Ah, that last one wouldn't have been obvious to me. Thanks!
16:05:06 <sgallagh> OK, I saw a +5 on the April12/commblog proposal at least.
16:05:22 <sgallagh> So let's start there and see if we can use that to drum up some additional Server@ subs as well
16:06:38 <sgallagh> #agreed Accept additional nominations for Server WG seat until April 12th and issue a request for nominations on CommBlog. (+5, 0, -0)
16:07:37 <sgallagh> danofsatx, decause, mizmo: Can you two work together to try to hit both goals (nominations and wider knowledge of Server@)?
16:07:48 <sgallagh> just missed mizmo, I guess
16:08:13 <danofsatx> yeah, I'm on CommOps team, I'll drive it there
16:08:38 <sgallagh> Thanks
16:08:44 <sgallagh> Any other business?
16:09:22 <sgallagh> Then I guess it's time to sign off and wish you well. It's been quite a ride.
16:09:25 <sgallagh> #endmeeting