fedora-design
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17:29:37 <mizmo> #startmeeting fedora-design
17:29:37 <zodbot> Meeting started Wed Apr 27 17:29:37 2022 UTC.
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17:29:57 <mizmo> #meetingtopic Fedora Design Team Meeting 27 Apr 2022
17:30:17 <mizmo> #topic Roll call
17:30:20 <mizmo> .hello duffy
17:30:21 <zodbot> mizmo: duffy 'Máirín Duffy' <fedora@linuxgrrl.com>
17:30:26 <riecatnor[m]> .hello riecatnor
17:30:26 <zodbot> riecatnor[m]: riecatnor 'Marie Nordin' <mnordin@redhat.com>
17:30:37 <jchitas> .hello jesschitas
17:30:38 <zodbot> jchitas: jesschitas 'Jess Chitas' <chitasjessica@gmail.com>
17:31:12 <MadelinePeck[m]> .hello madelinepeck
17:31:14 <zodbot> MadelinePeck[m]: madelinepeck 'Madeline Peck' <madelinepeck@gmail.com>
17:31:38 <mizmo> does anybody have anything they'd like reviewed / added to the agenda?
17:31:43 <riecatnor[m]> https://pagure.io/design/issue/808 please
17:32:30 <jchitas> nest typeface logo? i was trying out some things that i want to show to everyone
17:33:24 <mizmo> jchitas: Do you have the ticket for this handy?
17:33:35 <mizmo> i see this but no typography is that a diff ticket? https://pagure.io/design/issue/807
17:33:57 <riecatnor[m]> its that one :)
17:34:06 <jchitas> yeah thats it
17:34:15 <AnushkaJain[m]> I couldn't reply to this ticket on time due to exams, but have some discussion points- https://pagure.io/design/issue/816#comment-794302
17:35:00 <mizmo> ok cool thats a good set of stuff to discuss
17:35:06 <mizmo> ok let's jump into the banners/tablecloth one
17:35:11 <mizmo> #topic banners/tablecloths for events
17:35:18 <mizmo> #link https://pagure.io/design/issue/808
17:35:59 <riecatnor[m]> the blue gradient banner looks great
17:36:24 <MadelinePeck[m]> Yes thanks for the suggestion of the old blue to new blue Mo
17:36:37 <riecatnor[m]> for the second option, I like the gradient look the best, but the logo might need to be white?
17:37:39 <MadelinePeck[m]> riecatnor[m]: I agree- also I wasn't sure if there was an svg file out there with the original four foundations logo because the white icons there I think were just quick traces of the png I found on the fedora website
17:38:04 <riecatnor[m]> i bet Máirín Duffy would have em :)
17:38:16 <riecatnor[m]> that would be useful to put into our penpot
17:38:37 <MadelinePeck[m]> I looked through the fedora folder we have in google drive but maybe not in the right places 😄
17:38:56 * mizmo uploaded an image: (143KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/r0/download/fedora.im/e16576d5ecb21552ee4360ebe0500c8713a1c390/Screenshot%20from%202022-04-27%2013-38-47.png >
17:39:53 <riecatnor[m]> do you think we could try a version that says our four foundations underneath the logo very simply? "Freedom. Friends. Features. First."
17:40:06 * mizmo uploaded an image: (180KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/r0/download/fedora.im/329dbe1ac1d37dca0e1b925af9e7bc270babe7b9/Screenshot%20from%202022-04-27%2013-39-53.png >
17:40:32 <MadelinePeck[m]> mizmo: With this one we would need to realign the icons to be higher
17:40:47 <MadelinePeck[m]> So they're not too low to the floor/blocked by the table
17:41:12 <jchitas> MadelinePeck[m]: yeah I was just thinking that and also to get the proper svgs of the icons
17:41:28 <MadelinePeck[m]> I think if they were just shrunk and the "center" of the banner was instead at the like 3/4 high up
17:41:30 <MadelinePeck[m]> great minds think alike
17:41:57 <riecatnor[m]> what if for the second option it went dark blue, fedora blue, then each of the four colors arranged at the top somehow
17:42:14 <riecatnor[m]> either side by side or maybe in a circle type shape that gradients into blue?
17:43:41 <jchitas> riecatnor[m]: could do each logo into their own buble mayby and have the bubble be slightly transparent at one end? it makes sene in my head but i cant put it into words haha
17:43:55 <jchitas> id have to draw it out in penpt
17:44:15 * riecatnor[m] uploaded an image: (4243KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/r0/download/fedora.im/bc0dea21ff406a8b9f0e276c9748d0ab696f2f33/ima_ee9ccec.jpeg >
17:44:24 * mizmo uploaded an image: (146KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/r0/download/fedora.im/96e1ffff2736389defe76406745f652d8ab93c9e/Screenshot%20from%202022-04-27%2013-44-14.png >
17:44:53 <jchitas> riecatnor[m]: oh i see what you mean now! i could try that yeah!
17:45:08 <mizmo> with the circle idea - i like it - where would the fedora logo go?
17:45:08 * MadelinePeck[m] uploaded an image: (92KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/r0/download/fedora.im/a25856a8772dc20baccf193c5b71ddc7ee089256/ima_909f3a3.jpeg >
17:45:17 <riecatnor[m]> right there in the center
17:45:17 <jchitas> mizmo: I can try that option as well  with the logos as well!
17:45:18 <MadelinePeck[m]> Ahaha the furiously trying to mock-up the idea
17:45:24 <mizmo> MadelinePeck[m]: oooh
17:45:38 <riecatnor[m]> MadelinePeck[m]: oh i like that too
17:45:50 <MadelinePeck[m]> Obviously the logo would still be white on top I’m just on my iPad
17:46:19 <riecatnor[m]> i like the vertical idea and the circle idea
17:46:22 <jchitas> MadelinePeck[m]: i like that idea too!
17:46:31 <riecatnor[m]> can we try both? :D
17:46:43 <mizmo> ill add a folder in the shared drive with the 4 f's icons...
17:47:02 <mizmo> Jess Chitas: are you taking lead on this? do you have what you need? (save the icons which ill work on now)
17:47:49 <jchitas> mizmo: I was going t ask maybe if Madeline Peck wants to take one and I'll take the other?
17:47:56 <mizmo> riecatnor: whats your need by date
17:48:03 <jchitas> s/t/to/
17:48:33 <riecatnor[m]> next week sometime
17:48:41 <jchitas> we can split it up because its the end of the college year and assignments are getting to me 🫠
17:48:43 <riecatnor[m]> like weds/thurs
17:48:57 <MadelinePeck[m]> Yeah I can try to work on  today and tomorrow since they're high priority
17:48:58 <mizmo> and that's for print ready files right?
17:49:00 <jchitas> yeah thats posible for me!
17:49:15 <riecatnor[m]> mizmo: correct
17:49:44 <MadelinePeck[m]> Do you need the svg or what would it be exported as?
17:50:00 <MadelinePeck[m]> I've been making the mockups off the svg upright banner file Mo originally uploaded to the ticket
17:50:04 <mizmo> ok, Jess Chitas are you taking charge on getting whatever you and Madeline Peck decide on, getting it print ready? (can ya?) 72" H x 36" W , will need to be cmyk, Madeline Peck has some experience with doing that in Scribus now and can help
17:50:27 <mizmo> Madeline Peck: it'll need to be like the print-ready files for the coloring book, cmyk pdf from scribus
17:50:40 <jchitas> mizmo: yeah thats no problem!
17:51:02 <mizmo> and im thinking with a short timeline, if you end up using mesh gradients you'll want to export to high DPI bitmap for import into scribus since as we discovered scribus doesnt like inkscape mesh gradients
17:51:30 <MadelinePeck[m]> Oh okay so import the vector file into scribus and change over the colors to cmyk and export as pdf
17:51:53 <mizmo> MadelinePeck[m]: yep, that should work except if theres complex gradients in which case you'll want to separate the gradients and export as png from inkscape
17:52:03 <MadelinePeck[m]> Okay
17:52:15 <mizmo> would it be helpful to have a schedule working session to work on this sometime this week / early next week?
17:52:23 <mizmo> s/schedule/scheduled
17:52:24 <MadelinePeck[m]> Jess Chitas: we can find some time on Mon or Tues maybe to talk about this over google meets
17:52:29 <MadelinePeck[m]> ahh
17:52:59 <MadelinePeck[m]> As far as finalizing the print version
17:53:16 <jchitas> MadelinePeck[m]: thats perfect!
17:53:38 <MadelinePeck[m]> Sweet
17:53:43 <riecatnor[m]> many thanks to everyone working on this! they are going to be beautiful
17:53:52 <riecatnor[m]> feel free to ping me with questions
17:54:06 <mizmo> same here, if theres issue about getting print ready / scribus esp happy to help
17:54:07 <mizmo> cool
17:54:11 <mizmo> ok lets get to the next topic
17:54:32 <mizmo> #topic nest logo
17:54:34 <mizmo> #link https://pagure.io/design/issue/807
17:54:48 * jchitas uploaded an image: (118KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/r0/download/fedora.im/356bcc5323b85925db52d0fd1fc4f4715c884b22/more-nest-mockups.jpg >
17:55:50 <jchitas> i created some more mockups all around the same idea, i sent this to Mo and Marie but I was just wondering is there any more feedback that can be given about this?
17:56:07 <mizmo> im wondering is there a narrative or concept around the cuts made to help tell the story
17:56:14 <mizmo> like what were you thinking in these evolutions
17:56:22 <mizmo> does it tie with the mascot's design
17:56:24 <jchitas> also sorry for the line in the corner, it happens when i take a screenshot sometimes
17:56:37 <mizmo> is there a tie with the concept of nest being an at-home / virtual conf
17:56:38 <jchitas> moreso the f in the fedora logo, the way theres a cut in the f?
17:57:39 <mizmo> i kind of like the idea of it looking more "technical" than the flock logotype.... like it's digitized... because it's the "virtual" version of the conference
17:57:57 <jchitas> coz i was talking to marie about it and she was saying to give it a fedora feel so the first thing i thought of was the cut in the f
17:58:26 <jchitas> mizmo: actually yeah thats true!
17:58:44 <mizmo> (does everyone have a few more minutes to stay and discuss Anushka Jain 's ticket too? I intend to stay, hoping you can too Anushka Jain )
17:59:26 <riecatnor[m]> Máirín Duffy I was talking with Jess about the nest logo, and was like- we also need a hatch logo
17:59:27 <mizmo> I think the cuts in the lower / 3rd version are too narrow, at a small size on my screen anyway. I think the first and second with the rounded off cuts read better at a small size... i think i prefer the top one but with the rounded cut of the e in the 2nd one
17:59:36 <riecatnor[m]> would it be a good time to relook at all 3 logos and align them?
17:59:40 <riecatnor[m]> flock/nest/hatch
18:00:08 <riecatnor[m]> I am just thinking of the logo types
18:00:28 <mizmo> i suspect flock's is based on bryant2
18:01:00 <mizmo> but comfortaa would be a better base (this nest looks like comfortaa, is that right Jess?) the current fedora logo is custom based on comfortaa
18:01:20 <jchitas> yeah, the nest typeface there is comfortaa
18:01:47 * AnushkaJain[m] uploaded an image: (136KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/r0/download/matrix.org/CkHWhyhunqZOUVGTVswkewmn/Admonitions-1.png >
18:01:48 <mizmo> so we'd be looking to create another fresh logotype for hatch, then upgrade flock's to be comfortaa-based?
18:02:29 <jchitas> mizmo: yeah, thats what myself and marie were discussing, for them to all have the same feel but also be differen tin their own ways i suppose
18:02:33 <riecatnor[m]> that was my thought, since we need something for the hatch stuff.. then we would have two matching and one odd one out
18:03:00 <mizmo> cool should we create another ticket for hatch then?
18:03:54 <jchitas> i dont mind, it would seperate them then from the ticket we have now
18:04:27 <jchitas> which personally, i would prefer so that theyre all in the one place
18:04:58 <jchitas> and i can work on all 3 logos at the same time and post them all in the one ticket?
18:05:24 <jchitas> riecatnor: how similiar do you want each logo to be to eachother?
18:05:26 <mizmo> i think that would be fine, i would just update the ticket name, so that in the future when we're looking for info about the design, it'll come up
18:05:58 <mizmo> i would just call it Nest Logo / Hatch Logo / Flock Logo or something like that
18:06:04 <riecatnor[m]> jchitas: I think they should look natural if they all are sitting next to each other
18:06:11 <riecatnor[m]> if that makes sense? lol
18:06:23 <mizmo> they should look like siblings hehe
18:06:28 <riecatnor[m]> or cousins!
18:06:31 <riecatnor[m]> hehe
18:06:40 <jchitas> riecatnor[m]: natural as in they all belong to eachother?
18:07:44 <jchitas> actually moreso that you look at them and think "theyre all from the same company"?
18:07:59 <mizmo> s/company/community but yeh 🙂
18:08:28 <jchitas> yes community! sorry, ive had a long day haha
18:08:52 <riecatnor[m]> the fedora logo can be like the parent of the siblings :P
18:08:56 <riecatnor[m]> lol
18:09:10 <jchitas> perfect, I have an idea now, thanks!
18:09:32 <mizmo> cool 🙂
18:09:35 <mizmo> ok next topic
18:10:12 <AnushkaJain[m]> Hi!
18:10:13 <mizmo> #topic Fedora docs admonitions
18:10:13 <mizmo> #link https://pagure.io/design/issue/816#comment-794302
18:11:08 <AnushkaJain[m]> So, I just had two things- one was tip and note hving similar shades of blue and the other was the icon for the important tag
18:11:16 <AnushkaJain[m]> * important tag(if required)
18:11:44 <AnushkaJain[m]> So, I was thinking if we could give each one a different colour would it work?
18:12:00 * AnushkaJain[m] uploaded an image: (136KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/r0/download/matrix.org/XibDcYdkqgoFitFfWEgiTyZZ/Admonitions-1.png >
18:12:02 <mizmo> The shades of blue was by design... the more harmless the admonition, the less attention it should grab.... blue is "neutral" for fedora, so the idea was to keep notes and tips blue so they dont draw as much attention, so you can focus attention on more critical messages
18:12:20 <AnushkaJain[m]> I took the green and purple from the swaches, but yep
18:12:51 <mizmo> the shade of green in our palette is very bright on screen and esp if we were to drop to only have 3 of these categories, (tip/note/warning was suggested), the green isn't a good color to have as one of 3
18:13:03 <mizmo> it grabs too much attention
18:13:15 <AnushkaJain[m]> mizmo: Yeah, that's also true.
18:13:38 <mizmo> the docs also unfortunately use these admonition types inconsistently.... \
18:14:02 <AnushkaJain[m]> Yep, they've used whichever they wanted to
18:14:12 <mizmo> I really like the icon you came up with for important
18:15:08 <AnushkaJain[m]> I think the green wouldn't work, and now that I also think why do we need so many of these admonitions
18:15:34 <mizmo> if the docs writers dont know how to use them consistently 🙂 less is better probably
18:15:51 <AnushkaJain[m]> Can we just drop them down to two- a note and a warning?
18:16:43 <AnushkaJain[m]> More so, should^
18:16:43 <mizmo> i think that would be the doc writers call, i did notice that the Red Hat docs dropped to two, note and warning i think
18:16:44 <mizmo> let me double check
18:17:26 * mizmo uploaded an image: (14KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/r0/download/fedora.im/73e4094c85f4a2281d9950dbe2bcefa9f7a19cd2/Screenshot%20from%202022-04-27%2014-17-18.png >
18:17:39 * mizmo uploaded an image: (21KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/r0/download/fedora.im/121567aee03e651e524baf6eec6f4ed0b17b0211/Screenshot%20from%202022-04-27%2014-17-30.png >
18:17:56 * mizmo uploaded an image: (26KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/r0/download/fedora.im/4eed6f73bec45c1c1f27877e68c84690ac8563ae/Screenshot%20from%202022-04-27%2014-17-47.png >
18:18:00 <mizmo> they have note, warning, and ijmportant
18:18:35 <AnushkaJain[m]> Got it!
18:18:53 <mizmo> it might be good to follow their model
18:19:42 <AnushkaJain[m]> Although they haven't colour coded/ iconized theirs, but it's still differentiable:)
18:20:00 <mizmo> color coding isn't good to rely on bc of color blind readers
18:20:01 <AnushkaJain[m]> * still differentiable:) between the note and important
18:20:10 <AnushkaJain[m]> Yes.
18:20:15 <mizmo> they have patterns for note/important that are consistent and they use the /!\ icon for warning
18:20:25 <mizmo> the docs are also meant to be printed in some cases so it makes sense to make it greyscale friendly
18:21:39 <AnushkaJain[m]> Oh got it. That I didn't think about!
18:21:39 <AnushkaJain[m]> I think the colours we added were to grab the user's attention
18:22:00 <mizmo> fedora's docs are less likely to be printed out i think
18:22:37 <mizmo> this is what i'd suggest if cutting it down to those three
18:22:44 * mizmo uploaded an image: (51KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/r0/download/fedora.im/ebb07d0e6fccecf4a7e61c058b9471c91f140bff/Screenshot%20from%202022-04-27%2014-22-28.png >
18:23:34 <mizmo> we could make the warning stronger with a backdrop
18:24:50 <AnushkaJain[m]> Yes, but you also pointed out that we don't use pastels in fedora?
18:25:12 * mizmo uploaded an image: (51KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/r0/download/fedora.im/d4e7ac4f5ac5e3ac851b025e6cb6679d7f38f6aa/Screenshot%20from%202022-04-27%2014-25-02.png >
18:26:04 <mizmo> i think thats a good minimal boost to attention for the warnings vs the more benign notes
18:26:26 <AnushkaJain[m]> Yes. This looks good!!🤩
18:26:45 <mizmo> ok cool. What I think your next step here is to get the doc writer's buy in on this
18:26:58 <mizmo> I think Peter Boy can help you with that
18:27:09 <AnushkaJain[m]> There's a docs meeting in 5 mins. I'll ask
18:27:13 <mizmo> from a visual design POV this is definitely the Fedora look/feel
18:27:24 <mizmo> sweet thank you so much for your efforts, this is great work 🙂
18:27:39 <AnushkaJain[m]> Thankyou for helping out!
18:27:44 <MadelinePeck[m]> Yeah this is looking great Anushka Jain :)
18:28:08 <mizmo> the important icon is really clever
18:28:08 <AnushkaJain[m]> Although I don't really understand the difference between Important/Notes but that's upto the writer to decide!
18:28:13 <mizmo> i think ppl will recognize it from gmail
18:28:25 <AnushkaJain[m]> MadelinePeck[m]: Thankyou so much!😁
18:28:39 <AnushkaJain[m]> mizmo: Yes!
18:29:02 <mizmo> what i noticed in the guides i was reading is notes was just extra info or tip type stuff, whereas important was more "if this applies to you, you better do it" eg the NFS mount thing. not everyone uses NFS but if you do, you better pay attention
18:29:35 <mizmo> its not maybe super critical because your files wont be deleted and your system will still work... it's more a potential pitfall if applicable
18:29:36 <AnushkaJain[m]> Oh okk. So yes we should def go with important instead of tips
18:30:36 <mizmo> ok cool
18:30:53 <mizmo> well I'll let you get to the docs meeting, thanks for checking in 🙂
18:31:03 <AnushkaJain[m]> Thankyou everyone!😄
18:31:07 <mizmo> #endmeeting