15:00:53 <samccann> #startmeeting Documentation Working Group aka DaWGs
15:00:53 <zodbot> Meeting started Tue Oct 26 15:00:53 2021 UTC.
15:00:53 <zodbot> This meeting is logged and archived in a public location.
15:00:53 <zodbot> The chair is samccann. Information about MeetBot at https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Zodbot#Meeting_Functions.
15:00:53 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
15:00:53 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'documentation_working_group_aka_dawgs'
15:01:04 <samccann> #openingchatter
15:01:16 <samccann> So, who's around today to talk docs and all the wordy mc word word fun?
15:02:56 <samccann> andersson007_ dericcrago dmsimard gundalow tadeboro briantist cyberpear  mrproper[m] Xaroth you folks chatting docs today?
15:03:04 <gundalow> o/
15:03:09 <briantist> o/
15:03:14 <ariordan> o/
15:03:26 <samccann> #chair gundalow ariordan briantist
15:03:26 <zodbot> Current chairs: ariordan briantist gundalow samccann
15:03:36 <samccann> #topic opening chatter
15:03:38 <samccann> doh
15:03:39 <lmodemal[m]> Hello
15:03:47 <samccann> #chair lmodemal
15:03:47 <zodbot> Current chairs: ariordan briantist gundalow lmodemal samccann
15:04:14 <samccann> okay let's get started for realz
15:04:21 <samccann> #topic Action Item review
15:04:43 <samccann> #info core-2.12 docs checklist is on track for the release https://github.com/ansible/ansible/issues/75883
15:05:14 <samccann> #info docs for split controller still TBD but hoping for something soon after some other higher priority work settles
15:05:17 * acozine waves
15:05:20 <acozine> sorry I'm late
15:05:23 <samccann> #chair acozine
15:05:23 <zodbot> Current chairs: acozine ariordan briantist gundalow lmodemal samccann
15:05:36 <samccann> no worries! always have spare chairs for whenever folks get here !
15:06:20 <samccann> #info the new shading on module tables etc is up on test http://docs.testing.ansible.com/ansible/devel/collections/ansible/windows/win_domain_membership_module.html#ansible-collections-ansible-windows-win-domain-membership-module
15:07:00 <samccann> Any other action items to discuss?
15:08:26 <samccann> ariordan: how's the boilerplate text change going for collections?
15:08:32 <ariordan> https://github.com/ansible-community/antsibull/pull/324/files
15:08:41 * acozine needs to fetch her tea, BRB
15:09:02 <ariordan> It's failing a test.
15:09:37 <samccann> I wonder about :code: ? that's the only thing that looks different
15:10:00 <samccann> maybe just use two backticks ? `` ?
15:10:13 <ariordan> I copied the :code: from another sentence in the note.
15:10:28 <samccann> oh yeah, doh! nvm
15:10:29 <gundalow> Ci failure doesn't seem related to your change
15:10:29 <gundalow> `Exception: Repeated error when calling aio_session.get('https://galaxy.ansible.com/download/community-routeros-2.0.0-a2.tar.gz?format=json'): received status codes 429, 429, 429, 429, 429, 429, 429, 429, 429, 429`
15:11:00 <gundalow> I've clicked re-run on CI, should hopefully be green shortly
15:11:01 <samccann> oh gosh
15:11:14 <ariordan> I thought I'd mention it because I don't know how to check PRs on Antsibull.
15:11:45 <samccann> that's the problem we were seeing earlier. There seems to be some throttling in Galaxy since it moved to Openshift cluster back in late Aug. So yeah, retry the CI a couple of times
15:13:17 <samccann> Okay let's shift topics
15:13:29 <samccann> #topic shaded borders on plugin tables
15:13:39 <samccann> #link http://docs.testing.ansible.com/ansible/devel/collections/ansible/windows/win_domain_membership_module.html#parameters
15:14:48 <samccann> Any other testing we need to do before we give the thumbs up for this change? I've tried it on iphone(safar) and laptop with firefox, ecoasia and chrome and all LGTM
15:14:54 <acozine> I think the alternating colors look good and are helpful
15:15:51 <gundalow> Oh, that's a good improvement
15:16:06 <samccann> cyb-clock-clone sez we are 15 min into the meeting
15:16:09 <ariordan> Looks good to me.
15:17:37 <samccann> #agreed we are ready to go on the shaded border PR!
15:17:51 <samccann> (I'll have to look up what PR I'm talking about to put our thumbs up approval on it)
15:17:57 <samccann> That will be a great addition for sure
15:18:13 <samccann> ok swinging to our next hopefully quick topic
15:18:23 <samccann> #topic Meeting time change for Daylight Savings
15:18:53 <samccann> #info we tend to shift the meeting time (UTC hours) so that it remains the same time for those places who follow Daylight Savings time
15:19:30 <samccann> So, do we want to do that again this year? Mostly it's a UTC change and this meeting happens at the same time 'locally' for each of us
15:19:40 <acozine> I think last spring we changed by 30 minutes
15:19:57 <acozine> we could change back to that time, or change by an hour
15:20:01 <samccann> yeah I just don't know why. Am I not doing the math right?
15:20:23 <samccann> maybe the question is - do we want to keep this same time?
15:20:52 <samccann> The Ansible 'calendar' goes by UTC so if we don't change it, this meeting becomes one hour eaerlier and we risk losing some folks in other timezones
15:22:15 <acozine> samccann: your math is good, I think it was someone in Europe (felix, maybe?) who wanted the meeting to line up with, um, the end of hte workday? Or something???
15:22:30 <acozine> anyway, I'm okay with whatever time
15:22:34 <ariordan> I'm not free during the 30 minutes preceding the current meeting time.
15:23:15 <samccann> I snuck in to Felix before the meeting because he wasn't available and he's in favor of moving the UTC calendar so this meeting remains the same time for each of us
15:23:18 <ariordan> The current start time is 4pm for me, so it would be 5pm for Felix
15:23:50 <samccann> it's time for... a ... VOTE!
15:23:57 <lmodemal[m]> Currently, I'm fine with either time
15:24:40 <samccann> VOTE: Change the UTC calendar so the DaWGs meeting stays the same time for each of us (11am ET, 4pm Irish time, 5pm Felix time) :-)
15:24:49 * samccann time zone challenged
15:24:51 <acozine> +1
15:24:55 <samccann> +1
15:24:57 <ariordan> +1
15:25:02 <samccann> #chair
15:25:02 <zodbot> Current chairs: acozine ariordan briantist gundalow lmodemal samccann
15:26:05 <lmodemal[m]> +1
15:26:07 <briantist> +0
15:26:17 <briantist> (I'll just go with the flow, I always have meeting conflicts anyway)
15:26:30 <samccann> heh thanks briantist
15:27:05 <ariordan> Daylight saving time changes on different days in Europe and USA.
15:27:19 <samccann> #agreed Change the UTC calendar so the DaWGs meeting stays the same time for each of us (11am ET, 4pm Irish time, 5pm Felix time) :-)
15:27:27 <samccann> that's the second part of the question ariordan
15:27:47 <samccann> My nickel is we change it for next week because the rest of the world changes next week, right?
15:28:03 <samccann> i seem to recall the community meeting saying that.
15:28:05 <gundalow> +0
15:28:07 <ariordan> Yes, we change on the 31st
15:28:28 <acozine> as long as the bot knows the right time, I'm okay with it
15:28:33 <gundalow> Currently half way through the two weeks of confusion
15:28:39 <dericcrago> what UTC time is the new start time?
15:28:52 <gundalow> If the UTC time changes then the Bot's reminder will need updating
15:29:14 <gundalow> Also the `yaml` & `README.md` file in ansible/community will need updating
15:29:20 <samccann> deric.crago: not sure. I have to go look it up and change the calendar stuffs again. Usually I look at an old PR and do it
15:29:49 <samccann> #action samccann to change the yaml and README.md file in ansible/community to align with this decision
15:30:03 <samccann> Who can change the bot .. is that Gwmngilfen ?
15:30:54 <dericcrago> I think the new start time is UTC 16:00, but someone can correct me if I'm wrong
15:31:39 <samccann> #action samccann to find out who can change the meeting reminder bot to align with the UTC time change (possiblly 16:00 UTC but need to verify)
15:31:45 <samccann> okay thanks everyone!
15:32:06 * samccann cybclock-clone sez we are 32 min into the meeting
15:32:15 <briantist> I just want an update to the calendar file (ICS) that's very public so I don't forget to update mine (or to confirm if it auto-updates)
15:32:26 <briantist> so whenever it changes, please be loud about it :)
15:32:32 <samccann> #action samccann to ask same person if we can get a cybclock-clone ping on the 15 min marks here too
15:33:15 <acozine> yeah, I think the meeting time appears in two places, and there should be old PRs to copy
15:33:28 <samccann> #agreed we will change UTC meeting invites etc this week to align with Daylight Savings shift for Europe
15:33:50 <gundalow> briantist: If you've "imported by URL" (rather than download and add) then you should be good
15:34:10 <briantist> I think I have... but I don't remember 😅
15:34:13 <samccann> ok my brain hurts. For US folks - I 'think' this means next week's meeting happens one hour later? until US gets into daylight savings?
15:34:35 <gundalow> Next year maybe we just cancel the meetings for two weeks
15:34:44 <samccann> HAHAH
15:35:08 <briantist> actually that's a decent idea gundalow , to save administrative headache during the transitional period
15:36:00 <acozine> currently the meeting is at 16:00 UTC
15:36:08 <acozine> according to https://github.com/ansible/community/wiki/Docs
15:36:15 <gundalow> samccann: Looks like Nate is in the process of updating https://github.com/ansible/community/pull/632 so maybe you could push your changes into that
15:36:32 <gundalow> PR
15:37:04 <samccann> acozine: looks like we forgot to update that. google sez it is 15:37 UTC right now
15:37:26 <acozine> heh
15:37:34 <acozine> here's the PR, which is apparently wrong
15:37:35 <acozine> https://github.com/ansible/community/pull/602
15:37:59 <acozine> oh, or we updated the ical file but not the wiki page
15:38:00 <samccann> But that does answer my earlier question that this meeting will be at noon ET next week, until the US does daylight savings time
15:38:55 <acozine> yep
15:39:25 <samccann> #info For US folks - this meeting will be an hour LATER,  next week, until the US goes into Daylight Savings time the following week
15:39:41 <samccann> ok we beat  that time into an early grave... let's move on
15:40:08 <samccann> #Topic PR76088
15:40:19 <samccann> hmph
15:40:24 <samccann> #topic PR76088
15:40:26 <samccann> #link https://github.com/ansible/ansible/pull/76088/files
15:40:52 <samccann> oh wow,  a tie and everything!
15:41:24 <samccann> I think the PR may be good to go?
15:42:04 <briantist> I think so yeah, thanks everyone for the feedback :)
15:42:28 <briantist> open to any other changes if you all have anything
15:44:05 <acozine> I'd make it all active voice: `You can link to non-module plugins with ref: using hte rST anchor, but you must always supply a title, because plugin and module anchors never have their own titles.` or something like that.
15:44:15 <acozine> but I'm also happy to merge this and revisit
15:44:23 <acozine> it's an improvement over what we've got
15:44:54 <briantist> would you post the active voice edit as a suggestion so I can just commit it from the PR? 😁
15:45:04 <samccann> I can stick that in as a suggested edit and then merge
15:45:05 <acozine> briantist: yep, will do
15:45:14 <briantist> great, go for it samccann
15:45:22 <samccann> ok cool thanks acozine
15:45:33 * acozine types it up
15:45:48 <samccann> We have 15 min left, so I'm going to touch the first bit of 'ongoing work' before we open the floor
15:46:09 <samccann> #topic Should devel docs use the interim branches of devel?
15:46:55 <samccann> #info background - core is proposing to create interim branches off devel that are more stable etc. Do we want devel docs to point to those or just keep using the devel branch?
15:47:42 <samccann> #info - pros of keeping devel - we will know instantly if something has gone wrong and can highlight it to be fixed potentially before the next interim branch
15:47:54 <samccann> #info cons - we could have a busted devel docs for a bit :-)
15:48:27 <acozine> I'd vote for keeping it on devel
15:48:34 <briantist> devel, please
15:48:35 <samccann> note we have had busted devel docs before, so not a big change there. With the interim, we could always 'go back' to the last interim if the docs got totally hosed.
15:48:59 <samccann> yeah i'm also in favor of staying on devel. Wanted to get the hive minds thoughts as well
15:49:00 <briantist> it's useful to have a "most up-to-date possible" set of docs
15:49:05 <acozine> unless core is going to branch the next truly stable branch from the interim semi=stable branch
15:50:21 <acozine> best to know about the breakages as early as possible
15:50:58 <ariordan> I'd prefer to stick with devel
15:51:32 <samccann> #info we will keep the devel docs tied to the devel branch so they are the most up-to-date and if anything 'goes wrong' we will know about it asap
15:51:39 <samccann> ok cool thanks let's open the floor
15:51:43 <samccann> #topic Open Floor
15:51:48 <acozine> one more comment about devel docs
15:51:55 <samccann> go for it
15:52:35 <acozine> we might want to have a repeatable process for publishing "most recent collections plus most recent non-broken core docs on the devel branch"
15:52:45 <acozine> don't know how difficult that would be
15:52:53 <acozine> but worth putting in some thought/effort
15:52:58 <gundalow> Good question, I think continuing to use `devel` is good, we want to know what the most recent updates are
15:53:18 <samccann> that might just be as easy as a manual build with the devel-stable instead of devel (making up branch names etc)
15:53:33 <acozine> that or specify a commit
15:53:54 <acozine> like "devel docs were publishable up to CSDFJIEOWRUE, we're publishing them from there"
15:53:56 <samccann> yeah we can experiment once the first branch off devel happens.
15:54:16 <acozine> okay, I need to scamper off
15:54:24 <samccann> or yes, as you say, publish from a commit and turn off the nightly build
15:54:29 <acozine> biobreak before my next meeting at the top of the hour
15:54:33 <samccann> thanks acozine meanwhile, the floor is open!
15:54:36 <acozine> good to "see" folks!
15:54:43 <acozine> #unchair acozine
15:54:43 <zodbot> Current chairs: ariordan briantist gundalow lmodemal samccann
15:54:46 <samccann> Now's the time anyone can ask or bring up anything related to docs
15:55:06 <samccann> your fav. PR, issue? anything you want to bring up related to words :-)
15:57:35 <samccann> ok thinks seem a bit quite on the floor. If no one has anything else, I'll end this meeting with a minute or two to spare!
15:58:20 <samccann> ok thanks everyone!
15:58:24 <samccann> #endmeeting