17:59:17 <tflink> #startmeeting
17:59:17 <zodbot> Meeting started Sun Jan 30 17:59:17 2011 UTC.  The chair is tflink. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
17:59:17 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
17:59:34 <tflink> ==> next meeting in this room The next  big fedora engineering project
17:59:48 <tflink> someone else will have to transcribe, though I am switching rooms
18:04:22 * DiscordianUK hopes someone will transcribe
18:05:41 <Nushio> Fedora RPG:
18:05:44 <Nushio> Badges, avatars
18:06:10 <Nushio> trophies, items
18:06:35 <Nushio> Goals for packagers, triagers, documentation, design
18:06:38 <Nushio> each would grant 'points'
18:07:04 <Nushio> http://picasaweb.google.com/nushio/fudcon
18:07:20 <Nushio> errhttp://picasaweb.google.com/nushio/fudcon#5568041974601117010
18:07:26 <Nushio> http://picasaweb.google.com/nushio/fudcon#5568042054146444834
18:07:28 <nb> #chair nushio
18:07:34 <Nushio> http://picasaweb.google.com/nushio/fudcon#5568041974601117010
18:07:48 <Nushio> spot: The idea is to get things done 'easy' and 'fun' for new contributors
18:08:03 <Nushio> 'every bug i triage succesfully, i get a point'
18:08:10 <Nushio> 'every conference, wiki edit, etc'
18:08:28 <Nushio> 'a quest could be edit a wiki page, organize an event, get a trophy'
18:08:52 <Nushio> 'yes, people will always try to 'game' this system, but we'd have to have moderators to prevent people from 'gaming' the system'
18:09:27 <Nushio> You wouldn't get the points until someone went and doublechecked that the points granted are valid
18:10:18 <Nushio> we want this to be a community driven thing, so we would like other communities to submit puzzles and requests
18:10:31 <Nushio> city of heroes did this where they let people create their missions
18:10:58 <Nushio> city of heroes did it wrong, but they at least did something
18:11:30 <Nushio> spot: this is a very mockup, items and points are not useful just virtual flair
18:12:12 <Nushio> there's a lot of people grinding on web games, if we can get them to triage bugs, we win
18:13:13 <Nushio> OH: Bugzilla has some sort of a karma system
18:14:02 <Nushio> Spot: If we have a lot of people doing bug triage, we simply lower the reward for bug triaging
18:14:14 <Nushio> different points for different tasks
18:14:37 <Nushio> older bugs might be worth more than newer bugs
18:15:32 <Nushio> OH: Learning is a skill, so getting a lot of bugs solved would list that you hav ea lot of skills
18:16:00 <Nushio> mairin: the system planned already has badges, so each badge would be a different skill or something like it
18:16:08 <Nushio> (The system is currently just in planning stages)
18:16:15 <Nushio> each team in fedora could grant different badges
18:16:48 <Nushio> spot: there's always going to be people trying to 'game the game' and we don't want someone suddenly becoming a system admin :P
18:17:13 <Nushio> OH: Achievements and stuff are extraordinarily addictive
18:17:26 <Nushio> spot: human instinct would get people help us with the task
18:18:32 <Nushio> spot: the guy who only invests 2 hours a week on the game because he's got 'real life stuff' doesn't mean he's a low fedora contributor
18:18:43 <Nushio> its just a way for contirbutors to have a visual way to see what they've done
18:19:02 <Nushio> its a social way to do requests
18:19:11 <Nushio> instead of having a "boring" ticket on a ticketing system
18:19:48 <Nushio> James Laska: there's a lot of people doing QA investing a lot of time
18:20:02 <Nushio> spot: and they'd be moderators of sorts, adding quests/tasks for others to solve and do
18:20:29 <Nushio> alright, next big fedora idea
18:20:56 <Nushio> (more info on fedora rpg: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Fedora_RPG )
18:21:08 <Nushio> alright, next up, Fedora Community
18:21:35 <Nushio> The idea here is for packagers
18:21:40 <Nushio> to be able to search packages and stuff
18:22:09 <Nushio> #link: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/community/
18:22:17 <Nushio> http://picasaweb.google.com/nushio/fudcon#5568045965850693058
18:22:30 <Nushio> He wants to add more google stuff to have real time searching and making it a lot faster
18:22:39 <Nushio> clicking links and getting a lot more info
18:23:08 <Nushio> when we click on a package, we can see if there's any versions in testing, in rawhide, how many open bugs there are
18:23:19 <Nushio> we also want to have info on what the latest upstream version is
18:23:34 <Nushio> and what patches we've had, and maybe what patches other distros like ubuntu has on their system that they're applying
18:23:41 <Nushio> and that should be sent upstrea
18:23:44 <Nushio> consolidate a lot of data
18:24:14 <Nushio> integrate and fix everything faster with fedora community
18:24:23 <Nushio> we can also check who the package maintainer(s) are
18:24:39 <Nushio> and be able to 'ping' the person and ask "why haven't we gotten the latest version'
18:25:10 <Nushio> OH: One guy on debian is using a small application to see what packages are related to each other
18:25:31 <Nushio> that way we could have some sort of database that would get stuff like IM Packages and see related packages
18:26:04 <Nushio> OH: This has a lot of info that's on pkgdb
18:26:15 <Nushio> and now we have to jump through 2 or 3 different apps just to do something
18:26:24 <Nushio> john: we want to streamline all the info and consolidate it
18:26:34 <Nushio> #link: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/pkgdb
18:26:56 <Nushio> eventually, we want to be able to display the source code of all the packages
18:27:48 <Nushio> Another thing we want to do is link to an email/alerts system that will notify interested parties on package updates
18:28:15 <Nushio> spot: one thing we want to have is a real time message bus
18:28:27 <Nushio> so that we can have a service that pings all the other webapps about changes in real time
18:29:34 <Nushio> john: we need to define how the message would be defined in a standarized way so that all apps could listen to it
18:29:48 <Nushio> and we got caught up with day to day things so we haven't actually written proposals on this
18:30:43 <Nushio> OH: We want integration with command line tools
18:31:03 <Nushio> when we do rpm -qi {package} it should output 'here is the url for more info'
18:31:28 <Nushio> alright, fedora community's done
18:32:06 <Nushio> ian weller's up
18:32:14 <Nushio> he's been working on a command line tool called mw
18:32:22 <Nushio> some sort of a version control command line to edit media wiki
18:32:53 <Nushio> he has no time to work on it but knows that there's a lot of people that would like to get this working
18:33:02 <Nushio> what he wants is people to get this working, he has some code done
18:33:30 <Nushio> this could be used for bot editing done quickly
18:33:38 <Nushio> http://picasaweb.google.com/nushio/fudcon#5568048901117662018
18:34:03 <Nushio> alright, mairin duffy is up next, so prepare yourselves for a picture overflow
18:34:22 <Nushio> she's gonna propose somtehing related to mailing lists
18:34:35 <Nushio> http://picasaweb.google.com/nushio/fudcon#5568049137313437570 <--- the hotdog represents progress
18:34:39 <Nushio> err, the mustard
18:35:00 <Nushio> what she's proposing is to bring mailing lists to 2011
18:35:19 <Nushio> have some sort of web ui to mailman
18:35:47 <Nushio> http://picasaweb.google.com/nushio/fudcon#5568049448730280706
18:36:03 <Nushio> #link more info on this: https://mairin.wordpress.com/2010/03/16/a-rich-web-interface-for-mailing-lists/
18:36:10 <Nushio> this could have a kudos system
18:36:15 <Nushio> (which would tie to the rpg system)
18:36:22 <Nushio> some people don't like blogging but like emailing
18:36:25 <Nushio> and this would get published
18:36:41 <Nushio> in a web-ui
18:38:02 <Nushio> having a webui would give us more controls to lock topics
18:38:15 <Nushio> http://picasaweb.google.com/nushio/fudcon#5568050057242695410
18:38:41 <Nushio> http://picasaweb.google.com/nushio/fudcon#5568050204113976786
18:38:45 <Nushio> this idea predates stack exchange
18:38:50 <Nushio> but it is similar to it
18:39:11 <Nushio> oh: there's already some project called "group server"
18:39:13 <Nushio> at groupserver.org
18:39:16 <Nushio> its similar to google groups
18:39:30 <Nushio> it also migrates from mailman, but we'd have to abandon mailman
18:40:58 <Nushio> http://picasaweb.google.com/nushio/fudcon#5568050786158725538
18:41:21 <Nushio> mo: one idea is to have 'levels' per person
18:41:31 <Nushio> so if the system knows who the person is, the mail wouldn't have to be bounced
18:41:34 <Nushio> or moderated
18:41:55 <Nushio> spot: mailman would generate this content
18:42:02 <Nushio> the idea here is to extend mailman, not replace it
18:43:11 <Nushio> oh: a good place to start is to regenerate the archives
18:43:52 <Nushio> mo: this could be a layer on it
18:44:06 <Nushio> that could let you filter "i only want to listen to people level 5 or more"
18:44:15 <Nushio> get rss feeds of everything too
18:45:15 <Nushio> clint: i sorta see this as microblogging
18:45:20 <Nushio> this is just another way to have conversations
18:46:28 <Nushio> lots of people interested in this
18:46:33 <Nushio> but time's up for that topic
18:46:58 <Nushio> now mo's showing the rpg system
18:47:07 <Nushio> she'd like to have some sort of a system that could tag pieces of a picture
18:47:15 <Nushio> and get conversations running on it
18:47:34 <Nushio> alright, next up
18:47:57 <Nushio> making our infrastructure real time
18:48:02 <Nushio> getting some sort of a message broker
18:48:11 <Nushio> he wants to rewrite bodhi to support amqp
18:48:40 <Nushio> he wants some sort of a real time web interface
18:48:49 <Nushio> next idea is bridging upstream
18:48:59 <Nushio> we already have a tool called cnucnu
18:49:06 <Nushio> #link http://fedorapeople.org/gitweb?p=till/public_git/cnucnu.git;a=summary
18:49:08 <Nushio> it looks for new releases
18:49:19 <Nushio> he'd love to see this tied to the packagedb
18:49:33 <Nushio> he'd like to automate this
18:49:46 <Nushio> next up, for meeting we currently use a meetbot plugin for supybot
18:49:51 <Nushio> its great but it spits out html and other formats
18:49:59 <Nushio> he'd like to see a web interface on top of it
18:50:47 <Nushio> meeting app would be fantastic
18:50:56 <Nushio> next up, the mailing app that mo mentioned
18:51:06 <Nushio> he says he wrote a lot of code on it
18:51:08 <Nushio> next up, spin meeting
18:51:24 <Nushio> a lot of comments were made, and he'd like to get some more automation to the spins process
18:52:01 <Nushio> next up continous integration with packaging
18:52:13 <Nushio> get a line-by-line diff when an update is pushed
18:52:28 <Nushio> some web interface to show it, and display annotations and comments from all the users
18:52:41 <Nushio> this would let all users to look at the code
18:53:05 <Nushio> http://picasaweb.google.com/nushio/fudcon#5568053909536938498
18:54:13 <Nushio> next up
18:54:25 <Nushio> we have a mediawiki where documents go to die
18:54:44 <Nushio> http://picasaweb.google.com/nushio/fudcon#5568054338687802498
18:54:52 <Nushio> we need to come up with a list of stuff that we do not want to keep
18:54:54 <Nushio> and get rid of it
18:55:30 <Nushio> he's showing a giant list of thing we currently have
18:56:14 <Nushio> http://picasaweb.google.com/nushio/fudcon#5568054733084473778
18:56:25 <Nushio> we'd like to have some sort of a way to automate build overrides
18:56:30 <Nushio> and get a bigger quota on fedora people
18:56:36 <Nushio> http://picasaweb.google.com/nushio/fudcon#5568054818937729026
18:56:55 <Nushio> we want to have a small engineering project which we would all help us
18:58:14 <Nushio> Transifex problems
18:58:38 <Nushio> there's a lot of little things we can do that will make our lives easier
19:00:22 <Nushio> out of time, thanks for listening!
19:43:52 * nb wonders if nushio was talking about quota increases need to be automated
19:44:12 <nb> right now there is a way to request it, just ifle a ticket on the infrastructure trac with a short explanation of what you want to use it for
19:44:23 <nb> and any sysadmin-tools or sysadmin-main can grant it
20:14:56 <tflink> anyone transcribing?
20:15:09 <nb> not so far
20:15:19 <tflink> #endmeeting