21:02:41 <heidie> #startmeeting
21:02:41 <zodbot> Meeting started Tue Oct 14 21:02:41 2014 UTC.  The chair is heidie. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
21:02:41 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
21:03:01 <heidie> Note that whatever we type now will go into the notes until we end the meeting.
21:03:06 <heidie> We have an agenda here:
21:03:10 <heidie> #link http://foss2serve.org/index.php/IRC_Meeting_1
21:03:37 <MeilaniConley> Hello!
21:03:39 <heidie> The main goal of this meeting is to become comfortable interacting on IRC.
21:04:05 <heidie> The first task is to introduce ourselves. Let's do this alphabetically by nick.
21:04:12 <heidie> ChrisMurphy: That would be you!
21:04:15 <ChrisMurphy> yeah!
21:04:26 <heidie> If you use the #info tag, what you type will go into the neatly formatted notes.
21:04:44 <ChrisMurphy> #info I'm Chris Murphy. I'm an Assoc Prof of Practice at UPenn and I teach our software engineering courses.
21:05:07 <heidie> Wonderfuls.
21:05:13 <heidie> Ah, I'm next.
21:05:35 <heidie> #info I'm Heidi Ellis and I teach at Western New England University. I have been involving students in HFOSS since 2006.
21:06:08 <heidie> Note that j*nie is one of the Accessibility Team co-leads.
21:06:24 <lorip> I'm Lori Postner.  I teach at Nassau Community College in NY and am one of the POSSE organizers.
21:06:26 <heidie> I left out her middle vowels so that we didn't "ping" her unnecessarily.
21:06:44 <lorip> oops, I forgot my info tag, I'll re-post
21:06:45 <meghan_> #info I'm Meghan Allen, an Instructor in CS at the University of British Columbia. I got my tenure-track job this year and have been teaching in CS in a contract role since 2007. I have taught our CS2 and Intro to Software Engineering course many times and have supervised students working on FOSS projects, but never HFOSS.
21:07:03 <lorip> #info I'm Lori Postner. I teach at Nassau Community College in NY and am one of the POSSE organizers.
21:07:08 <MeilaniConley> #info I'm Meilani Conley. I am an Instructor at Southwest Baptist University and I teach Computer & Information Science and Web Design courses. I am new to FOSS.
21:08:11 <Rduvall> #info I’m Robert Duvall (not the actor :). I am a Lecturer at Duke University as part of the CompSci Education Group.  I teach software design and development courses (mobile, web, graphics, etc.).
21:08:16 <heidie> :-)
21:08:46 * heidie notes that it looks like scrain6 is "away"
21:09:03 <stoney> ruby?
21:09:16 <heidie> She may also be away, but not have indicated so.
21:09:20 <stoney> #info Stoney Jackson, Western New England University - I’m one of the POSSE organizers - I teach web systems and various software development courses - I’ve developed on MouseTrap and supervised students working on MouseTrap (an HFOSS project)
21:09:31 <heidie> scrain6: is away because he is in italics on my client, and grayed out a bit.
21:10:04 <swapnee__> #info I'm Swapneel Sheth - a lecturer at UPenn. I teach software engineering, web programming, and such.
21:10:32 <heidie> zanmello?
21:10:48 <heidie> She may not be paying attention at this moment. She was in yesterday's meeting officially.
21:11:12 <heidie> Note that the formatted notes from yesterday look like this:
21:11:14 <heidie> http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/foss2serve/2014-10-13/foss2serve.2014-10-13-23.00.html
21:12:09 <heidie> What questions do folks have about IRC?
21:12:21 <heidie> Any questions about how it is used? when it is used? conventions?
21:13:14 <meghan_> I've found the lists of commands, but is there a page on etiquette?
21:13:35 * heidie looks
21:13:42 <stoney> #link http://www.ircbeginner.com/ircinfo/etiquette.html
21:13:47 <Rduvall> Or what tags to use?
21:14:10 <stoney> The tags are for the meetbot
21:14:19 * stoney looking for list of meetbot tags
21:14:34 <heidie> I like this:
21:14:37 <heidie> #link http://www.livinginternet.com/r/ru_chatq.htm
21:14:37 <stoney> #link https://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot
21:14:55 <heidie> And this iss also good:
21:14:57 <heidie> #link http://geoff.greer.fm/2012/05/19/programmer-irc-etiquette/
21:15:26 <stoney> the MeetBot here is zodbot
21:15:28 <heidie> The italics (may be another color or font depending on your client) indicate thoughts and actions.
21:15:45 <stoney> it responds to those tags when they come first
21:15:47 <heidie> You can get them by using the /me  command at the beginning of the line.
21:15:55 <meghan_> Thanks, Heidi. Those are useful. I had found some but wasn't sure how good they were
21:16:14 <heidie> There is a difference between IRC commands which start at the beginning of a line with a /
21:16:29 <heidie> and meetbot commands which are at the beginning of a line and start with a hash tag.
21:17:04 <heidie> The meetbot commands aid in formatting the notes and let you do things like create a "to do" list with actions, identify important links to information and more.
21:17:32 <heidie> The general etiquette in the open source world is when you join a project, you hang out on the IRC channel.
21:17:52 <Rduvall> But it seems to be missing a lot of the discussion included in the log from yesterday’s meeting — does it only recorded things that start with tags?
21:17:54 <heidie> Sort of like a virtual office. If someone pings you, you can answer or not depending on your busyness.
21:18:13 <heidie> And here is the complete log:
21:18:16 <heidie> #link http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/foss2serve/2014-10-13/foss2serve.2014-10-13-23.00.log.html
21:18:21 <Rduvall> It being the meetbot :)
21:18:31 <heidie> Yes, It = meetbot
21:18:43 <lorip> I posted both the complete log as well as the meetbot minutes
21:18:46 <heidie> And the meetbot will typically spit out three things at the end.
21:19:04 <heidie> The complete log, the formatted minutes in HTML and minutes in plain text.
21:19:15 <heidie> Only those things preceeded by the hashtag get put into the minutes.
21:19:21 <heidie> Oh, I forgot to set the topic!
21:19:31 <heidie> #topic Introductions (retroactive)
21:20:09 <stoney> not all chatrooms have a meetbot
21:20:37 <stoney> someone has to “install” one in the room
21:20:37 <heidie> Ah, right, good point.
21:21:16 <stoney> however, most clients allow one to keep a personal log of everything “spoken” in a channel
21:21:35 <Rduvall> Is there a way then to access a public log for past conversations (to say “catch up” on what is happening)?
21:21:44 <heidie> Another important point is that you never know who is in the chat room. I've had students chatting with Stormy Peters, Head of Engagement at Mozilla and not know it.
21:21:52 <stoney> only if someone is posting the logs
21:21:58 <heidie> Yes, usually they are posted somewhere on the project web site.
21:22:10 <stoney> for example...
21:22:13 <stoney> #link https://wiki.gnome.org/Projects/MouseTrap/Meetings
21:23:22 <heidie> MouseTrap is the project that Stoney and I are working on.
21:23:44 <heidie> It is a GNOME Accessibility project that uses a webcam to follow user head movement and move the cursor accordingly.
21:24:39 <stoney> another example...
21:24:41 <stoney> #link http://eden.sahanafoundation.org/wiki/Chat
21:25:39 <lorip> here's another example
21:25:44 <lorip> #link https://wiki.openmrs.org/display/IRC/Logs+-+OpenMRS
21:26:49 <heidie> Are there any other questions about IRC and their use?
21:27:13 <heidie> I'm typically on five or so channels for much of the day. OTher folks are on for more limited times.
21:28:18 <heidie> OK, next topic
21:28:25 <heidie> #topic HFoss Projects
21:28:34 <heidie> Have folks started to look at HFOSS projects?
21:28:38 <heidie> Which one's appeal?
21:29:01 <swapnee__> I'm interested in the ushahidi one
21:29:10 <meghan_> I'm interested in OpenMRS
21:29:19 <lorip> here's a link to the projects heidie is referring to
21:29:22 <lorip> #link http://foss2serve.org/index.php/HFOSS_Communities
21:30:02 <MeilaniConley> I have been looking at Sahana and OpenMRS
21:30:33 <heidie> Ah, good! meghan_ what do you like about OpenMRS?
21:31:00 <ChrisMurphy> yes, I'm interested in OpenMRS, too. We do a lot of software projects with the Nursing and Medical schools here at Penn.
21:31:10 <heidie> Ah, so a natural synergy.
21:31:52 <meghan_> I'm interested because it's about medical records. My son has type 1 diabetes so I'm becoming more interested in medical software in general as I think about what might help him
21:32:02 <heidie> We have just found out that there will be an OpenMRS representative at the meeting next month.
21:32:16 <meghan_> great!
21:32:39 <heidie> Yes, it is a plus to be able to meet someone from the group f2f.
21:32:49 * lorip thinking, my daughter has type 1
21:33:17 <heidie> Ah interesting.
21:33:33 <heidie> swapnee__: What did you like about Ushahidi?
21:34:28 <swapnee__> I've done projects in the class with city data (NYC Open Data, Philly Open data) in the past so I like these kinds of projects
21:34:45 <swapnee__> #link https://nycopendata.socrata.com/
21:34:47 <Rduvall> Through my course that lets students develop apps for local groups (mostly non-profit) and researchers, I have touched on some aspect of most of these topics. I think though, that personally, ushahidi, since it has aspects of graphics and my sister lives in Africa (Ghana, so not really close to Kenya, but still :)
21:34:52 <swapnee__> #link http://opendataphilly.org/
21:35:06 * stoney looking
21:35:12 <heidie> Ah, right! I hope that your sister stays safe Rduvall !
21:35:25 <stoney> cool
21:35:31 <heidie> Yes, cool!
21:35:49 <lorip> meilani - thoughts on Sahana vs OpenMRS?
21:36:11 <heidie> As an aside, swapnee__ and Rduvall, have been to any local hacks?  We've had a HackMIT and HackRPI in our general area.
21:36:53 <MeilaniConley> #info What I like about Sahana is how it is helping to communities in disaster areas. I truly believe the software they have would have been beneficial with alerting communities such as Joplin, MO (hit by a tornado). It was a scramble to get resources to them on time. Even months after it was difficult. The efforts from Sahana are priceless. Especially since real-time news/weather warnings are not real-time.
21:37:07 <MeilaniConley> #info they are typically 7 minutes behind.
21:37:38 <swapnee__> not to participate, but to watch.. PennApps is pretty big here
21:37:59 <Rduvall> Yes, hacks have become a big deal with our students. Duke is trying to position itself as the Southeast “capitial”, like MIT or UPenn, with its HackDuke group.
21:38:05 <Rduvall> #link http://www.hackduke.org
21:38:25 <stoney> gotta run… I’ll talk to you all real soon!… good to meet you all!
21:38:30 <MeilaniConley> #info For OpenMRS - I used to work for a healthcare IT company and a lot of the ideas and passion behind helping others marries well with the concepts and software provided by OpenMRS. I had never heard of it before this and it would be crucial to communities our school helps internationally. We have PT students that travel to different countries to offer healthcare.
21:38:51 <heidie> Ah, cool!
21:38:52 <MeilaniConley> #Software like that provided by OpenMRS is pretty amazing
21:38:59 <heidie> Yes, :-)
21:39:07 <heidie> Anyone else?
21:39:10 <Rduvall> Last year we did one specifically for social good and got some very interesting projects.
21:39:18 <Rduvall> #link http://spring2014.hackduke.org
21:40:37 <MeilaniConley> Cool! - Rduvall
21:40:39 <Rduvall> Is there an “easy” way to tell how far along these projects are or how “complex” they are?
21:40:39 <heidie> Cool!
21:40:57 <heidie> Rduvall: OpenMRS and Sahana and Ushahidi?
21:41:20 <heidie> These are all mature projects that have been deployed and used for humanitarian purposes. Is that what you're asking/
21:41:22 <heidie> ?
21:41:41 <Rduvall> Yes but, in general, that is my primary concern with giving students access to open source projects.
21:42:46 <heidie> All of those projects are mature and have had students working on them for well over a year.
21:42:57 <heidie> Sahana has had student contributors since 2006.
21:43:11 <lorip> rduvall I'm not sure I understand your concern
21:43:13 <heidie> And all projects are interested in gaining more contributors.
21:45:25 <Rduvall> I understand that, but not all students are ready to simply wade into a repo or issue log and start contributing.  So I was asking if there was an “easy” way to go one step further in judging that a project might be a good fit before having to look at code.
21:45:58 <Rduvall> One step past the project’s “abstract”
21:46:33 <heidie> Ah, good question!
21:46:35 <ChrisMurphy> Rduvall I assume you mean "open-source projects in general" not "the particular ones mentioned above"? I think that's the disconnect here
21:46:39 <heidie> One major issue is language.
21:48:24 <lorip> Rduvall: there are lots of ways that students can contribute to a HFOSS project without writing code
21:48:31 <heidie> And one reason for working within the "humanitarian" area is that these projects are typically very welcoming to students.
21:48:43 <lorip> and yes, it can be daunting to through them into a repo!
21:48:52 <Rduvall> Yes, in general, but I am not sure it not an issue here too.  Suppose I decide I am interested in Ushahidi based on its description.  I still need to do a lot of work to see if it is an appropriate fits for my skills as well as my interests.
21:49:23 <heidie> Rduvall: Yes.
21:49:34 <heidie> we have an exercise on evaluating a project in Part B coming up.
21:49:44 <heidie> Where you'll actually go through the process of evaluating a project.
21:50:02 <heidie> We have identified a set of "critical" criteria and then some lesser criteria.
21:50:12 <Rduvall> Great!  I am here to learn about some of those other ways besides code as well as how to get students started.  Perhaps I was just starting the discussion a little early :)
21:50:48 <heidie> Not too early at all! Good to be looking for the variety of opportunities for students to contribute.
21:52:15 <heidie> The team actually has come up with "50 ways to be a fosser" (sung to Paul Simon's '50 ways to leave your lover') :-)
21:52:26 <heidie> Thanks to Clif Kussmaul.
21:52:41 <heidie> Are there other questions?
21:53:19 <Rduvall> Cool — not that I am inclined to sing in front of my students (or anyne for that matter).
21:53:27 <ChrisMurphy> I'm sorry, I have to go catch my train! Looking forward to meeting everyone next month
21:53:36 <heidie> right, me either. There is a reason why I went into a non-performance discipline!
21:53:51 <heidie> If no one has anything else, we can call this meeting.
21:54:02 <meghan_> some of the activities say we should put our answers on our faculty wiki page, is that on the participants page for the Nov POSSE?
21:54:17 <heidie> Yes, that's right meghan_
21:54:24 <meghan_> thanks
21:54:28 <heidie> :-)
21:54:53 <lorip> before we sign off - any travel questions?
21:55:08 * heidie thinks that Lori asks good questions!
21:56:01 <MeilaniConley> I booked my travel, but do I need to notify Darci that I did?
21:56:39 <lorip> if you can confirm your arrival and departure dates with darci that would be great!
21:56:40 <heidie> Nope, just bring the receipts with you MeilaniConley
21:56:45 <heidie> :-)
21:56:52 <MeilaniConley> Ok cool :)
21:57:06 <meghan_> Do we need a confirmation for the hotel booking?
21:57:23 <heidie> meghan_: Nope, information on hotel will be coming soon.
21:57:30 <meghan_> great
21:57:32 <heidie> We are now in the process of finalizing the room block.
21:58:18 <heidie> We are staying at the Sheraton Raleigh Hotel (421 South Salisbury St)
21:58:37 <heidie> http://www.sheratonraleigh.com/
21:58:44 <MeilaniConley> Similar to the airfare we do the same for a roundtrip shuttle to and from the airport correct?
21:58:53 <heidie> And we will make your hotel reservation for you.
21:59:05 <lorip> MeilaniConley: yes
21:59:14 <heidie> We're hoping to get you shuttle information when we send hotel info.
21:59:16 <MeilaniConley> Thanks Lori!
21:59:23 <heidie> Yes, lilkely that you'll neeed to catch  shuttle.
21:59:24 <MeilaniConley> Ok great :)
22:00:26 <heidie> OK, it is almost 6:00.  I tend to hang out in this channel so feel free to ping me with questions.
22:00:30 <heidie> #endmeeting