18:01:12 <stickster> #startmeeting Fedora Insight
18:01:12 <zodbot> Meeting started Thu Apr 22 18:01:12 2010 UTC.  The chair is stickster. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
18:01:13 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
18:01:20 <stickster> #meetingname Fedora Insight
18:01:20 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'fedora_insight'
18:01:30 <stickster> #topic Roll call
18:01:31 * stickster 
18:01:36 * rbergeron 
18:01:42 * stickster wonders if pcalarco is back around
18:02:02 <rbergeron> i think he said he wasn't back until after the 24th
18:02:09 * rbergeron thinks it's in last mtg logs; will check quickly
18:02:11 <stickster> ping gwerra mchua_afk or anyone else interested
18:02:37 <rbergeron> gwerra is on a plane or a bus or something.... mass transportation
18:02:49 * rbergeron swears she is not such bad company :)
18:03:11 <stickster> Hm.
18:03:32 * mchua here
18:03:34 <stickster> Today is our go/no-go meeting, it's disappointing we don't have more people here
18:03:40 <stickster> Ah, well three's company at least :-)
18:03:50 <rbergeron> indeed :)
18:03:59 <rbergeron> we have a tiebreaker *grin*
18:04:20 * stickster notices that .ticket 2111 isn't on agenda yet
18:04:21 <stickster> Hang on
18:04:33 <rbergeron> oh
18:04:36 <stickster> done
18:04:36 <rbergeron> i thought it was?
18:04:47 * rbergeron is pretty sure she put it there but maybe just in the list of tickets
18:04:55 <stickster> 's OK
18:05:08 * stickster calls up all the tickets
18:05:17 <stickster> Let's go by severity
18:05:21 <stickster> That will make things easier.
18:05:24 <mateo> Hey people!
18:05:31 <stickster> Hi mateo
18:05:40 <rbergeron> pcalarco is back on 4/27
18:05:46 <mateo> I'll perform a detailed debug on the Auth issue on the night (GMT-3)
18:05:52 <rbergeron> according to logs
18:06:26 <stickster> Let's start with #2105
18:06:29 <stickster> .ticket 2105
18:06:31 <zodbot> stickster: #2105 (Fedora Insight is giving all new users Administrators access) - Fedora Infrastructure - Trac - https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-infrastructure/ticket/2105
18:06:48 <stickster> I think this is actually fixed now. The problem was on line 52 of pnuserapi.php
18:06:58 <stickster> Using a = instead of a == for a comparison is bad :-)
18:06:58 * rbergeron nods
18:07:04 <mchua> #link https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-infrastructure/query?status=new&status=assigned&status=reopened&keywords=%7EZikula&keywords=%7EFedora+Insight&order=priority
18:07:08 <mchua> represents our queue, aiui
18:07:11 <mchua> for the record
18:07:40 <mateo> = instead == is bad indeed :-P
18:07:53 <mateo> so, no 403 error ATM?
18:07:56 <stickster> This one becomes only critical now
18:08:01 <stickster> mateo: One at a time please
18:08:17 <rbergeron> mateo - getting there - that's a different one :)
18:08:27 <mateo> ah, ok
18:08:42 <stickster> #info ticket 2105 now fixed, but bugfix needs to be released in fedora-zikula module.
18:08:57 <stickster> So I'm not closing that one yet
18:08:57 <stickster> But it's no longer a blocker.
18:09:07 <stickster> Grr
18:09:10 <stickster> #topic Blocker bugs
18:09:16 <mchua> ah - folks, I've got to take a keyboard break now, but will be reading periodically and chiming in at the end, ping me if you need me (though I don't think I'm blocking anything)
18:09:18 <stickster> #info see above for a few tickets
18:09:21 <stickster> mchua: Cool, np
18:09:28 <stickster> .ticket 2107
18:09:32 <zodbot> stickster: #2107 (Fedora Insight publications not shown purely in date order on index) - Fedora Infrastructure - Trac - https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-infrastructure/ticket/2107
18:09:38 <stickster> #undo
18:09:38 <zodbot> Removing item from minutes: <MeetBot.items.Info object at 0x2b03afc9fb90>
18:09:45 <stickster> #info see above for a few tickets
18:09:55 <rbergeron> #link http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Fedora_Insight#Agenda
18:09:57 <stickster> oops, wrong ticket, I thought I needed to #undo it but it wasn't #link'd.
18:10:02 <stickster> rbergeron: Thank you.
18:10:06 <stickster> I'm out of order today. In many ways.
18:10:15 <rbergeron> stickster: me too. :)
18:10:21 <stickster> .ticket 2109
18:10:22 <zodbot> stickster: #2109 (Style changes needed for Fedora Insight) - Fedora Infrastructure - Trac - https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-infrastructure/ticket/2109
18:10:26 <stickster> That one is a blocker.
18:10:46 <stickster> Style changes needed for roll-out. I know that gwerra said he had time to work on this starting tomorrow
18:10:50 <stickster> Because he will be on break.
18:10:52 <rbergeron> stickster: hiemanshu / gwerra said that he'd be back online this evening - he hopes to get the styling / etc stuff he was committed to fixed by 4/23.
18:11:04 <rbergeron> or... what you just said.
18:11:37 <stickster> #info gwerra said he can make changes by 4/23, so... soft blocker until tomorrow
18:11:48 <stickster> But tomorrow is the latest those could be done if we are to get to staging.
18:11:57 <stickster> The bigger problem is...
18:11:59 <stickster> .ticket 2111
18:12:00 <zodbot> stickster: #2111 (Logging into Fedora Insight when not in cmsadmin group gives 403 error) - Fedora Infrastructure - Trac - https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-infrastructure/ticket/2111
18:12:10 <mateo> ah, that one...
18:12:17 <rbergeron> so mateo - on this ticket - this is the 403 issue
18:12:25 <stickster> 403 errors for people who register and enter the site.
18:12:32 <rbergeron> the 403 is given to users whenthey log in - but not administrators
18:12:41 <rbergeron> or rather - not people in the Cmsadmin group
18:13:20 <stickster> Now... on top of those problems...
18:13:25 <rbergeron> so it seems - or it may be unrelated, but - that fixing the 'everyone gets admin' issue - now makes sure only cmsadmin group folks get admin rights, but nobody else can log in.
18:13:38 <mateo> I guess I know why it happens....
18:13:48 <mateo> trying to call an admin method, but without privilegies: fail
18:14:25 <mateo> a detailed error location can be shown enabling the development mode on the /config/config.php
18:14:26 <stickster> We also have a number of critical issues discovered so far
18:14:55 <stickster> such as #2107
18:15:20 <stickster> .ticket 2107
18:15:21 <zodbot> stickster: #2107 (Fedora Insight publications not shown purely in date order on index) - Fedora Infrastructure - Trac - https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-infrastructure/ticket/2107
18:16:07 <rbergeron> stickster: i think we determined why that might be happening - if you don't specifically set the date in the box when you create the content
18:16:08 <stickster> .ticket 2106
18:16:09 <zodbot> stickster: #2106 (Fedora Insight story titles on index page don't link correctly) - Fedora Infrastructure - Trac - https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-infrastructure/ticket/2106
18:16:12 <rbergeron> aka the publish date
18:16:27 <rbergeron> it seems to do that - but if you set the date, rather than leaving it blank, it functions correctly
18:16:34 <rbergeron> so that could be a matter of documentation
18:16:50 <rbergeron> as a workaround
18:17:03 <stickster> Hm
18:17:17 <stickster> Well, be that as it may
18:17:18 <mateo> publish date? should be set automatically if is blank
18:17:22 * rbergeron nods
18:17:31 <stickster> That's what I would assume would happen, as I think most users would
18:17:33 <rbergeron> mateo: it should - but it's dropping the content created to the bottom of the list
18:17:35 <stickster> No declared date == Now
18:17:36 * rbergeron agrees
18:17:47 <rbergeron> but still publishing it with the correct date
18:17:59 <stickster> So let's leave aside the issues of what should happen or what we believe is wrong for now.
18:18:07 <mateo> take in account what's there in the bottom... I see another kind of box
18:18:10 * rbergeron can retest this to make sure that is actually teh case - but hiemanshu informed me that i needed to actually set the date in
18:18:32 <rbergeron> stickster: okay, let's keep going
18:18:59 <mateo> I will check that too on the night
18:19:06 <stickster> OK, let's move on to the point of this meeting
18:19:07 <mateo> can be atemplate issue
18:19:45 <stickster> #topic Go/no-go
18:20:10 * stickster looks for his linkk
18:20:36 <mateo> ok guys, time to go out. Will be here on night! Cheers
18:20:48 <stickster> mateo: Hang on if you can for a few minutes
18:20:50 <mateo> and have fun!
18:20:52 <stickster> But if you can't OK
18:20:57 * rbergeron nods
18:20:59 <mateo> what's up?
18:21:08 <stickster> The point of a go/no-go is to decide whether we're ready to move to staging as we are now.
18:21:10 * rbergeron looks for stickster's link that he's looking for
18:21:21 * rbergeron notes that staging has to happen by ...
18:21:23 * rbergeron looks for the date
18:21:30 <stickster> http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-mktg/2010-04-15/fedora_insight.2010-04-15-18.02.log.html
18:21:35 <stickster> Staging has to happen by 4/24
18:21:39 <stickster> That's Saturday.
18:21:58 <stickster> Our meeting this week is intended to make a decision as to whether we think we can have a functional, attractive site ready by then.
18:22:07 <mateo> well, I hope to solve the 403 issue and check the publish date on night
18:22:43 <stickster> Unfortunately, a go/no-go meeting like this isn't really forecasting about what we *might* get done
18:22:49 <rbergeron> 403 issue is probably the most critical thing we have, aside from hiemanshu being able to make the necessary look / feel things.
18:23:09 <stickster> The point is to assess where we are *now* and see how confident people are about the state of the system and its release readiness.
18:23:25 <stickster> I, for one, am not convinced we're ready to put this out in front of thousands of people yet.
18:23:41 <stickster> And saying that is painful because I know we all have spent time on it
18:23:52 <stickster> But I feel compelled to just be completely honest.
18:23:59 * stickster opens floor
18:24:10 <mateo> I can be sure to solve the 403 issue, check the date, and helps on some CSS needed there
18:24:34 * rbergeron agrees - and it would be a different situation if we weren't under the time constraint of "staging has to happen in the next few days" - if we had another week, or two weeks, i'd feel much better
18:24:59 <rbergeron> stickster: what is the time frame of doing things if we proceeded to staging later?
18:25:02 <rbergeron> when would those dates be?
18:25:06 <mateo> indeed, and it's a shame that I got heart-busy these 2 days
18:25:24 <rbergeron> i realize it wouldn't be -with- the F13 launch, unfortunately - but I would like this to get rolled out at some point
18:25:37 <stickster> Well, staging by 4/24 is required so we can hit a production platform by 4/27, which is what mmcgrath required from the Infrastructure side
18:25:47 * rbergeron nods
18:25:56 <stickster> A week after that we go into Infrastructure freeze and nothing can go up until a day or two after the F13 GA release.
18:26:17 <rbergeron> so basically - a month from now
18:26:25 <stickster> rbergeron: Yes
18:27:02 <rbergeron> what are the downsides of not having FI ready for F13 launch?
18:27:12 <rbergeron> Do we have serious plans tied to that at this point?
18:27:24 <rbergeron> dependencies getting broken, etc?
18:27:36 <stickster> rbergeron: The only expectations we've touched at all in other teams is that *eventually* we wanted to provide a platform for Docs publishing
18:28:06 <stickster> The interesting thing is, at the Docs meeting last night we found that there is a whole publishing platform that Publican, their documentation tool, may be able to provide
18:28:17 <rbergeron> okay - so breaking the date we're looking at right now isn't going to seriously impede anyone's plans / ability to do their work that they'd like to do
18:28:25 <stickster> So the game is potentially changing there and it might or might not involve Zikula
18:28:32 <stickster> rbergeron: I don't believe so.
18:28:38 <stickster> rbergeron: Other than, of course, FWN
18:28:52 * rbergeron nods
18:28:54 <stickster> Which is not dependent on FI going up, but we've been working with them to provide the first bunch of content
18:29:36 <stickster> So that's the current status and my POV.
18:30:10 <stickster> I do think that we want to say, "Thank you VERY MUCH," to the Zikula devs who have continued to assist us in places where we ran into problems
18:30:19 <rbergeron> indeed.
18:30:21 <stickster> And we can continue to work through those even if we can't make staging in time.
18:30:21 <rbergeron> THANK YOU!
18:30:37 <stickster> #info Thank you to Zikula devs for hard work on platform as we ran into problems
18:31:00 <stickster> #info stickster feels we are not ready to roll this to staging or production as the system stands *right now*
18:31:11 <rbergeron> #info rbergeron agrees
18:31:14 <stickster> #chair rbergeron mchua_afk quaid
18:31:14 <zodbot> Current chairs: mchua_afk quaid rbergeron stickster
18:31:21 <stickster> sorry, go ahead there rbergeron, I had forgotten to do that
18:31:24 <rbergeron> #info rbergeron agrees
18:31:26 <rbergeron> np :)
18:31:58 <stickster> It would be nice to hear from pcalarco about this as well, but when we parted he was agreed that having a go/no-go like this was important
18:32:16 <stickster> So what to do now then?
18:32:42 <stickster> #agreed Fedora Insight is not ready for staging and will stand down while we develop a new plan
18:32:46 <mateo> have to see tomorrow if I solved the auth issue and gwerra can finish the stylish
18:33:15 <stickster> mateo: If those things get finished, we can definitely look at standing up Insight after the GA date
18:33:24 * rbergeron nods
18:33:27 <rbergeron> i think more than definitely
18:34:05 <stickster> #topic What next
18:34:12 <mateo> I will do my best to contribute here guys. I'm currently on a problematic situation here and plan to fly on monday, but I will do my best ;-)
18:34:12 <rbergeron> i think continuing to work on it is a good idea
18:34:34 <stickster> mateo: I know you've hopped in quickly for us, and it's been very helpful and we thank you!
18:34:44 <stickster> So I'm not proposing that we just throw what we've done away.
18:35:23 <quaid> +1 roll to stg!
18:35:24 <stickster> I do think we should step back and look at our options for going forward
18:35:38 <stickster> quaid: ?
18:35:44 <quaid> oh, I misread :(
18:35:49 <stickster> haha
18:35:51 <mateo> a question: If I put my hands on the CSS, gwerra will continue them from the live site? or there's a SVN repo somewhere?
18:35:54 <stickster> quaid: You're a yes-man! :-D
18:36:08 <rbergeron> quaid: just say +1 :)
18:36:10 * rbergeron grins *
18:36:13 <rbergeron> :D
18:36:20 <stickster> mateo: Probably best to ask on the list since gwerra's not here
18:36:25 <stickster> mateo: Are you on the logistics@ list?
18:36:33 <mateo> nope
18:36:47 <quaid> stickster: yes
18:36:47 <quaid> [A[A[A[A[A[A 
18:36:47 <stickster> mateo: It's incredibly low volume, a couple of pieces of mail a day at most
18:36:52 <stickster> hehe
18:37:08 <stickster> mateo: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/logistics
18:37:17 <quaid> stickster: yes
18:37:28 * quaid has bad ssh for a moment, back
18:37:37 * rbergeron nods
18:37:41 <stickster> :-D Let's agree to use the next week to talk about our go-forward plan on the list.
18:37:53 <stickster> I think we should be pretty open-minded too
18:38:10 * rbergeron nods
18:38:21 <stickster> That might involve thinking about how we got to this point and seeing if there are barriers we've set up for ourselves that we should try to knock down or go around.
18:38:39 <mateo> ok, remember that I'm new. Where I can find the lists?
18:38:48 <stickster> mateo: See the URL I posted above
18:38:51 <stickster> You can sign up on that page
18:39:28 <stickster> mateo: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/logistics
18:39:45 <mateo> Ok, I hope to contribute the little last details on the site, I see it almost finished, just minor issues
18:39:55 <mateo> you guys may be tired of all that hard work :)
18:39:55 <stickster> #agreed Use the logistics list next week to brainstorm about how we can surmount some of the difficulties we've been having
18:40:55 <mateo> Ok, subscription sent ;)
18:41:16 <stickster> Is there anything else to do at this meeting then?
18:41:19 <stickster> rbergeron: ^^?
18:42:26 <mateo> ok, hope that tomorrow when wake up, you find details fixed on the site ;)
18:42:36 <stickster> Thanks mateo :-)
18:42:37 <mateo> time to go now :) regards guys
18:42:47 <rbergeron> stickster: nada.
18:42:47 <stickster> You too mateo -- see you soon
18:42:50 <stickster> OK then.
18:42:54 <stickster> Meeting will end in 15
18:43:00 <stickster> 10
18:43:05 <stickster> 5
18:43:10 <stickster> #endmeeting