15:03:57 <rdieter> #startmeeting kde-sig
15:03:57 <zodbot> Meeting started Tue May  5 15:03:57 2015 UTC.  The chair is rdieter. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
15:03:57 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
15:04:00 <rdieter> #meetingname kde-sig
15:04:00 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'kde-sig'
15:04:03 <rdieter> #topic roll call
15:04:13 <rdieter> hi all, friendly kde-sig meeting, who's present today?
15:04:16 <danofsatx> yay! I'm back on a normal schedule!
15:04:21 <danofsatx> .hello dmossor
15:04:21 <zodbot> danofsatx: dmossor 'Dan Mossor' <danofsatx@gmail.com>
15:04:22 <than> present
15:04:24 <pino|work> metoo
15:04:42 * jgrulich is present
15:05:05 <Kevin_Kofler> Present.
15:05:08 <tosky> here
15:06:24 <rdieter> #info rdieter danofsatx  than pino|work jgrulich Kevin_Kofler tosky present
15:06:33 <rdieter> #chair danofsatx  than  pino|work jgrulich Kevin_Kofler tosky
15:06:33 <zodbot> Current chairs: Kevin_Kofler danofsatx jgrulich pino|work rdieter than tosky
15:06:37 <rdieter> #topic agenda
15:06:46 <rdieter> what to discuss this week?
15:07:11 <rdieter> probably f22 stuff: blockers, polish, etc...
15:07:18 <rdieter> anything else?
15:07:29 <jgrulich> I created package with kwalletmanager5 if you want to try it / review it → https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=kwalletmanager5
15:08:17 <rdieter> definitely want that
15:08:29 <rdieter> I'll try after meeting
15:08:33 <Kevin_Kofler> We should redo the vote on automatic locking now that more people are present.
15:08:48 <rdieter> ok, we can revisit that
15:09:01 <Kevin_Kofler> There was no quorum last week.
15:09:29 <rdieter> alright, lets' start with that
15:09:38 <tosky> oh, I was on vacation, what's about?
15:09:40 <rdieter> #topic plasma5 automatic screen locking
15:09:43 <tosky> ah, that flame
15:09:47 <rdieter> Kevin_Kofler: go ahead
15:09:48 <tosky> urgh
15:10:10 <rdieter> tosky: take a nap if you want, I'll ping to wake you up when/if there's another vote :)
15:10:22 <tosky> ...
15:10:52 <Kevin_Kofler> So every proposal you don't like is a flame?
15:12:16 <rdieter> let's stick with facts (and ideally make an actionable proposal)
15:12:52 <Kevin_Kofler> Proposal: Disable timeout-based automatic locking in kde-settings, matching the setting we have been shipping until Fedora 21.
15:12:53 <Kevin_Kofler> Rationale: It is a controversial change compared to Fedora 22, the security it provides is doubtful (it actually introduces a new security risk).
15:12:58 <Kevin_Kofler> So shipping what worked for 21 releases is the safe way out.
15:13:09 <Kevin_Kofler> Plus, all the (non-developer) users commenting on the ML agreed on it.
15:13:35 <Kevin_Kofler> *compared to Fedora 21, I mean of course
15:13:51 <rdieter> do you recall how many (user) commenter's that was?
15:14:08 * heliocastro here too
15:14:09 <rdieter> my vague recollection was that that size was rather small, in fairness
15:14:14 <rdieter> #info heliocastro present
15:14:17 <rdieter> #chair heliocastro
15:14:17 <zodbot> Current chairs: Kevin_Kofler danofsatx heliocastro jgrulich pino|work rdieter than tosky
15:14:17 <Kevin_Kofler> I haven't counted them, but I think 5+.
15:14:58 <rdieter> anyone care to continue more discussion, or should we jump right to voting ?  (i'd opt for the latter)
15:15:12 <Kevin_Kofler> Let's vote.
15:15:23 <Kevin_Kofler> I think there was enough discussion on the mailing list.
15:15:43 <Kevin_Kofler> (where I pointed out that the feature is not just inconvenient, but also totally counterproductive security-wise)
15:15:48 <rdieter> ok, voting it is
15:16:00 <danofsatx> one question first
15:16:05 <rdieter> tosky: ping ^^ :)
15:16:05 <zodbot> rdieter: https://blogs.gnome.org/markmc/2014/02/20/naked-pings/
15:16:08 <Kevin_Kofler> +1 for my proposal (i.e. reverting to the previous default), obviously. :-)
15:16:18 <rdieter> danofsatx: go head
15:16:22 <rdieter> ahead even
15:16:26 <heliocastro> +1 too
15:16:37 <danofsatx> is there a method within the KF5 framework to configure this through IPA policies?
15:16:44 <rdieter> danofsatx: yes
15:16:55 <danofsatx> ok then. Lets vote.
15:17:04 <jgrulich> -1 as I said last time
15:17:07 <rdieter> well, it's easily configurable, not sure what IPA means in this context
15:17:28 <rdieter> danofsatx: it's a kde config file/key
15:17:43 <danofsatx> centrally managed policies, not per-machine/user configuration.
15:17:53 <rdieter> danofsatx: ok, then no
15:17:58 <tosky> danofsatx: the proposal is about the default value of something which can be configured
15:18:17 <danofsatx> tosky: understood, it was just a related question
15:18:18 <rdieter> danofsatx: kde doesn't support that sort of thing (afaik)
15:18:46 <pino|work> rdieter: maybe sync'ing conffiles in /etc using puppet/etc? dunno
15:19:05 * dvratil is a bit late, sorry
15:19:06 <rdieter> pino|work: yes, that works, but I'd still classify that as "per-machine/user configuration"
15:19:19 <rdieter> #info dvratil present
15:19:22 <rdieter> #chair dvratil
15:19:22 <zodbot> Current chairs: Kevin_Kofler danofsatx dvratil heliocastro jgrulich pino|work rdieter than tosky
15:19:37 * danofsatx will file an upstream RFE.
15:19:47 <rdieter> dvratil: fyi, voting on screen locking again, Kevin's proposal is: Proposal: Disable timeout-based automatic locking in kde-settings, matching the setting we have been shipping until Fedora 21.
15:20:22 <dvratil> -1 from me
15:20:37 <pino|work> -1
15:21:15 <Kevin_Kofler> If upstream jumps off a cliff, who will follow?
15:21:16 <rdieter> than: ping, pls vote
15:21:32 * rdieter votes -1 to counter the karma from Kevin_Kofler's prior comment
15:21:39 <tosky> -1 as I wrote already (this is different from "cliff" cases like the battery time, for example, to diverge here)
15:21:46 * heliocastro change vote
15:21:48 <heliocastro> -1
15:21:59 <pino|work> rdieter: looks like he disconnected
15:22:15 <Kevin_Kofler> …
15:22:27 * rdieter counts +1/-5 at the moment
15:22:34 <Kevin_Kofler> Now this is just getting childish.
15:22:34 <danofsatx> guess I'm the lone hold out.... +1
15:22:49 <rdieter> Kevin_Kofler: you started it (sorry :) )
15:23:00 <rdieter> ok, +2/-5
15:23:09 <pino|work> jgrulich: can you repeat it, please?
15:23:21 <jgrulich> [17:17] <jgrulich> -1 as I said last time
15:24:15 <jgrulich> pino|work: I think Rex already counted my vote
15:24:38 <rdieter> #info Proposal: Disable timeout-based automatic locking in kde-settings, matching the setting we have been shipping until Fedora 21
15:24:40 <pino|work> jgrulich: nop, iirc -5 were without youts
15:24:48 <pino|work> *yours
15:24:57 <rdieter> pino|work: I counted that I think
15:25:17 <pino|work> rdieter: i count +2/-6
15:25:30 <rdieter> ok, either way looks like the result is the same
15:25:52 <rdieter> #info proposal does not pass: +2/-6
15:26:06 <rdieter> any more comments, or can we move on?
15:27:00 <rdieter> let's move on then
15:27:05 <Kevin_Kofler> I find rdieter's and heliocastro's reaction really childish.
15:27:17 <Kevin_Kofler> I'm pointing out that we are following a mistake just because upstream said so.
15:27:20 <rdieter> Kevin_Kofler: I was going to vote -1 anyway
15:27:21 <heliocastro> Well, we have the right to disagree
15:27:27 <rdieter> I was just being snarky
15:27:40 <rdieter> (I did say sorry)
15:27:55 <rdieter> #topic f22/plasma5 blockers, polish, etc...
15:27:58 <heliocastro> And i really got backwards, i use tumeou here
15:28:04 <Kevin_Kofler> Right to disagree for valid reasons, sure. Doing so out of spite is just childish.
15:28:04 <heliocastro> *timeout
15:28:34 <Kevin_Kofler> Whatever. So -6 with 11 voters is clearly a reject.
15:28:53 <rdieter> so, as mentioned earlier,
15:29:01 <rdieter> #info kwalletmanager5 needs review, https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=kwalletmanager5
15:29:18 <Kevin_Kofler> Re polish: do we have things set up to show the Fedora logo for the menu button yet?
15:29:29 <Kevin_Kofler> In Beta, there's the KDE logo.
15:29:37 <rdieter> ktp is in stable already, cool, https://admin.fedoraproject.org/updates/FEDORA-2015-7113
15:29:43 <Kevin_Kofler> (The wallpaper is also the KDE one in Beta, but that is reportedly fixed.)
15:30:16 <rdieter> the wallpaper thing was weird, prior to 5.3, there seemed to be some bug that didn't apply some setting for the very first login (subsequent logins were ok)
15:30:29 <rdieter> of course, liveuser counts as "first login", soo... :)
15:30:47 <rdieter> 5.3 also seems to fix the bug about systray applets loaded by default
15:31:21 <jgrulich> I don't know if this happens to someone else, but I'm experiencing lockscreen freezes, the only way how to get rid of it is to kill it and when I unlock it, I see that also plasma is freezed, probably because of notifications
15:31:32 <Kevin_Kofler> And the Fedora logo?
15:31:36 <Kevin_Kofler> Has anybody looked at that?
15:31:37 <rdieter> so plasma-pk-updates is enabled (good), but we still need it disabled for liveuser (Kevin had a good idea how to disable that via kickstart, I'll try that after meeting)
15:31:48 <Kevin_Kofler> Or have we decided (when?) that we don't want that anymore?
15:31:54 <danofsatx> jgrulich: that's the underlying Qt bugs I'm finding.
15:31:55 <heliocastro> jgrulich: Nope, we had this for some time, dvratil tracked down on intel issue
15:31:56 <rdieter> Kevin_Kofler: not that I'm aware, either fix it, or file a bug please (so it's not forgotten)
15:32:31 <heliocastro> jgrulich: When this happens, restarting plasmashell is enough
15:32:37 <danofsatx> apparently, this fixes it: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/updates/FEDORA-2015-7492/qt5-qtdeclarative-5.4.1-4.fc22?_csrf_token=91b4d7de1838cbebcecb8448bf5ae993aa1dcda7
15:32:37 <jgrulich> I didn't have this problem before on F21 when I had Plasma 5 compiled from sources
15:32:58 <heliocastro> jgrulich: I had on f21 as well
15:33:08 <jgrulich> heliocastro: I know how to make it work again, it's just pretty annoying
15:33:15 <rdieter> danofsatx: it = plasmashell crashes ?  ( I think there's > 1 issue being discussed atm)
15:33:38 <rdieter> that plasmashell hanging one is different (afaik)
15:33:45 <danofsatx> plasmashell crashes and freezes have all been slowly pointint back to the same thing in my case.
15:34:11 <rdieter> danofsatx: ok, we can test more with qt5-qtdeclarative-5.4.1-4.fc22
15:34:21 <rdieter> my understanding is that one fixes only the crasher
15:34:25 <rdieter> but we'll see
15:34:34 <danofsatx> drats....one can hope, however.
15:34:53 <rdieter> you may be right, we need more testing
15:35:15 <heliocastro> But i hadn't any crash on last days
15:35:30 <heliocastro> If not fixed, is a little more stable
15:35:46 <jgrulich> I have crashes everytime I connect/disconnect external monitors, but I get used to it
15:36:13 <rdieter> jgrulich: the qtdeclarative update should help at least some
15:36:34 <Kevin_Kofler> .bug 1218700
15:36:36 <rdieter> I know also that Qt 5.5 has a lot of improvements related to QScreen/xcb support too
15:36:36 <danofsatx> I get crashes when disconnecting or connecting, and freezes when simply attempting to wake them up
15:36:36 <zodbot> Kevin_Kofler: Bug 1218700 Plasma 5 menu icon is KDE logo, should be Fedora logo - https://bugzilla.redhat.com/1218700
15:37:07 <jgrulich> rdieter: problem is, according to dvratil, that plasmashell doesn't work with Qt 5.5 at all
15:37:28 <rdieter> jgrulich: it'll get fixed sooner or later though, of course, we'll have to be carefull
15:37:37 <heliocastro> Did we have some flatten grayscale style icon or need to be the blue one default ?
15:37:59 <rdieter> I figured we'd use the blue default one
15:38:08 <dvratil> QTBUG-45279, QTBUG-44895  are the blockers currently preventing launching plasmashell
15:38:54 <rdieter> #info QTBUG-45279, QTBUG-44895 are Qt-5.5-related blockers currently preventing launching plasmashell
15:39:02 <heliocastro> rdieter: Well, is not that bad. Just changed my one here
15:39:23 * heliocastro tries a grayscale version
15:40:08 <Kevin_Kofler> Be careful to not run afoul of the trademark guidelines.
15:40:10 <rdieter> heliocastro: does fedora-logos include one like that?  (if not, we may tread lightly with trademark guidelines)
15:40:29 <heliocastro> rdieter: Good question, let me see
15:40:35 <rdieter> ie, we can't just modify the fedora logo any way we want :)
15:41:07 <pingou> (always safe to run a proposal by the design team in case of doubts)
15:41:39 * rdieter thinks it's not with modification hassle, and just use the default icon
15:41:48 <heliocastro> rdieter: Inded, only blue, no 8 bit art
15:41:51 <rdieter> not worth... I mean
15:42:45 * rdieter checks plasma5 blocker bug
15:44:44 * rdieter closes some
15:45:14 <rdieter> heliocastro: thanks for kde-connect, btw
15:45:23 <heliocastro> rdieter: np
15:45:33 * heliocastro still have the qtcreator patch to do
15:45:33 <rdieter> it doesn't quite work right for me yet, but we can fix that incrementally now
15:45:46 <heliocastro> rdieter: The kde5 or the kde4 part ?
15:46:06 <rdieter> kde-connect doesn't detect any phones
15:46:14 <rdieter> it gives some wierd error when I ask it to scan
15:46:38 <rdieter> the kde5 part
15:46:55 <heliocastro> humm, here's fine
15:46:57 <rdieter> I'll test more and file bugs as appropriate
15:47:02 <heliocastro> Ok, thanks
15:47:09 <rdieter> heliocastro: ok, maybe it's as easy as a missing dependency or something
15:49:13 <rdieter> anything else we can do for f22 or plasma5 to make things more polished?  (any ideas after meeting, please file bugs, and block the plasma5 tracker)
15:51:02 <rdieter> moving on...
15:51:05 <rdieter> #topic open discussion
15:51:17 <rdieter> anything else for today (before closing meeting)?
15:53:25 <rdieter> ok, let's wrap up (early! yay!)
15:53:28 <rdieter> thanks everyone
15:53:30 <rdieter> #endmeeting