17:01:29 <nirik> #startmeeting FESCO (2014-07-30)
17:01:29 <zodbot> Meeting started Wed Jul 30 17:01:29 2014 UTC.  The chair is nirik. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
17:01:29 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
17:01:29 <nirik> #meetingname fesco
17:01:29 <nirik> #chair dgilmore jwb kalev mattdm mitr mmaslano nirik sgallagh t8m thozza
17:01:29 <nirik> #topic init process
17:01:29 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'fesco'
17:01:29 <zodbot> Current chairs: dgilmore jwb kalev mattdm mitr mmaslano nirik sgallagh t8m thozza
17:01:58 <sgallagh> .hellomynameis sgallagh
17:01:59 <zodbot> sgallagh: sgallagh 'Stephen Gallagher' <sgallagh@redhat.com>
17:02:10 <mitr> Hello
17:03:13 <nirik> ok, thats 3. :) We may not have quorum today
17:04:06 <mattdm> i'm here.. sorry
17:04:16 <mattdm> that doesn't quite make quorum though :)
17:04:26 <mattdm> plus I have to leave in 40 minutes.
17:05:19 <nirik> alright.
17:05:54 <nirik> I assume we will not be meeting next week as thats flock time.
17:06:15 <sgallagh> Is all of FESCo going to be on-site?
17:07:11 <nirik> not sure.
17:07:19 <nirik> possibly
17:07:47 <nirik> #info no meeting next week, see 'meet your fesco' at flock.
17:08:58 * mattdm nods
17:09:58 <nirik> ok, I guess no quorum...
17:10:17 <nirik> continue in tickets and at flock and we will meet the week after.
17:10:28 <jwb> here, sorry
17:10:38 <nirik> oh hey. :)
17:10:50 <nirik> thats quorum then for now. ;)
17:10:57 <nirik> #topic #1322 F21 Changes - Progress on Changes Freeze
17:10:57 <nirik> .fesco 1322
17:10:57 <nirik> https://fedorahosted.org/fesco/ticket/1322
17:10:59 <zodbot> nirik: #1322 (F21 Changes - Progress on Changes Freeze) – FESCo - https://fedorahosted.org/fesco/ticket/1322
17:11:18 <nirik> any changes of concern?
17:11:35 <nirik> Hopefully they will use the extra time...
17:11:42 <jwb> at the moment, no
17:12:03 <mattdm> yes, the extra time really helps for atomic in particular
17:12:11 <mattdm> and sgallagh was mentioning also for the server api
17:12:17 * nirik nods
17:12:41 <nirik> #topic #1326 change to fesco replacement process?
17:12:41 <nirik> .fesco 1326
17:12:41 <nirik> https://fedorahosted.org/fesco/ticket/1326
17:12:43 <zodbot> nirik: #1326 (change to fesco replacement process?) – FESCo - https://fedorahosted.org/fesco/ticket/1326
17:12:44 <sgallagh> Yeah, we're a little behind schedule, but I think the slip has us covered
17:13:00 <sgallagh> Motion: discuss this at Meet Your FESCo, live.
17:13:01 <nirik> so there's been a lot of discussion on ticket.
17:13:37 <nirik> Also, it may be very on topic in the governance workshop
17:13:49 <sgallagh> That too
17:13:55 <sgallagh> cwickert is running the latter one, right?
17:13:57 <mattdm> yes, absolutely.
17:14:01 <mitr> sgallagh: live, yes; taking time from audience questions in that session, I’d rather not
17:14:03 <mattdm> and abadger1999
17:14:31 <nirik> http://flock2014.sched.org/event/9d2f47d741d92f1ddf559bb918dcb2d1
17:14:58 <abadger1999> number80 and I ... is cwickert involved in the same one or a parallel session?
17:15:10 * sgallagh looks
17:15:36 <sgallagh> I think I had that confused with the "Fate of Spins" session
17:16:46 <nirik> Anyhow, I don't know that we have reached a conclusion in this ticket, so I would be happy to defer it until after flock and see what we can work out there.
17:16:59 <sgallagh> +1
17:17:02 <jwb> sure
17:17:20 <nirik> any objections?
17:17:30 <mitr> nirik: +1 to deferring
17:18:04 <nirik> #info will defer this until after flock.
17:18:10 <nirik> #topic #1327 Process whenisgood results
17:18:10 <nirik> .fesco 1327
17:18:11 <nirik> https://fedorahosted.org/fesco/ticket/1327
17:18:12 <zodbot> nirik: #1327 (Process whenisgood results) – FESCo - https://fedorahosted.org/fesco/ticket/1327
17:18:30 <nirik> and the survey says:
17:18:34 <nirik> no time is good for everyone. ;)
17:18:50 <sgallagh> The current time appears closest
17:19:18 <mitr> The current time is actually attended by the person who says he can’t do it :)
17:19:50 <mattdm> mitr I noticed that too.
17:20:13 <nirik> ok then... sounds like we just keep this time then? or ask everyone to update as much as they can?
17:20:15 <jwb> who was that?
17:20:19 <sgallagh> jwb: t8m
17:20:20 <mattdm> jwb: t8m
17:20:25 <mattdm> jinx
17:20:39 * sgallagh hands over a Pepsi
17:21:24 <mattdm> (It'd be nice if the whenisgood app allowed "inconvenient but i can do it" and "best time" votes.
17:21:30 <nirik> yeah.
17:23:07 <sgallagh> mattdm: GSoC project for next summer: Better WhenIsGood
17:23:12 <mattdm> heh.
17:23:17 * sgallagh wasn't kidding
17:23:27 <nirik> actually there is a open source nicer one.
17:23:34 <nirik> but then we would have to run it.
17:23:37 <jwb> hi weeds!
17:23:41 <sgallagh> nirik: OpenShift?
17:23:41 <nirik> :)
17:23:48 <mattdm> jwb yeah. moving on? :)
17:23:57 <nirik> proposal: keep current time
17:24:03 <jwb> sure
17:24:05 <sgallagh> nirik: Point me at it, I'll host it on the fedoraserver openshift account
17:24:10 <mitr> Since we have basically 2 options,
17:24:13 <mitr> proposal: keep current time; if t8m and kalev negotiate that the Tuesday one would be better, they can ask for a change.
17:24:13 <mattdm> can someone ask t8m if the current time really doesn't work due to a schedule change?
17:24:23 <mattdm> mitr +1
17:24:29 <nirik> sgallagh: can't find it now, but will let you know if I do
17:24:34 <mitr> nirik: +1
17:24:37 <sgallagh> nirik: Seems like the best choice. Either this or Tuesday at the same time and lose Kalev
17:25:41 <mitr> mattdm: t8m will be at Flock
17:25:42 * nirik is ok with mitr s too
17:25:59 <mitr> They are equivalent anyway :)
17:26:18 <mattdm> mitr true :)
17:26:32 <sgallagh> mitr: +1
17:27:59 <nirik> #agreed keep current time (+5,0,0)
17:28:06 <nirik> (assuming jwb's sure was a +1)
17:28:11 <jwb> yes, sorry
17:28:23 <nirik> #topic Week after next's chair
17:28:32 <nirik> who wants the next chair?
17:28:48 <mattdm> this is for the week _after_ next, right?
17:29:13 <mattdm> I will be travelling back from post-flock meetings in brno
17:29:18 <nirik> right
17:29:28 <nirik> the 13th
17:29:38 <sgallagh> Same, I will be in transit that day
17:31:02 <nirik> I'll be back, but I was chair today. ;)
17:31:06 <nirik> I guess I can next time too.
17:31:08 <mitr> *shrug* I can do it
17:31:14 <nirik> cool. thanks mitr
17:31:22 <nirik> #info mitr to chair aug 13th meeting
17:31:25 <nirik> #topic Open Floor
17:31:30 <nirik> any items for open floor?
17:32:23 <mitr> There was a request to discuss https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1118907
17:33:18 <jwb> i read that over, but i would need more time to decide anything there
17:33:21 <nirik> yeah, I glanced at it but haven't had time to look into it much
17:33:43 <mattdm> I'm tentatively +1 to colin's approach but would like to hear if there's a practical reason to enable it now
17:33:45 <sgallagh> My impression is that this is way too invasive to land during what should already be Alpha
17:33:47 <mitr> Similar here
17:34:35 <mitr> A lets-not-think-about-this fallback is saying that https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Packaging:UsersAndGroups still applies and systemd should comply, and the new mechanism should go through FPC for F22 (which it should anyway)
17:35:06 <nirik> lets defer? I see sgallagh asked walters to file a fesco ticket on it too.
17:35:27 <mattdm> +1 wait.
17:35:27 <mitr> but the right thing to do is to file a ticket, discuss more, and defer -- unless this were time-sensitive
17:35:38 * nirik nods.
17:35:52 <sgallagh> It's probably time-sensitive
17:36:03 <sgallagh> It sounds like the systemd guys enabled this in F21 and it's breaking things
17:36:14 <sgallagh> We likely don't want to fix the breakage this close to Alpha
17:36:40 * mattdm has to go. see you all in cz!
17:36:43 <mitr> The next FESCo meeting is 1 day after the Alpha deadline; we _could_ handle this in a ticket but I wouldn’t bet on it.
17:37:00 * nirik looks at the bug again.
17:37:05 <nirik> safe travels mattdm
17:37:22 <mitr> sgallagh: OTOH systemd is the only user, so the fallout is Alpha testing one component being done slightly differently, which is perhaps not that much of a deal.
17:37:57 <mitr> sgallagh: And, it _has_ broken things but wasn't that already fixed?
17:38:11 <mitr> Anyway, without mattdm we are out of quorum so deferring by default.
17:38:11 <nirik> I guess it's implied that it broke atomic?
17:38:18 <nirik> (since walters was trying to disable it)
17:38:28 <nirik> should ask for more info. yeah.
17:38:41 <nirik> ok, any other items before we close out?
17:38:57 <sgallagh> I generally vote to stay conservative this late in a cycle.
17:39:09 <sgallagh> We're under quorum, so no :)
17:39:11 <mitr> I’ll just go ahead and file the ticket
17:39:16 <nirik> aalright.
17:39:33 <nirik> Thanks for coming everyone. See (many/most/all) of you at flock next week!
17:39:36 <nirik> #endmeeting