06:01:57 <tagoh_> #startmeeting i18n
06:01:57 <zodbot> Meeting started Wed Oct 30 06:01:57 2013 UTC.  The chair is tagoh_. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
06:01:57 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
06:01:57 <tagoh_> #meetingname i18n
06:01:57 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'i18n'
06:01:58 <tagoh_> #topic agenda and roll call
06:01:59 <tagoh_> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/I18N/Meetings/2013-10-30
06:02:11 <tagoh_> okay, shall we have i18n meeting?
06:02:20 <epico> hi
06:02:30 <mfabian> Hi!
06:02:38 <dueno> hi
06:02:56 <anish_> hi
06:04:19 <paragan> hi
06:05:04 <tagoh_> let's get started then
06:05:21 <tagoh_> #topic Upcoming schedule
06:05:21 <tagoh_> #info 2013-11-05        Beta Release
06:05:22 <tagoh_> #info 2013-11-26        Final Change Deadline
06:05:22 <tagoh_> #info 2013-12-10        Fedora 20 Final Release
06:05:31 <tagoh_> as you know beta slipped one week.
06:05:42 <fujiwarat> hi
06:06:05 <tagoh_> #topic Outstanding task
06:06:05 <tagoh_> #info #23: Fedora 20 i18n test day (i18n@lists.fedoraproject.org)
06:06:05 <tagoh_> #link https://fedorahosted.org/i18n/ticket/23
06:06:41 <tagoh_> just a reminder for those who didn't have a time to test yet
06:07:08 <tagoh_> and/or not yet uploading your result on wiki
06:07:33 <tagoh_> and/or commented some issues but not yet filing a bug
06:07:38 <juhp> I nearly finished round of ja
06:08:29 <tagoh_> please go round those test cases and update wiki with your result. if you have any issues, please file a bug to bugzilla. just mentioning issues there doesn't help
06:08:45 <juhp> right
06:09:07 <tagoh_> and don't forget to update with bz id too
06:10:16 <tagoh_> any questions or concerns on test day so far?
06:11:17 <tagoh_> about test cases say but not a result - we can take a look at problems later which you may find out.
06:11:23 <skore> hi
06:13:06 <juhp> is it worth reviewing the results next week?
06:13:10 <lijli> tagoh_, I see, we will also join and update the test result in time
06:13:17 <lijli> bbarve smaitra  ^^
06:13:24 <tagoh_> lijli: thanks!
06:13:39 <tagoh_> juhp: yep, sounds good idea
06:15:19 <tagoh_> juhp: let me check how long testers was updating wiki. if it was done in a week, we can otherwise it may be a bit early
06:15:33 <tagoh_> updating wiki last time
06:15:59 <juhp> okay but not sure how much testing we can expect after next meeting
06:17:00 <tagoh_> hm, that's also true. okay, so may be good to have a review next week and one more later as needed?
06:18:20 <smaitra> okies!
06:18:55 <tagoh_> hope everyone finish their testing by next week
06:19:14 <paragan> yes
06:19:49 <tagoh_> okay, anything else?
06:20:25 <pravins> hi
06:21:04 <tagoh_> then let's move on
06:21:18 <tagoh_> #topic Outstanding topics
06:21:19 <tagoh_> #info #26: proposal: move to using IMEs for ASCII/Latin input (i18n@lists.fedoraproject.org)
06:21:19 <tagoh_> #link https://fedorahosted.org/i18n/ticket/26
06:22:05 <epico> it seems some mobile phones use input method like this...
06:22:42 <tagoh_> juhp: any chance to summarize the discussion?
06:22:54 <juhp> ah sorry!
06:23:09 <juhp> I was planning to do that today/yesterday but didn't find time
06:23:15 <juhp> also with the test day
06:23:25 <juhp> I will try again for next week
06:23:44 <tagoh_> okay. so maybe good to postpone this topic to next meeting then?
06:23:50 <juhp> unless someone beats me to it ;)
06:24:26 <juhp> probably - unless anyone has any new thoughts they want to share - I don't really have anything new today
06:25:00 <tagoh_> epico: is there any IME on mobile device to support multiple languages?
06:25:43 <anish_> tagoh_, i guess swift key supports that
06:25:53 <epico> tagoh_, I guess mostly use local language + Latin + handwriting.
06:26:05 <epico> anish_, right
06:26:07 <tagoh_> anish_: aha
06:26:49 <tagoh_> epico: but in that case they are switching them like switching engines in ibus. not the same case what we are talking about
06:27:04 <epico> tagoh_, okay
06:27:13 <mfabian> tagoh_: Google Japanese input can also be switched to Latin, i.e. it is sort of OK for writing English and one can save time by not having to switch to something else. On the other hand it is less good for writing English.
06:28:33 <tagoh_> mfabian: hm, right. architecture is quite different. maybe comparing with it makes no sense to me...
06:30:19 <mfabian> swiftkey switches for Latin languages automatically, i.e. I can type or swipe German and English and the predictions are correct most of the time without ever switching. When I try to swipe German words with the English Google Android keyboard, it almost never works. But that is also a completely different thing from Jens’ suggestion.
06:30:33 <tagoh_> talking about android, there are no way to input anything without those keyboard unless one has hardware keyboard support.
06:32:01 <tagoh_> in that sense those are all-in-one IM
06:33:24 <epico> I see
06:34:20 <tagoh_> anyway, let's continue to discuss this topic in next meeting
06:34:44 <tagoh_> #info #25: Bugs Corner (i18n@lists.fedoraproject.org)
06:34:44 <tagoh_> #link https://fedorahosted.org/i18n/ticket/25
06:34:56 <tagoh_> any bugs we want to share today?
06:36:07 <pravins> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=704458
06:36:22 <pravins> Fedora bug is https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=985863
06:36:34 <pravins> This bug is regarding pango
06:37:48 <pravins> pango does not looks for composition of characters if individual characters are not available
06:38:14 <tagoh_> aha
06:38:53 <pravins> https://bug704458.bugzilla-attachments.gnome.org/attachment.cgi?id=258407
06:39:24 <pravins> Liberation fonts does not have character U+0301 so pango take this character from fallback fonts
06:40:13 <pravins> but harfbuzz view looks for composition of á (a + U+301) and give proper output
06:40:42 <pravins> dunno should i add ccmp (charactet composition and decomposition ) rules in Liberation but that might be workaround?
06:41:26 <tagoh_> maybe
06:41:50 <pravins> i will update downstream bug with proer details
06:42:24 <tagoh_> that looks like just happens so that assumptions and expections are different..
06:43:20 <pravins> it is possible
06:43:25 <tagoh_> given that the behavior on pango is correct, that could be a bug in a font otherwise a bug in pango.
06:43:40 <pravins> agree. might be fixing in font will be quick
06:44:27 <pravins> tagoh_: AFAIK we do not apply unicode normalization on string before shaping it
06:45:50 <tagoh_> okay
06:46:24 <pravins> just thought will share this bug with you. Will update once more progress happen on it.
06:46:29 <pravins> thanks tagoh_ :
06:46:43 <tagoh_> pravins: thanks!
06:47:15 <tagoh_> well, was about to ask but maybe good to share
06:47:19 <tagoh_> .bug 1019674
06:47:24 <zodbot> tagoh_: Bug 1019674 input method switching does not work in cinnamon - https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1019674
06:48:03 <tagoh_> mfabian: added a comment earlier though, does it not work even if you press super+space twice?
06:49:21 <mfabian> If I remember correctly, I tried  only the menu in the panel, not the super+space key combination.
06:50:10 <tagoh_> just wonder if there was similar issue in gnome-shell before because they seem sharing some code with gnome-shell
06:50:20 <mfabian> There are 2 such things in the panel: The one from cinnamon and the original ibus one.
06:50:36 <mfabian> The ibus one works, the cinnamon one doesn’t.
06:51:17 <epico> tagoh_, iirc, cinnamon has already forked from gnome-shell. ibus integration code seems not shared.
06:51:36 <tagoh_> mfabian: AFAIK ibus support in cinnamon is incomplete
06:51:51 <epico> tagoh_, right
06:51:58 <tagoh_> apparently missing some code from gnome-shell
06:52:25 <mfabian> tagoh_: yes, very incomplete, doesn’t work at all.
06:53:14 <tagoh_> mfabian: so if you did add the input source from settings in cinnamon - shouldn't appears there IIRC though - better not using it ATM
06:54:22 <tagoh_> strange thing is it always shows anthy for japanese regardless it's installed or not
06:54:56 <mfabian> tagoh_: Just tried super+space: Pressing it once does nothing, pressing it twice works but shows the original ibus style, so it is probably not done by cinnamon.
06:55:11 <tagoh_> right
06:56:01 <epico> mfabian, cinnamon doesn't support ibus panel, it still uses /usr/libexec/ibus-ui-gtk3.
06:56:09 <tagoh_> I should file a bug for that separately maybe
06:56:13 <mfabian> I reported this showing of anthy as a seperate bug (https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1019298)
06:56:27 <tagoh_> mfabian: thanks
06:57:00 <tagoh_> well, meant needing to press twice to turn on/off
06:57:40 <tagoh_> fujiwarat: any idea about it?
07:00:27 <tagoh_> hmm, may need to recheck about shortcut key assignments on cinnamon before filing
07:00:40 <tagoh_> anyway
07:00:47 <tagoh_> any other bugs we want to share?
07:00:56 <mfabian> tagoh_: You also tested ibus on KDE. You did not run into the same problem I did?: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1024344
07:01:59 <mfabian> I can still log in via ssh when that happens. What kind of log files could be useful to figure our what is happening?
07:02:01 <tagoh_> mfabian: I didn't see any problems right. will retest with steps you mentioned later though, there was no freeze when I run ibus-setup here
07:02:49 <mfabian> For me it was always reproducible, both in a netinstall and a live DVD (both in qemu)
07:03:18 <tagoh_> okay, let me try again
07:05:14 <tagoh_> okay, if not, shall we move on then?
07:06:02 <tagoh_> #topic Open Floor
07:06:13 <tagoh_> anything else before stop the meeting?
07:08:09 <tagoh_> okay, let's close the meeting then
07:08:14 <tagoh_> thanks everyone for the meeting!
07:08:18 <tagoh_> #endmeeting