14:00:07 <randomuser> #startmeeting Docs Project Meeting - Agenda: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Docs_Project_meetings
14:00:07 <randomuser> #meetingname Fedora Docs
14:00:07 <randomuser> #topic Roll Call
14:00:07 <zodbot> Meeting started Mon Jul 22 14:00:07 2013 UTC.  The chair is randomuser. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
14:00:07 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
14:00:07 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'fedora_docs'
14:00:23 * jjmcd 
14:00:42 * Capesteve is  here
14:01:01 <jhradilek> Here?
14:01:24 <Capesteve> Yes he is
14:01:35 <Capesteve> or "yes you are"
14:01:35 <croberts> here
14:02:21 * pkovar is here
14:02:23 * yruseva here
14:02:53 * pbokoc .
14:02:58 <randomuser> a good turnout today so far
14:03:15 <jjmcd> We heard you had donuts
14:04:10 <randomuser> nope, sorry
14:04:22 <randomuser> bran muffins, extra dry
14:04:29 <jjmcd> :-(
14:04:52 <pbokoc> /part
14:05:23 <randomuser> heh
14:05:32 <randomuser> okay, let's get into it
14:05:52 <randomuser> #topic follow up on last week's action items
14:06:40 <randomuser> I'm gradually prepping RN resources for F20; wiki beats are cleared but i need to address the assignment table
14:07:03 <randomuser> and push some copy to rawhide
14:07:28 <randomuser> #topic Release Notes - Changes coming
14:08:22 <randomuser> We went over the changes process briefly last week. Did anyone happen to start following discussions on devel@ ?
14:09:58 <croberts> i signed up for the mailing list
14:10:03 <randomuser> there's a lot of spirited discourse over many of these changes, and every so often someone will say something along the lines of "well, that should be documented then!"
14:11:26 <Capesteve> I propose a tax on new features or changes
14:11:34 <Capesteve> Docs tax
14:11:48 <randomuser> the journalctl / no default syslog thread, for example, might be useful for anyone working to understand the use cases to be addressed by documenting journalctl
14:11:54 <randomuser> Capesteve, ++
14:12:51 <jjmcd> Perhaps more importantly, the discussion helps identify the perpetrators
14:12:52 <randomuser> one pizza and 12pk of preferred beverage for self contained changes, up to 20 pizzas and 12 packs for system wide changes?
14:13:34 <randomuser> yes, good point, jjmcd
14:15:38 <croberts> i do see alot of discussion around python 3 and no sendmail
14:15:58 <randomuser> yeah, the sendmail thing will have some fallout for us
14:16:42 <randomuser> python3 won't happen any time soon, though
14:16:52 <randomuser> are we ready to talk about guides?
14:17:06 * randomuser decides yes
14:17:13 <randomuser> #topic Guide Status
14:18:01 <randomuser> croberts, i don't see anything in git from you yet; how are things coming along?
14:19:07 <croberts> i have got the intro part done, I do still have some work ahead for the guide
14:19:16 <croberts> i can upload what i have into git
14:19:38 <randomuser> that's a good idea
14:19:56 <croberts> ok I will do that soon, can you help me with the formatting
14:20:02 <randomuser> of course
14:20:15 <randomuser> What time zone are you in anyway, croberts ?
14:20:20 <croberts> EST
14:21:00 <randomuser> okay, I'll watch for your commits and ping you on irc when I get into it
14:21:18 <croberts> ok sounds good
14:21:24 <jjmcd> croberts, you should commit early and often.  git gives you the ability to go back if you should happen to shoot yourself in the foot
14:22:52 <croberts> thank you, i will remember that. does the file have to be in the xml format to be uploaded to git?
14:23:04 <jjmcd> nope
14:23:20 <randomuser> croberts, if you write the copy, I'll help with the formatting and markup
14:23:26 <jjmcd> But if the file isn't text, e.g. .doc or something, things like git diff are less useful
14:23:41 <randomuser> i think it will help acclimate you to docbook to see your writing get marked up
14:24:15 <randomuser> oh, yes, plain text please
14:24:16 <croberts> the file is in doc format at the moment
14:24:58 <croberts> i can covert it to plain text
14:25:27 <jjmcd> oowriter can export DocBook, but it is probably better to go to plain text.
14:25:45 <croberts> ok I will change it to just a plain text file
14:25:56 <jjmcd> The Word model is about formatting but DocBook semantics are about structure, and they don't play well together
14:26:20 <jhradilek> What guide are we talking about, by the way? o_O
14:26:29 <randomuser> the Word model also leads you to misleading assumptions about whitespace
14:26:35 <croberts> dual booting windows 8 and fedora together
14:26:41 <randomuser> jhradilek, croberts is writing a multiboot guide
14:28:10 <randomuser> i think covered there for now; chris knows where to go for help
14:28:20 <randomuser> Let's talk about the cloud guide
14:28:34 <randomuser> #topic Guide status - Cloud guide
14:28:42 <jhradilek> Oh, cool.
14:29:14 <randomuser> We're really pushing fedora in the cloud; we've got cloud hosts, guests, features, Changes, SIGs, et al
14:29:32 <randomuser> so updating the cloud guide would keep pace with the product
14:30:25 <randomuser> If you haven't reviewed the cloud guide, there's as much unfilled outline as content, so finding a place to pick up should be easy for interested parties
14:30:41 <randomuser> #action to send a mail to docs list about working on the cloud guide
14:30:47 <randomuser> #undo
14:30:47 <zodbot> Removing item from minutes: <MeetBot.items.Action object at 0x14956050>
14:30:54 <randomuser> #action randomuser to send a mail to docs list about working on the cloud guide
14:31:23 <randomuser> The cloud mailing list is also available for help; I asked them about it
14:31:32 <randomuser> #link https://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/cloud/2013-July/002621.html
14:32:21 * randomuser takes a deep breath
14:32:29 <randomuser> okay, that's all I have to say about the cloud guide for now
14:32:56 <randomuser> any more cloud comments? or another guide we should talk about?
14:36:14 <randomuser> #topic Outstanding BZ Tickets
14:36:20 <randomuser> #link http://tinyurl.com/lbrq84
14:36:39 <randomuser> There are bugs.
14:37:00 <lnovich> run bugs!
14:37:37 <randomuser> any we should discuss?
14:37:49 <pbokoc> croberts, you still here?
14:37:51 <pbokoc> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=986370
14:38:07 <croberts> yes i am i was looking at the link you posted
14:38:26 <pbokoc> you said in the comments that you'll be taking care of this in the multiboot guide, so I'll assign the bug to you, ok? (it's assigned to me right now)
14:38:52 <croberts> ok thank you, some of the things he mentioned i should incorporate into the guide
14:39:53 <randomuser> croberts, you might also want to file a bug requesting a bz component be created for the multiboot guide
14:40:20 <randomuser> i have an example somewhere here
14:40:42 <randomuser> croberts, https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=965612
14:41:31 <croberts> ok i will do that after the meeting
14:41:39 <randomuser> okay, cool
14:41:58 <randomuser> I've got one for you, pbokoc
14:42:02 <randomuser> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=668549
14:43:06 <randomuser> the last time I dug into cobbler, I filed a few bugs against it and selinux-policy, and they were both fixed very quickly
14:43:11 <pbokoc> yeah, I know about that one. I'll bug Rudi about answering the needinfo
14:43:46 <randomuser> well, it is your guide, right pbokoc ? or does rudi make those calls
14:44:04 <pbokoc> hmpf
14:44:34 <randomuser> fwiw, the upstream cobber documentation has been improved a lot with the last release
14:44:57 <pbokoc> right, I'll look around
14:45:07 <randomuser> and upstream is quite responsive in my experience if we want to add to the ig
14:45:16 <pbokoc> allright
14:47:34 <pbokoc> I'm not exactly familiar with Cobbler, so it's slightly lowed on my to-do list than things I can fix right away
14:47:53 <randomuser> yeah, that's fair
14:47:54 <pbokoc> I'll make my way to it, but it's going to take me a bit :)
14:48:24 <randomuser> I was more thinking that a decision needed to be made about whether it should be covered or not, and generally to what extent
14:48:40 <pbokoc> right
14:49:35 <randomuser> any other bugs to talk about?
14:50:35 <pbokoc> I don't have anything else
14:50:55 <croberts> i have a question about one
14:51:11 <randomuser> yes
14:51:21 <croberts> if leslie opens one regarding translation or wording, should we just close it?
14:51:42 <randomuser> ha!
14:52:00 <randomuser> I don't think we need to have a policy about it, if that's what you mean
14:52:31 <croberts> no problem
14:53:43 <randomuser> croberts, we can consider any bug report on merit; but some changes don't merit the work imo
14:54:11 <croberts> i understand i was just wondering after that ticket
14:55:02 <randomuser> we're halfway there anyway, so
14:55:05 <randomuser> #topic Open floor discussion
14:56:59 <randomuser> just a few more minutes to get your punches in before we turn the floor over to QA
14:59:03 <randomuser> 3
14:59:08 <randomuser> 2
14:59:14 <randomuser> #endmeeting