04:00:03 #startmeeting APAC Bi-weekly 20130330 04:00:03 Meeting started Sat Mar 30 04:00:03 2013 UTC. The chair is FranciscoD. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 04:00:03 Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic. 04:00:22 #topic Init process 04:00:25 #meetingname apac 04:00:25 The meeting name has been set to 'apac' 04:00:27 here 04:00:33 .fasinfo ankursinha 04:00:36 FranciscoD: User: ankursinha, Name: Ankur Sinha, email: sanjay.ankur@gmail.com, Creation: 2008-05-28, IRC Nick: FranciscoD, Timezone: Australia/Sydney, Locale: en, GPG key ID: 0x0767EB08, Status: active 04:00:38 .fas tuanta 04:00:40 FranciscoD: Approved Groups: elections cla_fedora cla_done ambassadors fedorabugs freemedia sysadmin sysadmin-ask packager @gitfedora-tour cla_fpca 04:00:43 tuanta: tuanta 'Truong Anh Tuan' 04:00:47 hello dan408 04:00:56 hello tuanta 04:00:59 .fasinfo dan408 04:01:00 dan408: User "dan408" doesn't exist 04:01:02 oops 04:01:05 .fas MavJS 04:01:06 .fasinfo vicodan 04:01:06 MavJS: mavjs 'Ye Myat Kaung' 04:01:07 :) 04:01:09 dan408: User: vicodan, Name: Dan Mashal, email: dan.mashal@gmail.com, Creation: 2011-10-12, IRC Nick: dan408, Timezone: US/Pacific, Locale: en, GPG key ID: 2C8A8515B06BFEC47F3E13C978E65569DE341682, Status: active 04:01:12 dan408: Unapproved Groups: fedora-arm 04:01:15 dan408: Approved Groups: @gitfedora-mate proventesters freemedia cla_fpca cla_done packager triagers fedorabugs ambassadors 04:01:57 FranciscoD, could you please set (co)chair to me 04:02:04 #chair tuanta 04:02:04 Current chairs: FranciscoD tuanta 04:02:11 cool 04:02:14 is bckurera around? 04:02:19 #chair bckurera 04:02:19 Current chairs: FranciscoD bckurera tuanta 04:02:28 tuanta: he just pinged me a few minutes back 04:02:29 .fas bckurera 04:02:29 bckurera: bckurera 'Buddhika Kurera' 04:02:32 He should be here 04:02:32 ah, there 04:02:42 * FranciscoD waits 10 seconds for more init processes 04:02:49 * bckurera checking mails :) 04:03:11 #link Today agenda: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Meeting:APAC_Ambassadors_2013-03-30#Agenda 04:03:16 bckurera pm please 04:03:18 .fas nangthang 04:03:21 nangthang: nangthang 'Thang Nguyen Nang' 04:03:30 #topic Announcements 04:03:33 welcome my friend, nangthang 04:03:40 Please use "!" if you have an announcement to make 04:03:40 hi 04:03:44 ! 04:03:47 and when you're done announcing 04:03:49 tuanta: go ahead 04:04:08 please use #info judiciously to make the logs better for those who can't make it. 04:04:08 #info Budget for FY2014 has been out 04:04:18 ? 04:04:21 #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FY14_Budget 04:04:28 ah, ? cancelled ;) 04:04:58 bad news: they cut a lot from APAC proposal 04:05:07 will discuss this in Open floor 04:05:11 eof 04:05:21 #info Discuss APAC budget cuts in open floor. 04:05:28 Any other announcements? 04:05:46 * FranciscoD has one and will make it if no one else has anything 04:05:55 * bckurera but I m happy it comes out at least now :) 04:06:09 ! 04:06:21 please bckurera, then FranciscoD 04:06:40 This is not a announcement but need to finalize release party dinner awards as well, will discuss it on tickets 04:06:44 eof 04:07:01 https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-apac/ticket/71 04:07:05 sure, bckurera 04:07:10 "FUDCon APAC: Planning: Decide a period for tentative dates" 04:07:23 I'd like folks to go through the ticket. 04:07:35 I suggest we start planning already. 04:07:50 The budget cuts are because we don't use our budget well enough. 04:08:06 should we set "meeting" keyword to it? 04:08:22 The ticket is not up for discussion in this meeting. I'd like folks to comment on it on the trac and we'll discuss it a meeting 04:08:36 tuanta: negative. Discussion on trac. Meeting when we have to take a discussion. 04:08:39 ok, understood 04:08:39 eof 04:09:00 Any more announcements? 04:09:16 * FranciscoD counts till 10 04:09:33 #topic Trac tickets 04:09:35 https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-apac/report/9 04:09:54 https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-apac/ticket/69 -> FAD Mysore 04:10:22 It's called a FAD, but I propose we fund it. 04:10:37 Please see my latest comment: https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-apac/ticket/69#comment:4 04:11:03 Comments? What do you people think? 04:11:12 KageSenshi, bckurera ? 04:11:26 eh 04:11:31 haha .. i was on wrong channel 04:11:38 >.< 04:11:43 .fas izhar 04:11:44 KageSenshi: izhar 'Mohd Izhar Firdaus Ismail' 04:11:52 * KageSenshi scrolls up .. 04:12:20 ! 04:12:21 tuanta: ? 04:12:24 bckurera: go 04:12:42 yea thanks 04:13:23 I think we can proceed discussing this, this is a request to get funds for travel. not for the FAD 04:13:34 Vote then? 04:14:03 Yes since it is more than USD 200, the commnity needs to decide 04:14:16 bckurera: It's 110USD 04:14:29 Comment 3 04:14:51 But the cab's haven't been done. That will cost him some 04:15:05 I propose we permit about $250 as bckurera said. 04:15:10 Can we vote now? 04:15:10 FranciscoD : It is only for the flight , what about the cab? 04:15:27 bckurera: ^ ;) 04:15:31 I see, so total in his request is 110 USD? 04:15:58 tuanta: it'll increase a little. 250 should do it. 04:16:38 agree 04:16:50 any idea on expected attendees? 04:16:54 Okay. All in favour +1, -1 otherwise, with reason 04:17:13 KageSenshi: mbuf generally hosts them open for the entire institure 04:17:14 FranciscoD: +1 04:17:17 *institute 04:17:30 usually around 25-30-35 people come around. 04:17:33 But IMO, I would like to vote a +1 for USD 110 and will later consider the expenses for Cab 04:17:35 ah ok then :D 04:17:47 +1 bckurera 04:17:53 +1 bckurera too 04:17:54 +1 for 110USD + Cab expenditures. 04:18:08 it's better to set a limit 04:18:20 +1 till 250 as initially requested. 04:18:43 Cab is more expensive than flight? 04:18:46 * FranciscoD notes that mbuf is one of the few APAC ambassadors who regularly does events 04:19:00 yes, FranciscoD 04:19:02 tuanta: shouldn't be, but I don't remember the pricing 04:19:25 shakthimaan is doing a great job in India with events we really need to appreciate his effort and facilitate him too 04:19:31 110USD for flights + discussion on cab seems okay for everyone? 04:19:47 * FranciscoD wants to close this ticket and move to next. 04:19:48 +1 FranciscoD 04:19:53 it's more clear 04:20:16 #info Ticket 69: Agreed 110USD flight expenses. Cab expenses to be discussed when we have figures. 04:20:26 +1 04:20:27 yep .. for the cab thing, if theres not much events thats requiring money in this quarter , i'm ok with approval .. 04:20:29 we should decide for cab after getting more info 04:20:46 Next ticket: 04:20:59 https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-apac/ticket/68 -> Kushal: 600 for Pycon USA 04:20:59 yes, I ll ask him to update the ticket with cap price as well 04:21:04 note, the event is over 04:21:07 for now will approve USD 110, Done :) 04:21:13 bckurera: I'll update all tickets after the meeting. 04:21:41 FranciscoD that is great, thanka ! 04:21:44 I'm +1 for 600, as already mentioned in ticket. 04:21:58 tuanta: did famsco have anything to say about this? 04:21:59 * tuanta never minds if we update the tickets immediately 04:22:17 FranciscoD: actually nope 04:22:33 tuanta: I'd prefer we spent the meeting time at the IRC window. I'll update tickets after the meeting. 04:22:46 tuanta: So famsco is OK with 600 then? 04:22:48 so what will happen to that ticket ? 04:22:55 If they don't have an issue, we can decide. 04:23:04 kushal: ah, you're here. Is 600 sufficient for you? 04:23:22 FranciscoD, yes, that is ok , I shared a room with others 04:23:27 Great. 04:23:43 tuanta, bckurera, if famsco did not bring up an issue with this, I propose we vote on the ticket. 04:24:16 kushal: you will need to upload receipts/event reports/etc as per the guidelines before kital will reimburse you, if approved 04:24:23 +1. I still think it's APAC issue 04:24:31 FranciscoD, I know and I will 04:24:35 okay +1 in favour, -1 with reason 04:24:37 +1 frm me 04:24:42 +1 from me too 04:24:45 * FranciscoD pokes KageSenshi , nangthang , bckurera 04:24:49 +1 04:24:53 It is still with in our limits, so why FAmSCo is needed 04:24:56 MavJS 04:24:57 +1 04:25:10 bckurera: then I assume you're a +1 :) 04:25:34 USD 600 is a large amount but +1 considering the value of the participation 04:25:37 +1 FranciscoD. kushal: please do not forget event reports and receipts 04:25:39 #info Agreed ticket #68: 600USD 04:25:43 tuanta, yup 04:25:49 +1 04:25:51 * bckurera sorry my connection is not that fast 04:25:54 tuanta: are there any other tickets to be discussed today? 04:26:14 not budget but #70 04:26:17 kushal: remember, you should have N-1 blog articles (with N = event duration) 04:27:05 tuanta, not possible in a direct way as the event was 9days, I blogged on one special event, I will do one more large on the whole event 04:27:58 with details from everyday 04:28:31 * FranciscoD_ got disconnected. 04:28:43 Sorry. Any more tickets then tuanta ? 04:28:51 ! 04:29:01 bckurera: go 04:29:14 #link https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-apac/ticket/70 04:29:26 kushal: please read this guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Event_reports 04:29:35 #chair FranciscoD_ 04:29:35 Current chairs: FranciscoD FranciscoD_ bckurera tuanta 04:29:48 tuanta, I know 04:29:59 tuanta, I will submit event report 04:30:12 it comes from the main page: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Sponsoring_event_attendees 04:30:33 bckurera: shoudlnt' we first discuss this on the trac ticket and then use a meeting for the final decision? 04:30:34 So we need to finalize how are we going to select winner? 04:30:38 As tuanta proosed in his email? 04:30:52 *proposed 04:31:12 Yes that is the way, but still no discussion on the trac after around 2 weeks 04:31:34 bckurera: we need to get the ticket more visibility on the mailing list then 04:31:38 we need to get this finished soon since it is a long timer after F18 release 04:31:55 you should've made proposals IMO, and we could've decided 04:32:17 I see no proposals in the ticket at all: Neither for criteria, nor for judges 04:32:18 Yes my proposal is on the mailing list 04:32:38 anyway is there any quick suggession on this? 04:32:42 bckurera: Not the ticket proposal. Proposals for the actual decisions 04:32:49 * FranciscoD_ has none at the time being. 04:33:05 I'll make proposals on the ticket after the meeting when I have some time to think over it 04:33:11 yes no idea, no one interested? 04:33:13 tuanta: KageSenshi kushal nangthang MavJS ? 04:33:35 yes then will add an action item to add their ideas on this 04:33:38 didnt see much event reports on release party though .. 04:33:41 and extending the deadline 04:33:42 bckurera: IMO, you should've lead with proposals for the criteria and judges. After all, this is your ticket :) 04:33:59 without reports .. what to evaluate? xD 04:34:00 +1 FranciscoD_ 04:34:10 FranciscoD_ No I need others ideas, not mine always :) 04:34:11 +1 FranciscoD_ 04:34:21 KageSenshi: we can not do anything in those cases 04:34:23 bckurera: It isn't about ideas. It's about starting them 04:34:35 Initiating is half the battle. :) 04:34:40 Anyway, I'll add an action item 04:34:49 those events are simply put out of evaluation process 04:34:56 It is started trac ticket is n place and announcement is made in ML 04:35:01 #action APAC make proposals for judges and criteria for ticket 70 04:35:09 bckurera: apparently, that wasn't enough ;) 04:35:30 #action APAC discuss the viability of ticket 70 04:35:38 tuanta yes but we can have some and anyway we need to choose a winner too :) 04:35:40 as per KageSenshi 's observation 04:36:07 bckurera: Could I trouble you to add some more information to this ticket please? 04:36:13 For instance, what is the goal? 04:36:22 one of the required things: event must have report 04:36:30 Best release party, yes, but why? 04:36:38 #action Please update the ticket #70 with your ideas on the subject asap 04:36:42 Also, information about prizes should be added 04:37:05 prizes here: https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-apac/ticket/61 04:37:06 :) 04:37:08 Even it was on the ML, it should be on the trac ticket 04:37:41 tuanta: er, why two trac tickets for 1 proposal? Anyway. Can that information be copy pasted to this ticket? 04:37:43 I suggested we choose a winner and some finalists 04:37:47 Too many trac tickets spoil the broth ;) 04:38:06 IMO, it' really difficult to evaluate the best release party 04:38:07 my ticket is opened before 04:38:09 tuanta: first criteria, then judges, then candidates, then winners? Sound good? 04:38:17 +1 tuanta for that requirement 04:38:19 bckurera may not recognize it 04:38:22 FranciscoD_ I think you are not aware of this 04:38:34 bckurera: I must've been, but I don't remember it 04:38:43 Probably because it hasn't been discussed recently 04:38:51 No trac tickets are different, tuan proposal is to increase the number of award 04:38:56 #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/F18_release_events .. reports are here 04:39:05 while my ticket is to fix a process for this 04:39:09 yes, exactly, KageSenshi 04:39:37 * KageSenshi suggest pasting individual report links on #70 04:39:39 bckurera: #61 should be referred in #70 04:39:54 bckurera: tuanta : but, the award, and the process would be closely related, won't they? Why are we increasing awards without it ever being in action in the first place? 04:39:57 * FranciscoD_ is confused. 04:40:11 I'll go over the ticket etc. Let's not waste time over my confusion :) 04:40:36 so anyway there is not much, please put your all ideas on #70 04:40:43 then will discuss and finalize it 04:40:46 action items added. 04:40:47 I have proposed additional prizes for months 04:40:51 Next ticket? 04:41:28 I ll write to ML again too 04:41:30 yes please 04:41:39 Any other tickets to discuss? 04:42:17 I see nope 04:42:28 tuan your proposal is not approved yet, so we cannot take decisions based on that, can we do it for this time or next time? 04:42:46 Next time please 04:43:03 * FranciscoD_ is not in a position to vote on either ticket this time 04:43:04 bckurera: I proposed for this time. But it's fine for next times 04:43:09 I didn't do my homework :/ 04:43:44 #topic Action items from last meeting 04:43:49 There were two action items 04:44:06 1. New agenda format which tuanta proposed, executed -> FIXED 04:44:16 yes 04:44:32 2. I was to mail cwickert and tuanta about getting more apac folks involved in release related fedora activities. 04:45:01 Mail sent. Discussion on. I'll provide updates when there's something worth reporting. 04:45:03 Nothing at the moment 04:45:10 yes, we are looking forward to hearing from him 04:45:15 #info Both action items from previous meeting -> COMPLETE 04:45:38 ok, last section now? 04:45:46 #topic Open floor 04:45:52 ! 04:46:00 tuanta: go 04:46:10 ok, back to the Budget for FY2014 04:46:28 ? 04:46:33 here is our proposal: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Ambassadors/APAC/Budget#Fiscal_Year_2014 04:46:46 and here is the final: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FY14_Budget 04:47:27 in total, we proposed for $23,800 but they decided to support us just $17,300 04:47:35 ? 04:47:45 just a glance 04:47:50 please FranciscoD_ 04:48:03 btw .. on mbuf's ticket .. is theres a criteria nowadays before can call something a FAD? 04:48:22 tuanta: Have you attempted to reason why we got less? I have a few reasons I think: 04:48:29 1. We don't use up our budget 04:48:45 2. We don't put it to good use: We get very little work done that would aid a release 04:48:46 * KageSenshi usually just call all fedora related event i run as fad .. 04:49:05 There are more, but I think these two are dominant 04:49:15 here is the message from Robyn: http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/famsco/2013-March/001295.html 04:49:25 FranciscoD_, what you count as aid for release ? 04:49:32 KageSenshi budget approval for FAD should be directed to Ruthe and Robyn so if it is named FAD you cannot use normal regional budget 04:49:54 ouh .. not aware of that .. 04:50:14 regional budgets are not included *premier* events such as FAD and FUDCon 04:50:28 and please do name it FAD if it is a real FAD too :) 04:50:41 bckurera, :) 04:50:47 kushal: any tasks that are part of the entire release process. We have ambassadors that hold workshops + recruit folks, a few package maintainers, but we do not have folks who work closely with teams on tasks required by the upcoming fedora release 04:51:03 FranciscoD_: I just see it; I have no activities up to now 04:51:12 FranciscoD_, you means more devels or features in each release ? 04:51:13 .. any alternative brand for normal fedora event that can fall under regional budget? xD 04:51:33 FranciscoD_: I think of to bring that to the next FAmSCo meeting 04:51:58 kushal: anything that would help the release: Features/More people who continuously help with testing/Folks who help with marketing/Folks who help with docs teams/Folks who help with design team tasks 04:52:03 tuanta: aye 04:52:05 simply "fedora-event" doesnt sound nice :P 04:52:28 FranciscoD_, ok 04:52:39 I believe other regions would have that same question 04:52:41 we do ad-hoc tasks, yes, but we don't do work that is necessary for the release 04:52:52 We had two features in last two releases from APAC devels btw, 04:53:18 kushal: I'm aware. But that's a small percentage of the APAC contributors 04:53:19 yes, kushal 04:53:30 Also, that doesn't mean we have features every year from APAC devels 04:53:32 FranciscoD_, I also wonder which all regions do that other than individual devels 04:53:52 kushal: well, for example, FUDCon Lawrence was used to plan the new release quite a bi 04:53:55 *bit 04:54:22 FranciscoD_, only because most of the devels live in North America and they can attend it 04:54:23 #action tuanta to bring Regional budget for FY2014 to FAmSCo meeting then report back to APAC in the next meeting 04:54:34 FranciscoD_: i see 04:54:51 kushal: yes, but there is no reason why APAC doesn't have more devels who help with release critical processes 04:55:12 and get invited to these conferences, or get together at FUDCon APAC etc 04:55:31 It's just an observation. I'm not criticising anyone 04:55:37 :) 04:55:43 the only one reason: from ourselves 04:55:49 FranciscoD_, I can understand :) 04:55:54 and we should change it 04:56:10 The idea is to actually get work done at our premier events 04:56:17 tuanta, it again depends on how many new students you can find who want to become devels 04:56:27 rather than having a dominant section of user oriented workshops 04:56:40 apac mostly ambassadors so far .. and trying to find devs is haardd xD .. 04:56:45 kushal: and the number of current contributors looking to branch out and learn ;) 04:56:50 FranciscoD_ and me are thinking of ideas to organize some real (get-goals-done) FADs this year 04:56:52 FranciscoD_, true, that is why I try to do only devel workshops in the last few years 04:57:11 kushal: aye :) 04:57:25 we'll work on this. It isnt something that will change in a day. 04:57:29 But we do need to work on this. 04:57:39 +1 FranciscoD_ 04:57:49 * FranciscoD_ observes that we have 3 more minutes to the hour mark. 04:57:50 kushal +1 and we need to have non-devels too ;0 04:58:07 bckurera: we do, but the proportion is very very important to maintain. 04:58:25 we have way too many ambassadors compared to devels IMO 04:58:40 tuanta: bckurera : any thing else to discuss 04:58:42 bckurera, in APAC in last few years we found most of the students want to become ambassador only, they don't want to do any other work 04:58:56 Otherwise I'll like to close the meeting before the hour mark ;) 04:58:56 i think on certain countries you can approach through doing translation 04:59:25 FranciscoD_: we can bring the topic of organizing more FADs in APAC back in the next meetings 04:59:31 Yes. For example, Chandan is quite active with Gnome translation nowadays. 04:59:35 tuanta: I'll note that. 04:59:38 kushal I agree with you, they normally think devel with OS is highly complex and they dont like :) 04:59:40 translation is easy too for most ppl 04:59:49 do you think it's worth to open a new ticket? 04:59:51 bckurera, 100% correct 05:00:01 unlike more deeper devs 05:00:03 #info APAC FADs need to be discussed again 05:00:38 and I think it is good to think of FUDcon 2014 from now I guess :) 05:00:56 Hence my ticket ;) 05:01:03 FranciscoD_: I think opening a new ticket is easier to follow this up 05:01:03 Close then? 05:01:16 tuanta: could you open one please? 05:01:21 * FranciscoD_ has enough homework this week 05:01:24 sure, 05:01:30 an overheating laptop is *not* helping :/ 05:01:37 (btw .. any way to subscribe to trac/apac ticket notifications ? .. 05:02:05 #action tuanta to open a new ticket to discuss more about organized real get-something-done FADs in APAC 05:02:12 KageSenshi: maybe rss feeds 05:02:16 not sure though 05:02:32 #undo 05:02:32 Removing item from minutes: 05:02:37 #action tuanta to open a new ticket to discuss more about organizing real get-something-done FADs in APAC 05:02:38 google reader being killed xD .. 05:03:02 KageSenshi: active tickets RSS feed should be okay I think 05:03:09 * FranciscoD_ notes he'll add it too 05:03:13 +1 FranciscoD_ 05:03:20 Okay. End meeting in 5 05:03:22 4 05:03:26 3.89 05:03:28 3.12 05:03:31 2.87 05:03:33 2 05:03:37 1.0 05:03:38 :) 05:03:39 thanks for all who attended have a nice day 05:03:44 0.3414 05:03:46 \o/ 05:03:48 bye 05:03:48 0 05:03:52 bye :) 05:03:52 #endmeeting