20:06:35 <cwickert> #startmeeting EMEA ambassadors meeting
20:06:35 <zodbot> Meeting started Wed Apr  6 20:06:35 2011 UTC.  The chair is cwickert. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
20:06:35 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
20:07:23 <dmaphy> the wiki isn't that up-to-date concerning this: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Ambassadors/Meetings
20:08:17 <cwickert> dmaphy: it's a wiki, go fix it
20:08:32 <dmaphy> yeah, i'll do
20:08:59 * cwickert suggests to get rid of this page anyway and have a category page automatically collect all meetings
20:09:35 <cwickert> .fas cwickert
20:09:36 <zodbot> cwickert: cwickert 'Christoph Wickert' <christoph.wickert@googlemail.com>
20:09:46 <dmaphy> .fas dmaphy
20:09:47 <zodbot> dmaphy: dmaphy 'Dominic Hopf' <dmaphy@gmail.com>
20:09:55 <heffer> .fas heffer
20:09:55 <zodbot> heffer: heffer 'Felix Kaechele' <felix@fetzig.org>
20:10:08 * t2hot greets arthurbuliva ... long time no see
20:10:13 <t2hot> .fas t2hot
20:10:14 <zodbot> t2hot: twohot 'Onyeibo Oku' <twohotis@gmail.com>
20:10:38 <arthurbuliva> .fas arthurbuliva
20:10:39 <zodbot> arthurbuliva: arthurbuliva 'Arthur Buliva' <arthurbuliva@gmail.com>
20:10:44 <cwickert> ok, thanks
20:11:07 <cwickert> the agenda for this week can be found at
20:11:08 <GeroldKa> .fas geroldka
20:11:09 <zodbot> GeroldKa: geroldka 'Gerold Kassube' <gerold@lugd.org>
20:11:10 <cwickert> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Meeting:EMEA_Ambassadors_2011-04-06
20:11:24 <cwickert> please open the meeting agenda now, you'll need it
20:11:56 <cwickert> and please follow the meeting protocoll, see https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/IRCHowTo#Protocol
20:12:10 <cwickert> any announcements?
20:12:48 <cwickert> maybe one thing from my side: I have no more media left
20:13:11 * jsmith has an announcement
20:13:14 <cwickert> if you need F14 media for an event, please get in contact with the local key disctibution pionts
20:13:38 <cwickert> #link https://fedorahosted.org/emea-swag-tracking/wiki/Inventory
20:14:14 <arthurbuliva> !
20:14:26 <cwickert> #info cwickert has no more F14 media left. If you have an event, get media from your local distributor ambassadors listed at https://fedorahosted.org/emea-swag-tracking/wiki/Inventory
20:14:35 <cwickert> first jsmith, then arthurbuliva please
20:14:49 <jsmith> Two quick announcements from the FPL
20:15:01 <jsmith> First of all, Milan has been selected as the winning bid for FUDCon EMEA 2011
20:15:07 <cwickert> ?
20:15:16 <jsmith> => cwickert
20:15:39 * jsmith would like to publicly thank everyone who submitted a bid -- we had four great bids
20:15:40 <cwickert> Is the spreadsheet with the matrix available somewhere?
20:16:13 <cwickert> in the past we had spreadsheets where the different bids were evaluated
20:16:41 <jsmith> cwickert: I'm not sure what matrix you're referring to.  FAmSCo met on Saturday to make their decision, and they voted for Milan.  I'm not sure if they used a spreadsheet.
20:17:07 <jsmith> cwickert: I met with Max from the RH CommArch team yesterday, and we agreed w/ FAmSCo that Milan is an excellent choice
20:17:12 <cwickert> I was thinking of something like this: https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=tJN3ZgmqZ07GujYrcvUz-LQ&authkey=CM607IkH&hl=de#gid=0
20:17:39 <rbergeron> ?
20:17:51 <jsmith> => rbergeron
20:18:16 <cwickert> erm, hold on please
20:18:29 * jsmith holds
20:18:33 <rbergeron> is that process something that has been set in stone before? or was that just for that particular bidding session? .... I just wasn't aware of it (we certainly didn't do it for fudcon na, though tempe was the only bid) - if it needs to be part of a process, or is a process, we should probably call that out more somewhere on the wiki.
20:18:44 <rbergeron> though you know me, i'm not like, desperately needing process.
20:18:55 * jsmith wasn't aware of a process, and wasn't aware of that spreadsheet
20:19:10 <cwickert> so who was involved in that decision?
20:19:22 <jsmith> cwickert: FAmSCo
20:19:23 <rbergeron> if the deciding group thinks it's a good idea, they should use it, but if it's not useful, it's not necessarily something we need to set in stone.
20:19:56 <jsmith> cwickert: I was hoping to make it to their meeting on Saturday, but I was running late after my daughter's concert, and arrived just as they were wrapping up the meeting
20:20:07 <cwickert> ok, I see
20:20:28 * cwickert would like processes to be as transparent as possible
20:20:35 <cwickert> eof
20:20:36 <cwickert> arthurbuliva: your turn
20:21:25 <arthurbuliva> Talking of events, my friend and I have been organising a Gnome 3 release party for Nairobi
20:21:56 <arthurbuliva> much of the planning is OK and really wanted to have Fedora in the event
20:22:43 <cwickert> arthurbuliva: so?
20:22:47 * t2hot ... but Arthur is there.  Fedora is also there :)
20:23:02 <arthurbuliva> but someone (Have to refer to email to know who it is) made lots of sense when they said that it willl be out of order to distribute media with Gnome 2 on a Gnome 3 event
20:23:12 <cwickert> that was me :)
20:23:48 <cwickert> arthurbuliva: so what do you need from us?
20:23:53 <cwickert> is the event in the wiki?
20:24:04 <arthurbuliva> :-) and so we'll make do without Fedora but I will make sure I make noise about the upcoming release 15
20:24:30 <cwickert> ok, lets try to get back to the agenda
20:24:37 <cwickert> I have a lot of questions on this event
20:24:44 <cwickert> but we are still in announcements
20:24:53 <cwickert> arthurbuliva: can you give us date and location?
20:24:59 <arthurbuliva> cwikert so far all is taken care of. I have some surplus media and about 40 stickers that I can make do with
20:25:46 <arthurbuliva> Date is Sat April 9 from 14H00 local time (11H00 GMT)
20:25:46 <cwickert> lets discuss individual events later, this is for events
20:25:51 <Southern_Gentlem> ? jsmith you said 2 announcements?
20:26:07 <GeroldKa> ?!
20:26:12 <arthurbuliva> location is nairobi at the iHub
20:26:18 <arthurbuliva> eof
20:26:32 <cwickert> #into arthurbuliva to hold a GNOME 3 release party in the iHub in Nairobi on April 9th
20:26:52 <cwickert> jsmith: anything from your side, otherwise we continue with GeroldKa
20:27:08 <cwickert> #info arthurbuliva to hold a GNOME 3 release party in the iHub in Nairobi on April 9th
20:27:17 <jsmith> My other announcement was just a reminder to vote for the F16 release name
20:27:19 <jsmith> eof
20:27:24 <GeroldKa> just two small things regarding the FUDCon EMEA; 1.) I was called by phone from Werner Gold (Red hat Employee and responsible for the Partner Channel inside)  who asked if it's still decided
20:27:35 <cwickert> GeroldKa: please follow the meeting protocol!
20:27:49 <jsmith> !
20:28:18 <cwickert> #info Please don't forget to vote for the F16 release name at https://admin.fedoraproject.org/voting/about/relnamef16
20:28:21 <cwickert> #link https://admin.fedoraproject.org/voting/about/relnamef16
20:28:33 <cwickert> ok, GeroldKa, now it's your turn
20:28:36 <GeroldKa> and 2.) is going to our FPL, He also asked who is Jared Smith; :-P maybe you should introduce yourself to him (but I just wondered :-(
20:28:48 <GeroldKa> eof
20:29:17 * cwickert is trying to figure out what GeroldKa is telling us
20:29:26 <jsmith> I think I can answer that :-)
20:29:32 <cwickert> ok, jsmith then
20:29:40 * shaiton has a really bad connection tonight. too lagging, sorry
20:30:03 <jsmith> Werner Gold contacted me, as he seemed to think that we had agreed on Dublin as the winning bid
20:30:33 <cwickert> jsmith: eof?
20:30:33 <jsmith> I explained to him that Dublin was one of four bids, and explained how FUDCon in Dublin might work
20:31:07 <jsmith> I also explained that others within Red Hat were very concerned about the cost of doing FUDCon in Dublin (in conjunction w/ Partners Summit), and that there were internal discussions happening on that point
20:31:23 <jsmith> I think Werner is up to speed now :-)
20:31:24 <jsmith> eof
20:31:26 <GeroldKa> wow jared, you understood our concept with that bid, congratulation and thank you :-)
20:31:43 <jsmith> GeroldKa: I did, and tried to make it happen :-/
20:31:45 <cwickert> ok, thanks GeroldKa and jsmith
20:31:53 <cwickert> let's go on with the agenda please
20:32:24 <cwickert> #link http://rbergero.fedorapeople.org/schedules/f-15/f-15-ambassadors-tasks.html
20:32:57 <cwickert> all in all we are on time
20:33:05 <cwickert> any questions about the schedule?
20:33:37 <cwickert> rbergeron: I'm your POC for media production
20:33:48 <cwickert> ok, no questions, so we move on
20:34:15 <rbergeron> cwickert: noted. thanks.
20:34:24 <cwickert> I have several quotes, you can find them at
20:34:31 <cwickert> #link http://cwickert.fedorapeople.org/media/quote-f15.pdf
20:34:44 <cwickert> you can find the numbers in the table in the meeting agenda
20:34:59 <cwickert> and now we are to vote on media and quantities
20:35:10 <cwickert> we have a budget of USD 5000 approved
20:35:30 <cwickert> we don't have a PO number though, but at least this is about to happen this week
20:35:44 <cwickert> this means I can place the order *way*earlier than for F14
20:35:52 <cwickert> ok, and now it comes to voting
20:35:58 * t2hot ... Cool
20:35:58 <cwickert> please have a look on the table first
20:36:04 <t2hot> !
20:36:20 <cwickert> t2hot: go ahead
20:36:50 <t2hot> Variant 8 looks attractive. (my vote)
20:36:52 <t2hot> eof
20:37:54 <cwickert> hold on please
20:38:07 <cwickert> ok, as you can see 1-4 and 5-8 are similar
20:38:15 <cwickert> this means 5 is similar to 1 and so on
20:38:22 <cwickert> but 5-8 are cheaper
20:38:36 <cwickert> although we are doing dual layer which are more expensive
20:38:52 <cwickert> this is because of the production costs of the master
20:38:57 <cwickert> and the artwork
20:39:02 <cwickert> both is expensive
20:39:15 <cwickert> the less different media we do, the more value we get for the money
20:39:36 <cwickert> so the first question is: are we going to do Dual layer?
20:39:43 <cwickert> +1 (obviously)
20:40:04 <cwickert> more votes? anybody who dislikes dual layer?
20:40:07 * t2hot thinks we've already agreed on this
20:40:27 * jsmith has no problem with dual layer
20:40:28 <jenskuehnel> +1
20:40:40 <dmaphy> +1
20:40:49 <gregoryfenton> more room, less to carry to events. +1
20:41:23 <cwickert> jsmith: you are not allowed to vote, you are not from EMEA :P
20:41:25 <GeroldKa> +1
20:41:29 <jenskuehnel> ?
20:41:40 <cwickert> #agreed we are doing dual layer
20:41:45 <cwickert> jenskuehnel: yes please
20:42:02 <jenskuehnel> Thats DualLayer and not Dual Sided, correct?
20:42:06 <cwickert> yes
20:42:12 <GeroldKa> ?
20:42:19 <arthurbuliva> +1
20:42:22 <cwickert> GeroldKa: go ahead
20:42:33 <jenskuehnel> eof
20:42:34 <GeroldKa> we decide now for EMEA with a +3 voting?! Is that correct?
20:42:50 <cwickert> we decide by quorum
20:43:00 <cwickert> this means a majority of the people here
20:43:08 <GeroldKa> just to get the right view, thanks cwickert
20:43:10 <GeroldKa> eof
20:43:47 <cwickert> we had +4m this is a majority because we had 6 people in the roll call
20:44:07 <jenskuehnel> I was late and not in the roll call!
20:44:19 <cwickert> jenskuehnel: still a majority
20:44:50 <cwickert> ok, next question: are we *only* doing dual layer (5-8) or do we want to keep normal DVD for compatibility?
20:44:58 <cwickert> IMHO is is not necessary
20:45:07 <jenskuehnel> ?
20:45:09 <GeroldKa> !
20:45:18 <cwickert> because if we are doing something for comoatibility, then it should be CDs, not DVDs
20:45:34 <cwickert> jenskuehnel: yes please
20:45:51 * t2hot (to GeroldKa) put in +1 and Arthuboliva added +1   .... that's 5votes
20:45:52 <jenskuehnel> Are there some compatibility issues with dual layer?
20:46:14 <cwickert> jenskuehnel: only for burning, not for reading
20:46:30 <cwickert> dual layer is part of the DVD specification
20:46:38 <jenskuehnel> Not that I know of, because almost all DVDs are dual layer? So I don't think its neccessary.
20:46:39 <cwickert> so if you drive has the DVD logo, it can read them
20:46:41 <jenskuehnel> eof
20:46:51 <cwickert> ok, GeroldKa please
20:46:53 <GeroldKa> +1 for "normal" there are existing other needs than only Germany, that said means maybe africa or the eastern part and I fear they have not that modern equipment like we have
20:47:08 <GeroldKa> eof
20:47:28 <t2hot> !
20:48:08 <cwickert> GeroldKa: but they can either read DVD or not. CDs would make sense if people don't have DVD drives there, but IMHO single layer DVD don't make sense
20:48:18 <cwickert> t2hot: you are from afrika, tell us about your hardware
20:48:50 <t2hot> My Dell Precision M6300 has a DVD drive with that logo on it
20:48:58 <t2hot> :)
20:49:10 <cwickert> ok, and is this common hardware in africa?
20:49:31 <t2hot> It may surprise you that we're not far from you guys in tech ... they are only more expensive
20:49:52 <t2hot> And this Machine is three years old
20:49:59 <t2hot> So, we're good
20:49:59 <cwickert> or let me put it differently: do you think that we need normal DVDs for afrika?
20:50:06 <cwickert> ok, thanks for that statement
20:50:18 <cwickert> any more arguments before we vote?
20:51:04 <cwickert> ok, Proposal: All media should be Dual layer.
20:51:07 <cwickert> +1
20:51:11 <jenskuehnel> +1
20:51:13 <t2hot> +1
20:51:44 <cwickert> dmaphy, heffer: votes?
20:51:56 <cwickert> arthurbuliva: still with us?
20:52:05 <heffer> i'd +1 here
20:52:11 <arthurbuliva> +1
20:52:13 <arthurbuliva> yes
20:52:21 * dmaphy already voted +1 for dual layer dvds
20:52:35 <cwickert> dmaphy: but not for dual layer *only*
20:52:40 <cwickert> #agreed All media should be Dual layer.
20:52:45 <dmaphy> well
20:52:46 <dmaphy> +1
20:53:00 <cwickert> ok, and now we are to vote on the actual quote
20:53:16 <cwickert> variant 8 is just within our budget
20:53:20 <cwickert> this is 6000 media
20:53:26 <cwickert> more than we ever had :)
20:53:44 <heffer> i think that would be nice to have
20:53:59 <heffer> we should go for the optimum :) i.e. variant 8
20:54:00 * t2hot ... and in time too
20:54:33 <cwickert> and because of dual layer, it equals to 6000 install DVDs and 3000 livecds :)
20:54:39 <cwickert> ok, everybody find with 8?
20:54:57 <t2hot> +1
20:55:18 <cwickert> Proposal: We should order 6000 Dual layer DVDs, 3000 Dual Arch Installer and 3000 Multi Desktop Spins
20:55:20 <cwickert> +1
20:55:25 <cwickert> more votes?
20:55:36 <dmaphy> +1
20:56:03 <heffer> +1
20:56:20 <cwickert> GeroldKa: still with us?
20:56:23 <jenskuehnel> +1
20:56:30 <cwickert> #agreed We will order 6000 Dual layer DVDs, 3000 Dual Arch Installer and 3000 Multi Desktop Spins (variant 8)
20:56:47 <cwickert> ok, I think we are set for the media thing
20:56:59 <cwickert> andthing on events?
20:57:15 <t2hot> anything ... you mean?
20:57:17 * cwickert thinks we already covered most of that during the announcements
20:57:35 <cwickert> t2hot: if you have an event and want to tell us about it
20:58:00 <cwickert> but not about events in gereral, please don't propose to stop doing events or such ;)
20:58:17 <t2hot> I'm planning two at the moment ... but I was only wondering what your message meant?
20:58:54 <cwickert> when? in the near future or later this year?
20:59:21 <t2hot> May, Second Week (NIA local chapter meeting).
20:59:37 <cwickert> #action arthurbuliva to add a wiki page for his GNOME 3 Release event in Nairobi
20:59:53 <cwickert> #action t2hot to add his events to the wiki
21:00:09 <cwickert> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Events
21:00:23 <t2hot> ?
21:00:31 <cwickert> t2hot: is you need something, just drop me a note
21:00:34 <cwickert> yes please t2hot
21:01:18 <t2hot> Ok.  Any chance I could get F15 by first week in may (wishing)?
21:01:29 <cwickert> #action liknus to send cwickert buttons
21:01:51 <t2hot> I'll be almost blank by then
21:01:51 <cwickert> t2hot: I don't think so
21:01:53 <cwickert> look at https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Schedule
21:01:55 <dmaphy> unlikely since the release date is end of may
21:01:57 <cwickert> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Schedule
21:02:01 <t2hot> eof
21:02:37 <cwickert> t2hot: you might want to consider to reschedule your event for F15 arrival
21:02:52 <cwickert> ok, anything more on events?
21:03:00 <cwickert> something from me and jenskuehnel
21:03:06 * t2hot thinks that schedule is confusing somewhat.  A bar chart representation would be easier to grasp
21:03:18 <cwickert> we are still looking for people for LinuxTag in Berlin
21:03:33 <heffer> i got to go. see you guys
21:03:44 <cwickert> heffer, dmaphy, GeroldKa: you are from Germany, please consider joining us
21:04:15 * dmaphy is already considering.. ;)
21:04:16 <cwickert> #info people for LinuxTag in Berlin, please add yourself to the wiki at https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/LinuxTag_2011
21:04:23 <cwickert> ok, I think that's all
21:04:35 <cwickert> anything else?
21:04:37 <heffer> i'm unable to, as i can't take holidays from university (only from work). that's why i'll probably be unable to attend any event within the next 3 years
21:04:54 <cwickert> otherwise I'm going to close the meeting in 3 minuntes
21:05:19 <cwickert> heffer: too bad, I wanted to share a room with you because I like the stories you are telling while you sleep ;)
21:05:25 <heffer> :P
21:05:36 <cwickert> ok, just kidding
21:05:50 <cwickert> if you have something for discussion, speak up NOW
21:06:05 <jenskuehnel> OK, CU and good n8!
21:06:54 * cwickert will end the meeting in a minute
21:07:22 <ardian> Hi
21:07:38 <cwickert> ardian: you are late
21:07:45 <ardian> cwickert, Didn't have power
21:07:48 <cwickert> we are about to close the meeting now
21:07:53 <ardian> 2h without power :(
21:07:56 <cwickert> #endmeeting