16:00:03 <jlaska> #startmeeting Fedora QA Meeting
16:00:03 <zodbot> Meeting started Mon Mar  7 16:00:03 2011 UTC.  The chair is jlaska. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
16:00:03 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
16:00:06 <jlaska> #meetingname fedora-qa
16:00:06 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'fedora-qa'
16:00:12 <jlaska> #topic Roll Call
16:00:28 <vhumpa> Hia!
16:00:32 <jlaska> Hi folks ... anyone lurking for the QA meeting today?
16:00:35 * brunowolff is here.
16:00:38 * kparal again alive
16:00:40 * vhumpa is here
16:00:41 * jskladan_afk tips his hat
16:00:45 <jlaska> kparal lives!
16:00:50 * tflink is here
16:00:55 <jlaska> howdy brunowolff vhumpa jskladan tflink  :)
16:01:02 * Viking-Ice here
16:01:15 <jlaska> hey hey Viking-Ice
16:01:40 * jlaska waits another minute before getting started
16:02:40 <adamw> yo
16:02:48 <jlaska> a minute on the nose!
16:02:55 <jlaska> adamw: greetings
16:03:06 * adamw should really set his alarm for 7:54
16:03:11 <jlaska> alright, we have a light agenda today ... so let's dive in
16:03:27 <jlaska> #info Proposed Agenda - http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/test/2011-March/097566.html
16:03:34 <jlaska> #topic Previous meeting follow-up
16:03:57 <jlaska> #info Viking-Ice - solicit feedback on test@lists.fedoraproject.org to see whether we need to require only bugzilla.redhat.com use during test days
16:04:06 <jlaska> Viking-Ice: any updates you want to highlight?
16:05:19 <jlaska> okay ... I'll note if any updates come up
16:05:57 <jlaska> otherwise, I propose moving this off the follow-up list ... I can certainly add it back when needed
16:06:16 <Viking-Ice> still waiting for feed back on  the bugzilla RFE I filed
16:06:26 <jlaska> got a link?
16:06:32 <Viking-Ice> maybe I should move that to upstream mozilla
16:06:37 <jlaska> yes!
16:06:51 <jlaska> I believe it's a sizable feature request
16:07:11 <Viking-Ice> bug 679898
16:07:50 <Viking-Ice> if that gets implemented it would solve that problem along with others as well ( from maintainers perspective )
16:07:58 <jlaska> #link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=679898
16:08:21 <Viking-Ice> and we could always use our bugzilla instance to report against
16:08:33 <jlaska> sure ... we'll monitor that request
16:08:59 <Viking-Ice> I have been expecting anykind of feed back from the red hat bugzilla team on that RFE
16:09:40 <jlaska> I'm not surprised our current bz maintainer has not responded yet
16:09:53 <jlaska> he's new and coming up to speed with maint ... and this is definitely a big RFE :)
16:10:18 <jlaska> Your instinct about moving upstream is appropriate
16:10:28 <jlaska> okay ... we'll stay tuned for any updates
16:10:35 <jlaska> #info jlaska - review blocker bug meeting SOP and add include bug summary by way of #info for each bug
16:10:36 <Viking-Ice> Ok will do
16:10:48 <jlaska> nothing earth shattering here, just a minor wiki update
16:10:57 <jlaska> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/QA:SOP_Blocker_Bug_Meeting
16:11:13 <jlaska> I'll try to follow this and use #info tags during this Fridays blocker meeting
16:11:36 <jlaska> I'm lazy, and wish that meetbot/zodbot/*bot could automatically do this ... but haven't had time to look at the bot code
16:11:50 <jlaska> so ... exercise for anyone who likes bots
16:11:55 <jlaska> #info robatino+jlaska - infrastructure hosting of delta ISO images
16:12:08 <jlaska> robatino and nb get the credit for this ... it seems the issue has been resolved
16:12:29 * kparal starts fireworks
16:12:34 <jlaska> iirc, robatino now has the space needed to publish the TC and RC delta ISOs for testers
16:12:40 <robatino> hosted now at http://serverbeach1.fedoraproject.org/pub/alt/stage/deltaisos/ - comments for organization welcome
16:12:57 <robatino> right now the top-level directory is newiso, the next level is oldiso
16:13:02 <adamw> yayness
16:13:04 <jlaska> #link http://serverbeach1.fedoraproject.org/pub/alt/stage/deltaisos/
16:13:14 <adamw> we should spread the word
16:13:16 <jlaska> robatino: do you need any updates to https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Delta_ISOs ?
16:13:31 <Viking-Ice> what's the difference in Delto iso vs Regular iso ?
16:13:44 <jlaska> Viking-Ice: analogous to delta-rpm and regular rpm
16:13:54 <kparal> robatino: have you considered also posting torrents into that directory? is it possible to use fedora torrent tracker for that?
16:14:03 <Viking-Ice> so we have a smaller iso size?
16:14:11 <Viking-Ice> can fit more stuff ?
16:14:14 <robatino> jlaska: i'll have to think about it if the server content isn't self-explanatory
16:14:17 <jlaska> Viking-Ice: yeah ... so testers with limited bandwidth can participate in TC and RC testing
16:14:21 <jlaska> robatino: okay
16:14:33 <Viking-Ice> Ok
16:14:44 <jlaska> Viking-Ice: no ... not so we can fit more stuff ... this is so you don't need to download the entire DVD after you already downloaded TC1 DVD.iso
16:15:01 <jlaska> Viking-Ice: hopefully [[Delta_ISOs]] provides more detail
16:15:10 <robatino> kparal: i really hated using torrents for this since it's partly for people with limited bandwidth
16:15:17 <jlaska> adamw: "get the word out" ... what'd you have in mind?
16:15:22 <adamw> blogs
16:15:41 <adamw> nothing special
16:15:43 <adamw> just mention it :)
16:15:50 <jlaska> right on
16:15:59 <robatino> i also have deltas for 12->13 and 13->14 which are about half full size
16:15:59 <Viking-Ice> and announcement to the test list :)
16:16:07 <adamw> and of course we'll need to update the pre-release announcements, but since robatino usually winds up doing those it shouldn't be a problem =)
16:16:12 <adamw> Viking-Ice: i think it already was
16:16:13 <jlaska> test-announce@ certainly a good idea
16:16:19 <adamw> i remember reading a mail about it, anyway
16:16:41 <jlaska> info is linked from the validation wiki pages iirc
16:16:42 <adamw> oh no
16:16:43 <kparal> robatino: well I noticed some people who got very low speed for fedora servers. but wouldn't mind using torrents
16:16:44 <robatino> adamw: i only post deltaiso links on the test matrix pages anyway, and the announcements link to those
16:16:45 <adamw> it was a private email
16:17:18 <jlaska> certainly worth some visibility on fedora planet ... so feel free to mention it if you aggregate your blog there
16:17:26 <jlaska> (myself included in that request)
16:17:39 <jlaska> anything else from last week?
16:18:00 <jlaska> if not ... moving on ...
16:18:04 <jlaska> #topic Upcoming QA events
16:18:13 <jlaska> #info Tuesday, March 08 - l10n Desktop Test Day
16:18:21 <jlaska> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Test_Day:2011-03-08_L10n_Desktop
16:18:48 <jlaska> the announcement just hit test-announce -- http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/test-announce/2011-March/000202.html
16:19:11 <adamw> this is looking good except for the test case link
16:19:21 <jlaska> unlike the previous two events that focused on the installer and the desktop environment ... this is intended to target desktop apps
16:19:29 <jlaska> adamw: suggestions?
16:19:44 <jlaska> heh, that is weird :)
16:20:11 <jlaska> adamw: perhaps should link to a wiki page that uses the standard {{Template:QA/Test_Case}} ?
16:20:58 <adamw> i'm not sure what it's meant to be doing :)
16:21:41 <jlaska> Well ... let's start that discussion at https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-qa/ticket/158
16:21:59 <adamw> okay
16:22:13 <jlaska> #info adamw noted that the test case link doesn't point to a valid test case template (e.g. QA:TestCase_foo_bar_baz)
16:22:39 <jlaska> rhe: has been helping coordinate, so she may be able to run with any ideas/suggestions you have
16:23:13 <jlaska> okay ... next up ...
16:23:17 <jlaska> #info Thursday, March 10 - Gnome3 Pre-Beta Test Day
16:23:23 <jlaska> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Test_Day:2011-03-10_GNOME3_Beta
16:23:52 <jlaska> vhumpa and rlat have been investing some prep time in the second GNOME shell test day
16:24:08 <jlaska> vhumpa: any updates, how are things looking for you?
16:24:15 <adamw> nice job guys
16:24:16 <vhumpa> adamw: I finished implementing your notes from Friday just a little while ago
16:24:36 * jlaska sees two shiny test matrices!
16:24:41 <vhumpa> Hope all is moreorless ready now
16:24:49 <adamw> vhumpa: cool
16:25:08 <vhumpa> If somebody have a BT phone, please try this https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/QA:Testcase_gnome-bluetooth_send_file
16:25:12 <adamw> we just need to look at live images, we can probably just link to nightlies this time
16:25:27 <adamw> we only needed custom images last time because of the alpha freeze
16:25:44 <vhumpa> adamw: I agree nighties should be fine
16:26:01 <vhumpa> adamw: I am running the last one right now :)
16:26:02 <adamw> anyone know when the alpha freeze ends, actually?
16:26:10 <adamw> or did it already and i missed it?
16:26:34 <jlaska> dgilmore would know
16:26:49 <jlaska> I don't see it on the rel-eng schedule, or am missing it
16:26:51 <brunowolff> For packages it is over.
16:26:58 <adamw> okay.
16:27:01 <jlaska> brunowolff: thx
16:27:11 <jlaska> adamw: so that means tested updates should be landing in the nightlies?
16:27:13 <brunowolff> Pretty much when Rc2 was certified at the go / no-go meeting.
16:27:45 <adamw> jlaska: yeah, and it looks like they are.
16:27:51 <jlaska> excellent
16:27:56 <adamw> so we should be good.
16:28:07 <jlaska> vhumpa: we have several folks who can host live images if for some reason we need them
16:28:15 <vhumpa> Is the alpha freeze a reason why I was getting no new updates for F15 last couple of days?
16:29:01 <brunowolff> There isn't really an updates repo. Just updates-testing and branched.
16:29:17 <jlaska> vhumpa: I believe so ... during the "freeze", the base f15 repo wasn't changed except for approved blockers
16:29:49 <adamw> yeah, though if you had updates-testing enabled, you'd get updates all the way through.
16:30:06 <jlaska> vhumpa: rlat: adamw: nice work on the GNOME3 prep ... shout if any assistance is needed
16:30:16 <jlaska> next up ...
16:30:16 <vhumpa> Okay, just that I wasn't getting anything from updates-testing as well, but I gues the problem is elswhere then
16:30:27 <jlaska> #info Friday, March 11 - F15Beta bug review #1
16:30:47 <jlaska> #link Per the schedule, we'll have our first beta blocker review this Froday - http://rbergero.fedorapeople.org/schedules/f-15/f-15-quality-tasks.html
16:30:58 <jlaska> and for those who like links ...
16:31:00 <jlaska> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/QA:SOP_Blocker_Bug_Meeting
16:31:05 <jlaska> describes the format of the meeting
16:31:12 <jlaska> I'll send out an announcement Wednesday
16:31:19 <jlaska> last update ...
16:31:21 <jlaska> #info Thursday, March 17 - Preupgrade Test Day
16:31:26 <jlaska> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Test_Day:2011-03-17_Preupgrade
16:31:36 <jlaska> Once again, Hurry is initiating this event
16:32:09 <jlaska> we have a bug outstanding against preupgrade where it needs to accomodate the installer install.img change in F15.  A patch is available, and we'll just need to get an updated preupgrade from hughsie that we can point testers to
16:32:40 <jlaska> with that in hand, we should be able to make some good traction on preupgrade testing ... since it currently doesn't function against F15
16:32:55 <jlaska> alright ... if nothing else, I'll go to open-discussion
16:33:34 <jlaska> #info Need updated preupgrade that works without 'images/install.img' to test with F13 and F14
16:33:38 <jlaska> #topic Open discussion - <Your topic here>
16:33:47 <jlaska> okay folks ... those are all the topics I had
16:33:58 <jlaska> anything else not already discussed?
16:34:00 <vhumpa> jlaska: about the image hosting: do you think that will be needed for bandwidh reasons, if we decide to go with night build?
16:35:11 <jlaska> vhumpa: to my knowledge, the size of the test day (or nightly) live image is acceptable for participants
16:35:43 <jlaska> at least, I haven't seen a lot of complaints about downloading a single ISO for a test day (< 700 Mib)
16:36:21 <vhumpa> I mean I was just wondering whether the normal server can handle the downloads by the testers
16:36:51 <jlaska> vhumpa: oh oh, I see.  I believe so, but if we encounter problems, let's raise that with the experts in #fedora-admin for assistance
16:37:29 <vhumpa> jlaska: okay, perhaps we can quickly establish a mirror if that will happen
16:37:49 <vhumpa> I'll try to be monitoring the sit
16:37:54 <jlaska> vhumpa: okay
16:38:21 <vhumpa> jlaska: Let's hope we need a mirror ;-)
16:38:22 <adamw> i think they're ultimately pretty much the same thing (alt vs. fedorapeople)
16:39:09 <vhumpa> Okay, this should be all from me
16:39:23 <jlaska> adamw: I started documenting the installer related CommonBugs ... I should have the remaining installer issues knocked out shortly.  If you have time, I could use help with the X/kernel issues
16:39:42 <brunowolff> I did a download this morning from I2 and was getting around 10MB/s. So I think downloads should be reasonable
16:39:44 <jlaska> vhumpa: agreed, hopefully we won't hit any download issues :)
16:39:57 <brunowolff> with a dozen or so going on at once.
16:40:04 <adamw> jlaska: yeah, i'll get on it
16:40:41 <jlaska> adamw: your fingers are faster than mine, but I'm working my way down the list (starting with anaconda) so hopefully we can meet in the middle
16:40:48 <adamw> sure
16:40:51 <jlaska> brunowolff: that's not too bad at all
16:40:58 <jlaska> any other topics to cover today?
16:41:33 <jlaska> #info jlaska and adamw discussed documenting the outstanding bugs requesting CommonBugs documentation.  The process is detailed at https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Common_F15_bugs#My_bug_is_not_listed
16:42:21 <jlaska> #info vhumpa asked about alt.fedoraproject.org download speeds for live images.  brunowolff noted the speeds should be okay and jlaska reminded to raise any issues with #fedora-admin for guidance
16:42:36 <jlaska> alright ... setting the fuse at 1 minute until #endmeeting
16:43:05 <jlaska> btw ... we said it last week during the go/no_go ... but once again, THANK YOU to our testers for yet another Fedora milestone
16:43:39 <jlaska> wiki results, bug reports and discussion on the mailing list all contribute to identifying potential blocker bugs and understanding whether we meet the release criteria
16:43:46 <jlaska> so thank you to all who participated and help get it out the door
16:44:08 <brunowolff> This one was a tough one too, with the mass rebuild happening so close to freeze.
16:44:14 <jlaska> excactly
16:44:18 <jlaska> exactly (even)
16:44:26 <jlaska> so much change (rebuild, branch)
16:44:37 <jlaska> okay gang ... I'm calling end of meeting
16:44:41 <jlaska> thanks for your attendance and time
16:44:45 <jlaska> I'll send minutes to the list
16:45:07 <jlaska> As always, feel free to follow-up on the list with any topics you weren't able to raise during the meeting
16:45:10 <jlaska> #endmeeting