15:00:02 <adamw> #startmeeting Fedora QA Meeting 2010-09-13
15:00:02 <zodbot> Meeting started Mon Sep 13 15:00:02 2010 UTC.  The chair is adamw. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
15:00:02 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
15:00:14 <adamw> #meetingname fedora-qa
15:00:14 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'fedora-qa'
15:00:19 <adamw> #topic gathering
15:00:29 <adamw> $TIMEZONE_APPROPRIATE_GREETING, everyone
15:01:12 <adamw> who's around?
15:02:10 * fenris02 waves
15:02:14 * adamw watches dust ball roll by
15:02:18 <adamw> hiya fenris02
15:02:33 <adamw> robatino: hi
15:02:40 <robatino> hi
15:03:33 <adamw> hey, quiet group today..
15:03:45 <adamw> wwoods: ping?
15:04:20 <adamw> oh well, let's get started
15:04:26 * Viking-Ice sneaks inn
15:04:27 <adamw> #topic previous meeting follow-up
15:04:29 <adamw> heya viking
15:04:44 <adamw> so the last meeting was 2010-08-30, we skipped last week
15:04:44 <adamw> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/QA/Meetings/20100830
15:05:10 <adamw> "adamw contact lmacken about proventester metrics https://fedorahosted.org/bodhi/ticket/456"
15:05:20 <adamw> well, I poked the ticket, and luke's just in the last day or so updated it
15:05:51 <adamw> he writes "As for proventester metrics, that is something that takes longer to generate at the moment. We'll tackle that in Bodhi v2.0. "; I may ask him for some more info on that
15:06:00 <adamw> lmacken: not around at present, are you?
15:07:00 <adamw> spose not!
15:07:09 <adamw> "jlaska build and deploy new autoqa release "
15:07:22 <adamw> er, anyone know anything about this? I'm probably guilty of not keeping as up to date with autoqa as i should
15:08:44 <adamw> maybe we'd better leave it on for next time, then...
15:09:00 <lmacken> adamw: I am!
15:09:12 <adamw> ooh, yay. /me wonders if he's lagging
15:09:16 * jskladan lurks
15:09:21 * kparal joins late
15:09:27 <adamw> and here's kparal and jskladan, yay...
15:09:29 <adamw> so, going back in order
15:09:45 <adamw> lmacken: so you mean we'll get proventester metric reports when bodhi 2 is in place?
15:10:13 <lmacken> adamw: the latest bodhi code that I'm in the process of deploying to staging right now will list unapproved critpath updates at the top of the updates-testing digest mails.
15:10:34 <lmacken> the other part of the ticket you created was to list the top proventesters, which will have to wait due to current database constraints
15:10:49 <adamw> awesome. thanks.
15:11:09 <adamw> what's the timeframe on bodhi 2 (revenge of bodhi) looking like?
15:11:19 <lmacken> shall I have bodhi spam proventester-members@fp.o with other events?
15:11:33 <lmacken> adamw: hopefully by F15?
15:12:09 <lmacken> bodhi currently has a nagmail job that spams maintainers when their critpath update is unapproved for 2 weeks... however, that's not useful to the maintainer at all -- so shall I send it to proventester-members@ instead?
15:12:24 <lmacken> I could also have it send a mail for each new critpath update upon submission?
15:12:27 <adamw> hum, possibly...maybe do it as a trial and we'll see who complains
15:12:35 <lmacken> sounds good :)
15:12:48 <adamw> i'll contact you outside of the meeting and we can set it up, be best to send an announcement email before starting it
15:12:58 <lmacken> ok
15:13:05 <adamw> anyone have an opinion whether that's a good idea?
15:13:24 <lmacken> anyone can get the new critpath updates via RSS, but some may prefer email :\
15:13:33 <lmacken> definitely for the 2-week mark ones (maybe even 1 week w/o approval?)
15:13:44 * Viking-Ice throws in ... https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/How_to_debug_Systemd_problems
15:13:54 * wwoods is here, whoops
15:14:05 <fenris02> Viking-Ice, thanks for putting that together.  nice page.
15:14:19 <adamw> Viking-Ice: can we keep it for open discussion?
15:14:25 <adamw> trying to stay on one topic at a time
15:14:32 <Viking-Ice> yup
15:14:46 <adamw> lmacken: okay, i'll email you after the meeting
15:14:48 <adamw> moving on...
15:14:54 <Viking-Ice> I just threw that one so back to topic I myself am a rss junkie
15:15:12 <adamw> kparal: we had an action item for jlaska last time: "jlaska build and deploy new autoqa release "
15:15:17 <adamw> kparal: do you know how he did with that?
15:15:25 <kparal> adamw: that's done
15:15:33 * kparal looking for release number
15:15:34 <adamw> coolbeans
15:15:42 <adamw> we can keep details for the autoqa update later i guess
15:15:47 <adamw> okay, on to this week's agenda...
15:16:04 <adamw> #topic F-14-Beta TC1 testing -- feedback needed!
15:16:14 <adamw> so, just like it says on the tin - TC1 is out, we should be testing it
15:16:47 <adamw> the install test matrix is pretty full, mostly green with some red dotted in there: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Test_Results:Current_Installation_Test
15:17:12 <adamw> desktop matrix is empty, so far, doesn't help that we don't have official live images: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Test_Results:Current_Desktop_Test
15:17:16 <adamw> i'll try and do something about that
15:18:12 <adamw> anyone have any comments on tc1?
15:18:18 <robatino> the RC is scheduled for the 16th - will there be a TC2?
15:19:05 <adamw> i don't know the answer to that for sure, i suspect we probably don't need one...oxf13, around? thoughts?
15:21:12 <adamw> guess he isn't
15:22:15 <adamw> #info TC1 is out and in testing, looking quite good, RC1 scheduled for 09-16
15:22:25 <adamw> #topic F-14 Test Days
15:22:47 <adamw> so, we had the systemd test day on 2010-09-07: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Test_Day:2010-09-07_Systemd
15:22:56 <adamw> the results were pretty useful and mostly encouraging
15:23:15 <adamw> i sent out a recap - http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/test/2010-September/093463.html
15:24:07 <adamw> any notes on that?
15:25:00 <adamw> ok
15:25:07 <adamw> #info systemd test day completed and recap sent out
15:25:36 <Viking-Ice> I personally am on the opinion that systemd is ready for F14
15:26:06 <adamw> that's mostly a decision for fesco; they've asked for our input and i said about the same thing, but it's in their hands now
15:26:27 <adamw> jlaska and i also said that we thought it wouldn't be impossible to revert to upstart between tc1 and rc1, but it would be somewhat risky
15:26:34 <Viking-Ice> yup ( going through the fesco ticket now )
15:26:47 <adamw> we said we thought rc1 was the deadline for switching: whatever we put in beta rc1 should be what goes in final
15:28:34 <adamw> ok, so coming up this week we have the installer i18n / keymap test day - basically checking support for non-english languages and keyboards in the installer
15:29:00 <adamw> that's https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Test_Day:2010-09-16_AnacondaTranslationKeyboard
15:29:42 <adamw> igor suares and hurry have been working hard on this one and it looks pretty well set up, so that's great
15:29:49 <adamw> anyone have questions/concerns/comments on that event?
15:31:27 <adamw> ookay, sounds good then =)
15:31:33 <kparal> :)
15:31:33 <wwoods> just that a Test Day for this thing is an Really Great Idea
15:31:36 <wwoods> and long overdue
15:31:37 <wwoods> heh
15:31:45 <adamw> yup it really is
15:31:57 <adamw> we did some half-assed testing last release but this is much better and looks like they've done great work on it
15:32:11 <wwoods> so kudos and many thanks to igor and hurry for getting it set up
15:32:26 <wwoods> if it works out well, we might consider making it a per-release thing
15:32:27 <adamw> #info installer keymap / translation test day is looking prepped and ready to go, group vote of thanks to igor and hurry for preparation
15:32:31 <adamw> definitelu
15:32:32 <adamw> y
15:32:44 <adamw> it's one of those things that's always going wrong :)
15:33:13 <adamw> so the following week is the virtualization test day: no page for that yet, but we have a ticket - https://fedorahosted.org/fedora-qa/ticket/114
15:33:35 <Oxf13> I'm around.  No current plans for a TC2, however that could just be a ticket away
15:33:56 <adamw> jforbes filed the ticket and volunteered to run the test day also, so if you're around jforbes, here's a quick reminder that it's coming up in 10 days now :) if you need help prepping, do let us know
15:34:18 <adamw> Oxf13: ok, thanks. i'm not aware of a pressing reason for one, we had the firstboot issue with tc1 but the parameters of that are well known and the fix looks fine from testing
15:34:30 <jforbes> adamw: yup, aware of it :)
15:34:35 <jforbes> I will get the pages up this week
15:34:40 <adamw> jforbes: awesome
15:34:41 <jforbes> most of it is recycled content
15:35:24 <adamw> always the easiest
15:36:43 <adamw> #info jforbes is aware of the pending virtualization test day and is confident he'll have it prepped in time
15:37:06 <adamw> okay, that's test days...
15:37:17 <adamw> #topic AutoQA
15:37:24 <adamw> time to hand over to wwoods / kparal!
15:37:30 <adamw> #admin wwoods
15:37:36 <adamw> d'oh, is that the wrong one?
15:37:49 <wwoods> uh
15:37:50 <kparal> depends what you want to do?
15:37:51 <wwoods> do what now?
15:37:56 <adamw> make you a mod for the meeting...
15:38:06 * adamw forgets the command
15:38:12 <kparal> chair?
15:38:19 <adamw> that's it
15:38:21 <wwoods> let kparal do it - I think you've done this before?
15:38:25 <adamw> #chair kparal
15:38:25 <zodbot> Current chairs: adamw kparal
15:38:35 <adamw> wwoods: it's just so you can do action items and stuff while doing the autoqa update if you like
15:38:40 <adamw> #chair wwoods
15:38:40 <zodbot> Current chairs: adamw kparal wwoods
15:38:45 <adamw> if you don't want to use the powahs you can ignore them =)
15:38:52 <kparal> alright :)
15:39:05 <adamw> jlaska mentions package acceptance stuff in the agenda, and of course anything else you've been working on, let us know
15:39:23 <wwoods> well let's see - I'll give a quick depcheck update
15:39:30 <kparal> wwoods: go ahead
15:40:06 <wwoods> depcheck has a bunch of new unittests handling various multilib situations
15:40:20 <wwoods> one of the newer unittests proved that depcheck alone cannot prevent problems like the nss-softokn error
15:40:36 <wwoods> so we'll need another test to guard against that
15:41:02 <wwoods> another test showed that depcheck doesn't currently prevent *file* conflicts from happening
15:41:02 <adamw> cool
15:41:18 <wwoods> it only checks the RPM headers, at the moment. I think that's probably wrong, though
15:41:24 <adamw> #info wwoods has been creating unittests for depcheck to investigate various multilib cases
15:41:50 <wwoods> and so I'll be adding an RPM test transaction to depcheck - which is what yum does before it installs packages
15:42:11 <adamw> #info wwoods will also add an rpm test transaction to depcheck to catch file conflicts
15:42:47 <wwoods> we're also getting very close to being able to use mash in depcheck, which will ensure that we're properly testing the correct set of packages as input
15:43:07 <wwoods> jskladan informs me that he's just gotten mash to run and produce some output, so yay!
15:43:44 <wwoods> I'm hoping depcheck will be giving us useful (informational only) data very soon - before the end of the month, at the latest.
15:43:48 <jskladan> jskladan: heh, but you have not seen the output yet :)
15:43:51 <wwoods> and that's all for depcheck.
15:43:54 <jskladan> but let's stay tuned :)
15:44:00 <wwoods> jskladan: heh true! I'm still hopeful, though
15:44:09 <adamw> #wwoods hoping that depcheck will be able to provide informational data by the end of the month
15:44:38 <kparal> ok, some more updates:
15:44:50 <kparal> jlaska released autoqa-0.4.0-1 recently
15:45:09 <kparal> some big changes are inside, see changelog
15:45:09 <adamw> #info jlaska has pushed the new autoqa 0.4.0
15:45:13 <wwoods> (producing *correct* data is really the reason this is taking so long - we want to be nearly 100% sure that it's doing the right thing before we start making it bother people.)
15:45:37 <kparal> and I have posted some patches fixing problems in multihook tests
15:46:01 <kparal> oh, and yes - autoqa will be presented on FUDCon Zurich, this week, by me
15:46:11 <adamw> everyone who's anyone will be there
15:46:21 <kparal> so we suppose some new people that will come and have a look at the project
15:46:22 <adamw> #info kparal presenting on autoqa at FUDCon Zurich
15:46:29 <kparal> adamw: :D
15:46:48 <adamw> did you check in with wwoods on presentation ideas? he already presented autoqa at the last FUDCon NA so he may have good ideas for you
15:47:18 <kparal> adamw: I sent out slide drafts, I'll gladly hear any recommendations
15:48:07 <kparal> ok, and those last 3 things together make one question, mainly for wwoods, I guess
15:48:18 <wwoods> kparal: if you'd like a look at my slides.. hang on for a link
15:48:24 <kparal> will we want to make another release including those multihook tests soon, before fudcon happens?
15:48:40 <kparal> s/tests/patches
15:48:49 <wwoods> http://tinyurl.com/autoqa-slides
15:49:03 <wwoods> kparal: yes, if at all possible
15:49:22 <wwoods> I'll be reviewing your patchset directly after the meeting
15:49:29 <kparal> wwoods: if you can review the patches, jlaska told me he should be able to make another release
15:49:46 <kparal> and if anything goes wrong, he will deploy back the current release
15:50:24 <adamw> #info team would like to make a new release with multihook tests before fudcon if possible
15:51:14 <kparal> ok, that's it I guess, no more updates
15:51:24 <kparal> come to FUDCon for more info about AutoQA! :)
15:51:31 <adamw> will do :)
15:52:00 <adamw> thanks to autoqa team
15:52:05 <adamw> #topic open discussion
15:52:08 <adamw> soo, open discussion
15:52:12 <adamw> i think viking had something for us
15:52:26 <Viking-Ice> Well I finished the debug page for systemd
15:52:54 <Viking-Ice> and I need to write another one for udev then I think we got the whole boot up covered
15:53:34 <adamw> coolbeans
15:53:36 <adamw> what was that link again?
15:53:49 <Viking-Ice> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/How_to_debug_Systemd_problems
15:55:03 <adamw> #info viking-ice has completed his page on debugging systemd
15:55:08 <adamw> thanks for that!
15:55:31 <Viking-Ice> yeah I should have done that long time ago just things been crazy at $dayjob
15:56:24 <adamw> don't worry
15:57:15 <adamw> okay, so anyone have anything else for open floor?
15:58:15 * wwoods shakes head, sits on hands
15:59:00 <adamw> much easier than the other way around
15:59:17 <adamw> the 'inverse jazz hands', feared by every broadway actor
15:59:54 <adamw> welp, looks like we're done...
16:00:32 <adamw> thanks for coming, everyone!
16:00:34 <adamw> #endmeeting