16:02:05 <jlaska> #startmeeting Fedora QA meeting
16:02:05 <zodbot> Meeting started Mon Feb  8 16:02:05 2010 UTC.  The chair is jlaska. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
16:02:07 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
16:02:11 <jlaska> #meetingname fedora-qa
16:02:11 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'fedora-qa'
16:02:19 <adamw> morning
16:02:20 <jlaska> #topic Start your engines ...
16:02:39 <jlaska> adamw: mornin' to ya
16:02:57 * kparal appears
16:03:14 <jlaska> we'll be without wwoods today, who hopefully safely in transit from New Orleans
16:03:27 <jskladan> hi there
16:03:34 * tk009 remains in the shadows
16:03:44 <jlaska> and we'll be joined by a new member today ... jskladan
16:03:55 <jlaska> jskladan: welcome!
16:03:59 <adamw> hello
16:05:00 <jlaska> jskladan joins kparal in the Brno RHT office as an intern
16:05:12 <jlaska> please keep the hazing to a minimum :)
16:05:24 <jlaska> tk009: thanks for joining!
16:05:34 * stickster is lurky
16:05:36 * kparal is not alone anymore
16:05:44 <adamw> not even the shaving foam and the rubber frog?
16:05:50 <jlaska> stickster: welcome lurker :P
16:06:04 <jlaska> adamw: frog yes ... foam, hopefully not :D
16:06:19 <adamw> man, you're just no fun any more
16:06:25 <jlaska> haha
16:06:26 <jskladan> hopefully, i'm not familliar with the frog concept :-D
16:06:51 <jlaska> alright, we have a short agenda today ... so let's dive in
16:07:17 <jlaska> proposed agenda - http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/test/2010-February/088359.html
16:07:25 <jlaska> #topic Previous meeting follow-up
16:07:42 <jlaska> #info jlaska to request zodbot tracking for updated F-13 QA RSS feeds (blocker bugs, common_bugs? etc...
16:08:07 <jlaska> I don't know if others find this useful, I know adamw monitors the bug activity from the blocker cc list
16:08:09 * nirik didn't do anything on that, can work with jlaska to get it done.
16:08:32 <adamw> it can be useful at crunch time I guess
16:08:32 <jlaska> but I've got a few rss feeds ready now ... nirik, what would you like to proceed?  tickets or just irc?
16:09:27 <nirik> irc would be fine... we can discuss over in #fedora-qa?
16:09:41 <jlaska> nirik: you got it, I'll ping you after the meeting if that's okay
16:09:48 <nirik> sounds good.
16:09:52 <jlaska> nirik: thanks :)
16:10:16 <jlaska> #action jlaska will follow-up w/ nirik after the meeting to setup zodbot feed watchers
16:10:22 <jlaska> okay, next up ...
16:10:26 <jlaska> #info jlaska to organize a gobby meeting with wwoods+kparal to begin requirements/goal definition for a results db
16:10:48 <jlaska> wwoods and kparal came to the rescue here ... we've got a meeting setup for tomorrow to begin the process
16:11:57 <jlaska> I'll be setting up a gobby document so our small group (and whoever else wants to join) can record requirements for the resultsdb
16:13:07 <jlaska> nothing else there ... this is just an informal discussion around how to approach the resultsdb autoqa topic
16:13:23 <jlaska> kparal: anything else to add there?
16:14:02 <kparal> jlaska: I don't think so
16:14:21 <kparal> anyone is welcome
16:14:37 <jlaska> #info gobby document will be used to help organize thoughts to formulate requirements
16:14:49 <jlaska> next up ...
16:14:56 <jlaska> #info jlaska to discuss updating QA schedule with poelstra to reflect new 'release validation' focus
16:15:26 <jlaska> I didn't tough this topic last week, I'll keep this on and bring it up with poelcat this week
16:15:35 <jlaska> #info no updates ... will review next week
16:15:41 <jlaska> and last ...
16:15:46 <jlaska> #info jlaska and adamw to work on drafting a 'last known good' wiki page
16:15:58 <adamw> I, um, didn't hear from you
16:16:10 <jlaska> nope, I spoke to Oxf13 on Friday about this task to better understand it
16:17:00 <jlaska> from what I can tell, there is some terminology that still needs fleshing out.  But I wanted to make sure I understood the bigger picture before diving into the doc space
16:17:41 <Oxf13> and I just realized that the symlink name we picked for last known good was.. misspelled
16:17:49 <jlaska> lng :)
16:17:50 <Oxf13> "lng" doesn't really work for Last Known Good
16:17:53 <jlaska> hehe
16:18:16 <adamw> hey, keep it...it could become something for people to post annual puzzled mailing list questions about
16:18:53 <jlaska> Oxf13: once we hit feature freeze, if I understand correctly, image creation for the F-13 branch will be enabled right?
16:19:00 <Oxf13> yes
16:19:21 <jlaska> will that be using the same URL we've established for current RATS drops?
16:19:36 <jlaska> e.g. http://serverbeach1.fedoraproject.org/pub/alt/stage/rawhide-testing/
16:20:01 <Oxf13> no, once image creation happens nightly it'll be along side the packages themselves.
16:20:30 <Oxf13> download.fedoraproject.org/pub/fedora/linux/develpment/13/Everything/os/images
16:20:37 <Oxf13> Not certain about the "Everything" part of that path
16:20:38 <jlaska> ah, in that Everything URL  http://download.fedoraproject.org/pub/fedora/linux/development/13
16:20:47 <jlaska> I see, thanks
16:20:58 <jlaska> okay, so certainly keep this on the list
16:21:08 <Oxf13> this also is a prelude to having download.fedoraproject.org/pub/fedora/linux/development/rawhide/ as the new path for Rawhide.
16:21:09 <kparal> what about yum repos, what happens if I have rawhide repo enabled?
16:21:19 <Oxf13> kparal: if you're on rawhide now, you stay on rawhide.
16:21:31 <Oxf13> kparal: if you install from the branch, or Alpha, you stay on Fedora 13
16:21:33 <kparal> Oxf13: so I have to manually change tomorrow, right?
16:21:42 <jlaska> all good questions for us to document on this page
16:21:51 <Oxf13> kparal: it might be a few days before we get everything settled
16:21:54 * jlaska will start recording this stuff in a TRAC ticket
16:22:31 <jlaska> I suspect this will be an ongoing topic for a few meetings, so I'll keep this on the list
16:23:09 <jlaska> okay ... anything else from last week before we move on?
16:23:51 <jlaska> #info keep on the list for next week, move discussion into trac ticket and start identifying changes needed to [[Releases/Rawhide]] wiki
16:24:08 <jlaska> alright, moving into the agenda
16:24:11 <jlaska> #topic Rawhide Acceptance Testing #3
16:24:26 <jlaska> #info Last week, 2010-02-04 was the third pre-Alpha rawhide acceptance test milestone
16:24:40 <jlaska> automated test results are available at https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Test_Results:Fedora_13_Rawhide_Acceptance_Test_3
16:25:10 <jlaska> right now the rawhide acceptance test run is marked *FAIL*
16:25:21 <jlaska> due to bug#559290
16:26:06 <jlaska> I can work around this with a minor change to the AutoQA library virtguest.py ... but I'm not comfortable increasing the default RAM for a guest from 512 to 768 yet
16:26:37 <jlaska> #info there are a few others AutoQA changes that I need to run by wwoods for his thoughts as well
16:27:49 <jlaska> aside from that, I'll be trying to help move that bug forward this week
16:28:02 <jlaska> that's it from me on RATS drop #3
16:28:23 <jlaska> let's do a quick run through on any AutoQA updates ...
16:28:29 <jlaska> #topic AutoQA project update - depcheck
16:28:52 <jlaska> wwoods isn't around, but posted the current status to fedora planet ...
16:28:57 <jlaska> http://qa-rockstar.livejournal.com/9234.html
16:29:17 <jlaska> so stay tuned for some new built-in testsuite goodness :)
16:29:35 <jlaska> #topic AutoQA project update - rpmguard/resultsdb
16:29:51 <jlaska> kparal, any new and noteworthy updates on the rpmguard/resultsdb front?
16:30:14 <kparal> unfortunately none, I haven't made any updates on it last week
16:31:00 <kparal> but we may expect next week summary of discussion about results db
16:31:00 <jlaska> kparal: should we continue checking in on this topic?  Would you rather change the focus to the package update test plan topic you briefed us on last week?
16:31:28 <jlaska> ah good point, I'll keep the resultsdb topic
16:31:48 <kparal> well I will try to post some package update test plan documents this week
16:31:57 <kparal> so I hope we can consult it next week here
16:32:38 <jlaska> that's exciting ... just give me a holler if that's something you want in a future meeting agenda
16:32:47 <kparal> so as you deem appropriate, it may not be a regular topic, but when I have some updates, I won't forget to let you all know
16:33:33 <jlaska> gotcha
16:34:33 <jlaska> I've got to run into another meeting folks, so I'm going to run through these next 2 topics
16:34:44 <jlaska> #topic AutoQA project update - install automation
16:35:22 <jlaska> The latest I have from Liam is he initiated discussion with the fedora virt team for guidance on how to proceed with booting an ISO, while providing custom cmdline arguments
16:35:42 <jlaska> #link http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/virt/2010-February/001809.html
16:35:59 <jlaska> that thread offered some interesting approaches ... so hopefully more on that next week
16:36:10 <jlaska> #topic AutoQA project update - packaging
16:36:31 <jlaska> I got some feedback from upstream GWT on the bundled JAR files
16:36:32 <jlaska> http://groups.google.com/group/google-web-toolkit-contributors/browse_thread/thread/fc5713c023919618/f423351722bc7afe
16:36:57 <jlaska> there is an interesting gotcha lurking, but I think the plan is to kill procrastination and proceed with packaging the JPackage deps
16:37:22 <jlaska> My goal is to have one package inprogress this week
16:38:00 <adamw> cool
16:38:04 <jlaska> alrighty ... adamw or kparal, can you bring the meeting home, I need to divert focus for a few moments
16:38:11 <jlaska> #chair adamw
16:38:12 <zodbot> Current chairs: adamw jlaska
16:38:13 <jlaska> #chair kparal
16:38:14 <zodbot> Current chairs: adamw jlaska kparal
16:38:17 <adamw> sure, where's the agenda?
16:38:28 <jlaska> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/QA/Meetings/20100208#Upcoming_QA_events
16:38:48 <jlaska> I just wanted to highlight where we are in the QA schedule, and what's coming this week
16:38:54 <jlaska> and then open it up for things not discussed yet
16:38:59 <adamw> okey dokey
16:39:03 <adamw> #topic upcoming events
16:39:38 <adamw> so we are through the RATS phase, and this week we hit our first manual install testing point
16:39:49 <adamw> with testing of the test compose and alpha candidate
16:40:19 <adamw> I will also aim to have desktop validation tests going alongside install validation
16:40:31 <akurtakov> jlaska: if you have a problem with some package or you need a review let me know
16:40:37 <adamw> we also have the second alpha blokcer review meeting
16:40:40 <adamw> thanks, akurtakov
16:40:44 <jlaska> akurtakov: thanks for the offer!
16:41:09 <jlaska> adamw: you wanna try that master results wiki page that includes the different validation efforts?
16:41:14 <jlaska> or is that overkill
16:41:22 <adamw> um if we get to it sure
16:41:31 <adamw> for now I still have to get the desktop validation pages up and running properly :)
16:41:42 <jlaska> #info 2010-02-11 - Test Alpha 'Test Compose' (boot media testing)
16:41:48 <jlaska> #info 2010-02-12 - Alpha Blocker Meeting (F13Alpha) #2
16:42:03 <jlaska> adamw: killer job with the first blocker bug meeting last week!
16:42:07 <adamw> thanks
16:42:33 <kparal> so, the desktop validation testing will be part of Test Alpha 'Test Compose'?
16:42:51 <adamw> kparal: probably the 'test alpha candidate', but really they're so close together
16:43:10 <adamw> i'll probably try to co-ordinate with liam and have them listed together in the emails he usually sends out
16:43:19 <kparal> great
16:43:30 <adamw> desktop validation testing is this stuff:
16:43:31 <adamw> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Adamwill/Draft_desktop_test_matrix
16:43:32 <adamw> basically
16:43:38 <jlaska> adamw: rhe will be organizing the install community events for F-13
16:43:53 <adamw> jlaska: aha, ok. so I'll co-ordinate with rhe :)
16:44:02 <jlaska> sweet, thank you
16:44:23 <adamw> and just to remind, we'll go through all of those tests, even if only two will actually block the alpha if they fail.
16:44:38 <adamw> at least, that's the idea. :)
16:45:08 <adamw> so, any other questions/concerns around the validation testing or the blocker meeting?
16:46:54 <adamw> alrighty then
16:46:56 <adamw> #open floor
16:46:59 <adamw> grr
16:46:59 <jlaska> just excited to put the new plans to the test!
16:47:02 <adamw> #topic open floor
16:47:17 <adamw> any *other* questions/concerns anyone has? :)
16:47:49 <jlaska> I was trying find the ibus dependency bug before the meeting today, but turning up empty with my quick bz searches
16:48:09 <jlaska> seems like that's been around for some time, was curious if it's being addressed
16:48:17 <adamw> not familiar with that one?
16:48:45 <jlaska> I'll try to get a bz for this on the radar
16:49:21 <nirik> jlaska: ajax rebuilt them today.
16:49:44 <ajax> i'm a machine
16:49:45 <nirik> so should be fixed in tomorrow's rawhide.
16:50:09 <jlaska> nirik: oh nice, thanks for the time saver
16:50:11 * nirik thought about rebuilding them last night, but wasn't sure if there was any api changes there.
16:50:49 <ajax> if they are, they're the subtle "same function signature but different behaviour" type
16:50:49 <adamw> alright, anything else?
16:51:02 <ajax> which means ibus is even more incompetent than expected ;)
16:51:13 <nirik> ajax: you never know. ;) But thanks for rebuilding them...
16:52:22 * tk009 needs milk with this cupcake.
16:52:28 <adamw> it seems bad that ajax would have to rebuild ibus...how long has whatever the problem is been a problem?
16:52:38 <nirik> around a week I think.
16:52:38 <adamw> tk009: duly noted for the minutes!
16:52:53 <adamw> shouldn't we have a super-keen i18n team who would do that?
16:53:15 <nirik> I asked juhp last night and he was going to talk to maintainers....
16:53:30 <adamw> great
16:54:16 <adamw> okay, so, if there's nothing else, we'll close out the meeting soon.
16:55:20 <adamw> alright, thanks for coming everyone
16:55:27 <adamw> #endmeeting