16:00:35 <sesivany> #startmeeting FAmSCo 2014-07-08
16:00:35 <zodbot> Meeting started Tue Jul  8 16:00:35 2014 UTC.  The chair is sesivany. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
16:00:35 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
16:00:38 <sesivany> #meetingname famsco
16:00:38 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'famsco'
16:00:43 <sesivany> #topic Roll Call
16:00:49 <sesivany> .fas eischmann
16:00:49 <zodbot> sesivany: eischmann 'Jiri Eischmann' <eischmann@redhat.com>
16:00:52 <tuanta> .fas tuanta
16:00:53 <zodbot> tuanta: tuanta 'Truong Anh Tuan' <tuanta@iwayvietnam.com>
16:00:59 <sesivany> robyduck: ping
16:01:13 <sesivany> masta: ping
16:01:13 <tuanta> ping lbazan
16:01:38 <tuanta> sesivany, do you see cwickert around?
16:02:15 <sesivany> tuanta: I just pinged him over Jabber.
16:02:27 <tuanta> I pinged him on #fedora-ambassadors
16:02:35 <robyduck> .fas robyduck
16:02:35 <zodbot> robyduck: robyduck 'Robert Mayr' <robyduck@gmail.com>
16:04:02 <yn1v> .fas yn1v
16:04:03 <zodbot> yn1v: yn1v 'Neville A. Cross' <yn1v@taygon.com>
16:04:09 * yn1v Nicaragua
16:04:34 <sesivany> great, we have a quorum.
16:04:57 <sesivany> although I'm not sure if we have anything to vote about today anyway.
16:05:55 <sesivany> do you have any topics to discuss today?
16:06:02 <tuanta> sesivany, I remember we missed something to vote in previous meeting
16:06:27 <tuanta> about increasing support for people in EMEA to attend Flock
16:06:41 <sesivany> tuanta: not really, we decided not to approve it in the end.
16:06:50 <tuanta> ah, ok
16:06:55 <sesivany> there was no consensus.
16:08:20 <masta> sesivany: hey guys
16:08:20 <sesivany> robyduck objected and I didn't really want to push it.
16:08:31 <tuanta> I even have to pay for visa application fee (EUR 60) from my pocket
16:08:34 <sesivany> I didn't have a strong opinion about it.
16:08:37 <lbazan> .fas lbazan
16:08:38 <zodbot> lbazan: lbazan 'Luis Enrique Bazán De León' <bazanluis20@gmail.com>
16:08:40 <masta> I'm here, sry.... latent calendar notification
16:08:45 <tuanta> people may need to pay something from their pocket
16:08:52 <yn1v> about Latam sponsorship to FLOCK ... it was confirmed and the flight ticket has been purchased
16:09:07 <tuanta> yn1v, for who?
16:09:12 <yn1v> echevemaster
16:09:19 <tuanta> just one person, right?
16:09:22 <yn1v> yes
16:09:35 <tuanta> .fasinfo echevemaster
16:09:36 <zodbot> tuanta: User: echevemaster, Name: Eduardo Javier Echeverria Alvarado, email: echevemaster@gmail.com, Creation: 2012-08-26, IRC Nick: echevemaster, Timezone: America/Caracas, Locale: es, GPG key ID: 0D4E4BA9, Status: active
16:09:39 <zodbot> tuanta: Approved Groups: @icaroproject @fedora-icaro provenpackager +packager ambassadors fedorabugs fedora-ve cla_done cla_fpca
16:10:23 <masta> oh that is unfortunate, I though we bless the $200 or $280 (which ever), and the EMEA region decides.
16:10:41 <sesivany> yn1v: great, I've already sent him an invitation letter for visa application.
16:10:55 * cwickert is sorry to be late
16:10:58 <cwickert> .fas cwickert
16:10:58 <yn1v> echevemaster contacted the person in charge of university dormitories for his lodging
16:10:58 <zodbot> cwickert: cwickert 'Christoph Wickert' <christoph.wickert@gmail.com>
16:11:44 <sesivany> I think we planned to discuss the process for approving new mentors, right?
16:12:05 <tuanta> yes, sesivany
16:12:07 <sesivany> #topic Process for approving new mentors
16:12:22 <sesivany> does anyone have # of the ticket?
16:12:24 <cwickert> tuanta: can you make us chairs?
16:12:33 <cwickert> https://fedorahosted.org/famsco/ticket/259
16:12:44 <sesivany> #chair sesivany tuanta cwickert masta lbazan yn1v
16:12:44 <zodbot> Current chairs: cwickert lbazan masta sesivany tuanta yn1v
16:12:44 <cwickert> sorry, wrong link
16:13:01 <cwickert> https://fedorahosted.org/famsco/ticket/366
16:13:01 <tuanta> cwickert, sesivany started the meeting
16:13:04 <cwickert> .fas 366
16:13:05 <zodbot> cwickert: cartea1 'Paul Carter' <user136689@aol.com> - farsaak 'akram daruki' <akram_d13662005@yahoo.com> - alihendavi 'ali hendavi' <ali136616@gmail.com> - ando3667650 'ando yang' <ando321@qq.com> - regiocty 'Jose Leonardo Moreno' <leopn36617@gmail.com> - jimmy3366 'j liam mcwhirter' <j.mcwhirter@fz-juelich.de> - abcc3666 'sunlei' <279815795@qq.com> - regiocontry 'Jose Leonardo Moreno' <pnleo36617@yahoo.com> - (2 more messages)
16:13:19 <cwickert> sorry, still too confused from work ;)
16:13:19 <tuanta> .famsco 366
16:13:19 <zodbot> https://fedorahosted.org/famsco/ticket/366
16:14:22 <cwickert> thanks for all the feedback
16:14:23 <tuanta> cwickert, nice to see some "366" people :)
16:15:34 <sesivany> my opinion that the steps are redundant, it makes us to use two tracs instead of using just one etc. But as it's proposed it's not something like a no-go for me.
16:16:07 <cwickert> sesivany: hold on
16:16:47 <yn1v> I think that it is unlikely that some one vote against a collaborator, so better have more positive votes
16:16:59 <cwickert> the first step you consider redundant is the fama mailing list, right?
16:17:00 <robyduck> yn1v: +1
16:18:00 <lbazan> cwickert: +1
16:18:04 <lbazan> yn1v: +1
16:18:05 <sesivany> cwickert: for me, it should be a proposing ticket by a mentor and voting either by mentors or famsco, that's it.
16:18:37 <cwickert> tuanta: are mentors actively monitoring the tickets from fama trac?
16:19:03 <tuanta> cwickert, I don't think so
16:19:04 <masta> what if mentors are inactive, and famsco want to create new mentors? as long as famsco can do it without mentors, I'm good, otherwise let mentors self-govern
16:19:13 <tuanta> it'sbest to ask them on the mailing list
16:19:14 <robyduck> cwickert: AFAIK not
16:19:18 <cwickert> sesivany: how do you make sure mentors are actually aware of the new nomination in trac? I doubt they monitor the tickets
16:19:52 <robyduck> the best is the fama-mentors ML, all mentors get notified
16:19:56 <cwickert> sesivany: see, both tuanta and robyduck confirmed my concern. so lets announce it and tell them to cast their votes in trac within one week
16:21:32 <robyduck> sesivany: I like the double step, FAmSCo just approve a new mentor, unless there are too many concerns
16:21:45 <sesivany> cwickert: as I said, I don't really have a strong opinion about it, I just personally think it's unnecessary. There should be some reasoning in the ticket, something that the proposing mentor needed to do before proposing someone (discussion in the region, with other relevant mentors,...), then the whole point of voting is unnecessary.
16:22:10 <cwickert> sesivany: I agree on the reasoning etc
16:22:22 <sesivany> or if the mentors should be self-governed, let them vote and appoint, no need for famsco to step in.
16:22:37 <cwickert> however I don't want to make this mandatory, I think it's common sense
16:22:50 <robyduck> sesivany: what you're saying is the actual process, right? Proposal by a mentor and FAmSCo approving
16:22:57 <cwickert> sesivany: famsco just needs to confirm, that's the current policy
16:23:11 <cwickert> it has always been this way but I think we never rejected somebody
16:23:18 <cwickert> at least I don't remember
16:23:56 <sesivany> I understand the voting as a safety catch and one is enough for me because we havent had a problem so far.
16:24:20 <tuanta> that step should be mandatory, at least, for FAmSCo, to concentrate on that new mentor
16:24:35 <sesivany> but we can ask the mentors directly if they really want to have an explicit say in approving mentors.
16:24:51 * cwickert cannot really follow now
16:24:55 <tuanta> and in most cases, FAmSCo has no reason to reject
16:25:37 <sesivany> did we send the proposal to the fama mailing list?
16:25:48 <robyduck> sesivany: no
16:25:50 <sesivany> to get feedback from mentors themselves?
16:26:04 <sesivany> robyduck: ok, I think we should include them in the discussion.
16:26:10 <robyduck> +1
16:26:14 <tuanta> after this step, I think
16:26:23 <yn1v> We are talking about this because nobody checked leonardo was an ambassador before a pointing him as mentor, so this should be one step
16:26:59 <robyduck> yes, I think we should at least partially agree on cwickerts proposal and ask mentors if they would be ok with that change of the actual policy
16:27:06 <yn1v> at some point, mentors or famsco has to check this
16:27:46 <yn1v> I agree with robyduck we shoul involve mentor on any change to the policy
16:27:46 <sesivany> yn1v: yes, but do we have an admin/chair among mentors who would organize the voting, make sure the proposed person fullfills all requirements? I think it's better handled by famsco, we at least have some structure and regular meetings.
16:27:52 <robyduck> yn1v: I think we will always check this from now on :)
16:28:06 <sesivany> people would just vote in the ticket and wouldn't care much more.
16:29:02 <yn1v> we should write down the need for checking so when we move on, new members have it as a reminder
16:29:29 <cwickert> ok, I think we really need to discuss this with the mentors first
16:29:38 <sesivany> yn1v: sure
16:29:42 <cwickert> actually I think they should come up with a suggestion
16:30:04 <sesivany> yes, sharing it with mentors looks like an obvious next step.
16:30:13 <cwickert> robyduck: can you please take this over? you are a mentor, I am not
16:30:24 <robyduck> cwickert: yes sure
16:30:39 <cwickert> tell them we are looking into this, tell them about our proposal and ask them for their's
16:30:50 <cwickert> I don't want to overdesign this
16:30:50 <sesivany> #action sesivany to send the ticket with the discussion to fama mailing list.
16:30:57 <masta> +1 involving the mentors on proposed changes.
16:31:00 <cwickert> sesivany: are you mentor?
16:31:06 <sesivany> cwickert: yep
16:31:09 <yn1v> I am not sure for other regions but for latam the proccess has been that people from region ask on regional meeting, this is sent to famsco, famsco ask mentor and then decide
16:31:10 <cwickert> ah, I see
16:31:54 <cwickert> yn1v: it should always be the mentors first, we trust them and just confirm their decision
16:32:07 <cwickert> so let's keep this simple please
16:32:36 <sesivany> yn1v: yeah, for me it's more natural when it comes from the regional community because they know their needs the best, but it's been the mentor-only way for the whole time and it works.
16:32:39 <robyduck> ok then it's your's sesivany ;)
16:33:28 <sesivany> ok, anything else to this topic?
16:33:31 * robyduck also likes it more that the staring point is the mentor
16:33:36 <robyduck> no
16:33:48 <sesivany> you can always add your opinions to the ticket.
16:34:06 <tuanta> cwickert, should you mark an "action" to robyduck?
16:34:14 <yn1v> I see that we are not changing much the process, just documenting it so we can have history of requests and decisions
16:34:27 <tuanta> ah, sorry, sesivany took that
16:34:29 <cwickert> tuanta: sesivany already said he would do it
16:34:29 <robyduck> tuanta: sesivany took it over
16:34:36 <sesivany> irc meeting is too fast to put your ideas in a clear way imo, trac is better for this.
16:34:53 <cwickert> yn1v: exactly, lets document it, not create more paperwork
16:34:55 <sesivany> tuanta: you can do it if you want.
16:35:10 <sesivany> the less I do the better because I'm getting busy with Flock as hell.
16:35:11 <cwickert> I think we should stop here and ask the mentors first
16:35:18 <tuanta> sesivany, yes, I can take it
16:35:29 <sesivany> #undo
16:35:29 <zodbot> Removing item from minutes: ACTION by sesivany at 16:30:50 : sesivany to send the ticket with the discussion to fama mailing list.
16:35:40 <sesivany> #action tuanta to send the ticket with the discussion to fama mailing list.
16:35:59 <tuanta> ok, we will be back to this topic later
16:36:28 <sesivany> ok, I think we've got some time to discuss updates about fudcons...
16:36:35 <sesivany> #topic FUDCons
16:36:44 <sesivany> yn1v: any updates with the LATAM one?
16:37:23 <yn1v> We have made a call for papers, this will help make a proposal of candidates
16:37:49 <yn1v> with that proposal we will make a more accurate budget that we will present to ruth
16:37:54 <sesivany> yn1v: venue is assured?
16:38:08 <yn1v> she agreed to look to this budget to try to allocate more funds
16:38:29 <yn1v> Yes venue is secured
16:39:25 <sesivany> ok, it seems to be on track.
16:39:58 <sesivany> yn1v: if there are any issues famsco can help with just bring it up at future meetings.
16:40:01 <yn1v> we need to make another call for more people to fill talks/workshops
16:40:24 <yn1v> so we can have a more options for choosing topics
16:40:50 <yn1v> actually there one thing that will be helpful
16:41:02 <yn1v> we want to make a productive event
16:41:14 <sesivany> yn1v: do you want to aim it more on contributors or at local enthusiasts?
16:41:33 <yn1v> having a whish list of things needed to be done for the project, we can try to focus on those
16:42:05 <yn1v> we want to get people to do things and therefore having a try to be collaborators
16:42:54 <yn1v> we have two computer labs and two rooms for hacking. we can allocate more room for hacking easily
16:43:06 <masta> Pardon my interruption, but when/where is latam fudcon?
16:43:20 <lbazan> masta: october
16:43:25 <sesivany> masta: Managua, Nicaragua
16:43:27 <yn1v> October 23th to 25th
16:44:40 <sesivany> masta: Nicaragua is a really nice country, I recommend it ;)
16:44:52 <cwickert> +1 :)
16:45:40 <tuanta> +1000 :)
16:45:49 <yn1v> Hope people enjoy their stay besides the event
16:45:51 <sesivany> yn1v: anyway, you should definitely prepare some entry-level tasks for attendees.
16:46:07 <sesivany> yn1v: not everyone can jump into hacking right away :)
16:46:29 <masta> I'd like to see if I could perhaps attend, since I'm unfortunately not going to make flock.
16:46:38 <yn1v> the catch has been that somebody start a list of entry level stuff and in the process see that are easy task and resolve those
16:48:14 <sesivany> tuanta: what about fudcon apac?
16:48:43 <yn1v> we are making some workshops for teaching basic skills for collaborating ... most people learn to program but do not learn other stuff like git
16:48:44 <tuanta> we have not kick-off for the next year yet
16:49:29 <sesivany> tuanta: I think it's about time to start.
16:49:38 <yn1v> in any case, if any have ideas to things to be done during fudcon, please do send me an email
16:49:50 <tuanta> yes, I will note this
16:50:30 <sesivany> tuanta: the local organizers need at least half a year to prepare.
16:50:55 <sesivany> the Beijing guys told me they organized such a great events mostly because they worked on it for two years.
16:51:10 <tuanta> ok, I see
16:51:26 <masta> I heard the Beijing event was a smashing success
16:51:46 <tuanta> I will bring this to the next APAC meeting
16:52:05 <tuanta> yes, masta. sesivany also attended
16:52:12 <sesivany> masta: it was co-located with GNOME.Asia so it attracted a lot of interesting ppl.
16:52:27 * cwickert needs to leave now
16:52:58 <tuanta> sesivany, that's a good idea
16:53:06 <sesivany> #action tuanta to bring up FUDCon 2015 at the next regional meeting.
16:53:08 <tuanta> we may retry it next year
16:54:08 <sesivany> tuanta: I think they're considering Indonesia as a host of the next GNOME.Asia.
16:55:03 <tuanta> we have not a strong team there
16:55:16 <tuanta> s/not/not got
16:55:42 <tuanta> I will see. They may bid
16:56:06 <sesivany> tuanta: it's Bali in particular.
16:56:17 <sesivany> #link http://www.slideee.com/slide/indonesia-potential-host-for-gnome-asia-summit-2015
16:56:35 <tuanta> thanks for that info, sesivany
16:57:19 <sesivany> ok, I think we're done for today.
16:57:23 <sesivany> any other topic?
16:57:26 <masta> yes
16:57:38 <tuanta> cwickert, before you go: lets watch the semi-final match German-Brazil together :)
16:57:39 <masta> happy birthday Tuan
16:57:47 <tuanta> thanks masta :)
16:57:56 <tuanta> et all
16:57:56 <sesivany> masta: ah good point
16:58:07 <sesivany> tuanta: happy birthday!
16:58:19 <tuanta> thanks :)
16:58:19 <sesivany> have a good one
16:58:26 <robyduck> tuanta: happy birthday :)
16:58:29 <cwickert> tuanta: good idea :)
16:58:32 <cwickert> ohh
16:58:37 <tuanta> thanks :)
16:58:41 <cwickert> and happy birthday of course!
16:58:51 <tuanta> actually, it's almost the end of my birthday here :)
16:58:57 <tuanta> just two minutes :)
16:59:04 <tuanta> thank you all :)
16:59:28 <sesivany> thank you for attending and meet you next week!
16:59:31 <masta> ok bye bye all
16:59:34 <sesivany> #endmeeting