17:05:24 <aeperezt> #startmeeting
17:05:24 <zodbot> Meeting started Mon Sep  3 17:05:24 2012 UTC.  The chair is aeperezt. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
17:05:24 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
17:05:39 <aeperezt> #chair danielbruno bckurera sesivany
17:05:39 <zodbot> Current chairs: aeperezt bckurera danielbruno sesivany
17:06:04 <aeperezt> #topic announcements
17:06:33 <aeperezt> Any new anouncement
17:06:46 <aeperezt> sorry if I spell something wrong
17:06:49 <sesivany> nothing from me
17:06:59 <aeperezt> sesivany, can help me on that
17:07:29 <sesivany> aeperezt: btw have you decided who is going to be a treasurer for LATAM?
17:07:31 <bckurera> Rather announcement I m in the process of establishing budget guidelines in APAC
17:07:48 <aeperezt> sesivany, I will
17:07:54 <bckurera> hope you all saw the mails, I have copied to FAmSCo list as well
17:08:06 <sesivany> aeperezt: that's maybe worth announcing
17:08:18 <aeperezt> so that will be my announcement
17:08:27 <bckurera> treasurer = budget wrangler in APAC :)
17:08:30 * herlo apologizes for being late
17:08:33 <aeperezt> I will take be treasure for latam
17:08:43 * bckurera welcome herlo
17:08:50 <aeperezt> welcome herlo
17:08:50 <herlo> tx
17:09:15 <sesivany> #info aeperezt will be a treasurer (how handles the regional budget) for LATAM
17:09:17 <aeperezt> sesivany, any other issue
17:10:05 <bckurera> no I suppose
17:10:05 <sesivany> aeperezt: last time we didn't have enough time to discuss the last ticket...
17:10:12 <sesivany> #281
17:10:25 <sesivany> but that's another topic I guess
17:10:31 <aeperezt> #topic ticket #281
17:10:34 <herlo> .famsco 281
17:10:37 <zodbot> https://fedorahosted.org/famsco/ticket/281
17:10:45 * herlo misses zodbot :(
17:11:37 <sesivany> is rbergeron with us?
17:11:55 * herlo hides from this ticket
17:11:58 <aeperezt> sesivany, can you lead this matter
17:12:13 <sesivany> aeperezt: ok
17:12:38 <sesivany> #topic Ticket #281
17:13:11 <sesivany> the only update is that PO at Red Hat is $2000, not $5000.
17:13:49 <bckurera> at the meantime for APAC, limits set below what is mentioned on the ticket
17:14:16 <sesivany> and I think if there are treasurers in every region I think they should be the ones who do peer review since they have the best overview of the budget.
17:15:35 <sesivany> bckurera: can you point me to that?
17:15:36 <herlo> sesivany: this 'treasurer' idea isn't bad :)
17:15:46 <bckurera> yes sure
17:15:50 <sesivany> bckurera: I can't find it
17:16:05 <sesivany> bckurera: I'm probably blind after a long day at work
17:16:42 <bckurera> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Ambassadors/APAC/Reimbursement
17:16:55 <bckurera> sesivany no problem :)
17:16:59 <sesivany> herlo: yeah, because the limit is quite high ($500) and I think only people who have good knowledge of the budget situation can promise money.
17:18:11 <sesivany> herlo: btw who's going to be a treasurer in NA?
17:18:20 <aeperezt> sesivany, are budgets establish for every region yeat?
17:18:21 <herlo> sesivany: so, I think it varies from region to region. This is good since we already have people in each region with a way to reimburse/pay for things, even if it's difficult. If that 'treasurer' or committee of treasurers approves something, it could easily be documented...
17:19:07 <herlo> and the individual who does the work can get their money/services taken care of without FAmSCo intervention, most of the time.
17:19:53 <sesivany> aeperezt: AFAIK every region should start budget planning, to draw all expenses they expect to have in the next quarter.
17:19:57 <herlo> sesivany: I would guess it would be inode0, but we'd have to ask him. In general though, NA does things by committee at their weekly FAmNA meetings. And rules have basically been in place for a long time here.
17:20:21 <aeperezt> sesivany, ok so that is what latam stated on the fudcon
17:21:02 <sesivany> aeperezt: based on this, the region will be given a budget. But at the beginning it will be kinda semi-solution. But we have to start it somehow.
17:21:35 <aeperezt> sesivany, we need start point so it is great
17:22:11 <sesivany> herlo: it pretty much depends on you how you want to handle the budget. other regions decided to have one person who will be responsible for that.
17:22:42 <sesivany> herlo: and will closely work with suehle who will do the accounting.
17:23:01 <herlo> sesivany: this alreadyhappens in NA
17:23:04 * bckurera likes test runs :)
17:23:06 <herlo> that's my point
17:23:41 <aeperezt> herlo, that is good but we need to set it to work on other regions
17:23:48 <herlo> aeperezt: indeed
17:23:55 * herlo wasn't suggesting otherwise
17:24:08 <sesivany> aeperezt: what I'm going to do in EMEA and bckurera already started in LATAM is to setup regional guidelines for budget request and to start drawing a budget for this and the next quarter.
17:24:56 <herlo> aeperezt: I just didnt' want to give the impression that the draft I drew up is right for every region. I like where this treasurer idea is going as long as each region can handle their budget and properly hanndle reimbursements
17:25:05 <sesivany> aeperezt: we should be able to tell rbergeron and suehle how much we are going to spend (+/-).
17:25:16 <herlo> sesivany: +!
17:25:20 <herlo> er +1
17:25:31 <aeperezt> sesivany, right
17:26:04 <sesivany> let's make it an action item
17:26:05 <bckurera> yup that is a good way to start
17:26:26 <herlo> a budget from every region is great! We could also provide a review as more of a part of the process to help clarify things if the regions wish to do so.
17:26:42 <herlo> we == FAmSCo
17:27:05 <sesivany> #action all regions will figure out how to deal with budget requests in the regions and make a regional budgets for this quarter.
17:28:01 <aeperezt> sesivany, in latam we had agree to use the latam trac
17:28:25 <bckurera> aeperezt sounds like an #info
17:28:29 <sesivany> responsible for this are me in EMEA, bckurera in APAC, aeperezt in LATAM and NA will decide who's gonna be.
17:29:28 <aeperezt> #info latam will use latam trac to manage budget request
17:30:11 <sesivany> ok, let's refocus on #281, because this needs to be approved finally
17:30:48 <sesivany> sesivany: I have a few proposals...
17:31:30 <aeperezt> good
17:31:47 <sesivany> first I'd add a regional treasurer for peer review or maybe make him the only person. But this maybe be decided by the region. Let's give them more options.
17:32:35 <sesivany> any thoughts on this?
17:33:07 <herlo> sesivany: I think the treasurer could be more than one person.
17:33:28 <herlo> It's not that it *has* to be, but I can see situations where having a small committee of 3-5 people would be useful.
17:33:29 <bckurera> regions will decide :)
17:33:38 <sesivany> herlo: I have no problem with that
17:33:47 <herlo> bckurera: yes
17:34:49 <herlo> sesivany: what are other options you are suggesting?
17:35:46 <sesivany> herlo: there are also FAmSCo members and credit card holders. The question is if we should include them in peer review or not.
17:37:27 <sesivany> but we can just let regions decide and give them these three option: peer reviewers will be either FAmSCo members, or credit card holders, or treasurers, or subset of them.
17:37:48 * herlo doesn't personally want to do that one. We have enough to work on as it is...plus it seems to me we already have CC holders in each region.
17:38:43 <herlo> sesivany: yes, I think having a FAmSCo member as part of the treasury is a good idea, but it should indeed be up to the regions on how to implement
17:39:37 <sesivany> ok, all treasurers are FAmSCo members anyway now. That pretty much solves the problem for now :)
17:39:48 <herlo> we've been on this issue 25+ minutes
17:39:51 <sesivany> let's leave it as it is then
17:40:01 <herlo> just as a note
17:40:06 <herlo> sesivany: +1
17:40:14 <aeperezt> +1
17:40:28 <sesivany> last thing to this ticket...
17:41:37 <sesivany> the PO is $2000, so all requests over $2000 have to get approved by FAmSCo and get a PO in Red Hat. It's a formality, but we have to implement it in it.
17:42:26 <bckurera> add it as an #info please, so it is more clear
17:43:03 <herlo> sesivany: k, that must be new. We've always done $5k, but if RH is making us do $2k now, that is fine.
17:43:22 <sesivany> #info all budget requests over $2000 need to be approved by FAmSCo and get a PO in Red Hat.
17:43:54 <herlo> sesivany: one caveat to that is that we should not need to approve items that are essentially the same as the previous year/quarter/etc
17:44:00 <sesivany> herlo: it is, but I know it's $2000 since I work in Red Hat, and rbergeron confirmed it last time. There was a change.
17:44:34 <herlo> as a simple example, media duplication. It still needs a RH PO, but there is no necessity to put another step in place to get that done.
17:45:46 <sesivany> herlo: if the original request was done as repetitive one, why not? But we have to let FAmSCo know that this expense is going to repeat every Fedora cycle.
17:46:03 <herlo> that is fine with me.
17:47:06 <sesivany> do we have to vote about this?
17:47:30 <aeperezt> don't think so
17:47:36 <herlo> I can just see a few of these every year. T-shirts, stickers, media, possibly other large expenses. Events are probably one place where $2k can hit quickly, but a single contributor really shouldn't hit that for a specific event. I like this so it keeps things out of the way and let's the contributors get things done.
17:48:23 <bckurera> herlo +1
17:48:30 <sesivany> +1
17:48:37 <aeperezt> +1
17:50:41 <sesivany> #agreed Repetitive expense requests need to get approval just once if the amount is about the same.
17:51:39 <sesivany> ready to vote about the ticket as whole?
17:52:09 <herlo> +1
17:53:10 <aeperezt> +1
17:53:20 <sesivany> +1
17:54:11 <sesivany> we need one more to reach to quorum :-)
17:54:26 <bckurera> +1
17:54:28 <bckurera> :)
17:54:35 <sesivany> ok
17:55:26 <sesivany> #agreed The ticket #281 is approved with additional adjustments FAmSCo agreed on today.
17:55:47 <sesivany> do we have anything else to discuss?
17:55:59 <aeperezt> don't think so
17:57:52 <sesivany> herlo: can you please make the final version of budget review guidelines that includes all additional points we've agreed on today?
17:58:06 <bckurera> that is good
17:58:35 <bckurera> any region is free to select limits as mentioned or limits below that
17:59:14 <sesivany> bckurera: +1
18:00:55 <sesivany> is anyone willing to end the meeting and send out emails to mailing lists? I'm afraid I'll have to leave very soon.
18:01:08 <aeperezt> ok
18:01:16 <aeperezt> I started let me end it
18:01:30 <aeperezt> #endmeeting