14:30:45 <ianweller> #startmeeting hyperkitty -- stream: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/ea06a88e2695092c059dc9d0ef33629557e24f00
14:30:45 <zodbot> Meeting started Fri Aug  9 14:30:45 2013 UTC.  The chair is ianweller. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
14:30:45 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
14:30:58 <ianweller> mailman 2.1 is a maintenance branch, one release a year since 2006, very monolithic
14:31:07 <ianweller> mailing list engine, pipermail, web admin interface
14:31:32 <ianweller> pipermail generates static HTML
14:31:38 <ianweller> not directly searchable, no summary pages, etc etc
14:32:10 <ianweller> mailman 3 is a modern/modular design
14:32:14 <ianweller> mailman itself is just mailing-lists and rest API
14:32:18 <ianweller> postorious is a web admin UI
14:32:21 <ianweller> and hyperkitty is the web archiver.
14:32:29 <ianweller> queues, runners, other stuff is happening as separate modules.
14:32:46 <ianweller> we're doing hyperkitty.
14:33:01 <ianweller> key improvements:
14:33:04 <ianweller> * no more happy mailman day :)
14:33:08 <ianweller> * no storing plain-text passwords
14:33:29 <ianweller> when is it going to be out? RSN.
14:33:37 <ianweller> "RSN" -- september 2012
14:33:52 <ianweller> it's late for reasons that are partially valid, possibly related to postorious
14:34:02 <ianweller> mailman 3 itself works but it has to be administrated from the command line.
14:34:25 <ianweller> hyperkitty is the archiver plugin for mailman 3.
14:34:36 <ianweller> two components
14:34:38 <ianweller> KittyStore is the storage engine
14:34:45 <ianweller> SQL database (storm ORM), and does analysis and statistics
14:34:53 * stickster notes, 6 people here aside from volunteer/speaker
14:35:01 <ianweller> can be improved
14:35:08 <ianweller> hyperkitty itself is a web UI (django / python)
14:35:19 <ianweller> interfaces with kittystore and implements the ModernArchiving spec on list.org
14:35:24 <ianweller> implements some of mizmo's mockups
14:35:37 <ianweller> it is not dependent on the order emails are received (like it is today)
14:36:00 <ianweller> #topic what happened since FUDCon Lawrence (February)
14:36:12 <ianweller> PyCon US happened, a few pull requests merged
14:36:22 <ianweller> GSoC: mailman is part of GSoC and a couple of projects are going on
14:36:35 <ianweller> not much other activity, its admin UI (postorious) still needs work
14:37:05 <ianweller> new features:
14:37:15 <ianweller> * can post from the web instead of from email only
14:37:19 <ianweller> like you can do in a forum
14:37:21 <ianweller> each post has a reply link
14:37:24 <ianweller> can create new threads
14:37:38 <ianweller> plain text only (no HTML/markdown/etc) but attachments are available
14:37:55 <ianweller> wow that's not visible on the camera
14:38:21 <ianweller> took a photo on my phone, will upload
14:38:37 <ianweller> you can like/dislike posts, which will change the ranking of the submitter
14:38:50 <ianweller> tracks what threads you have read/not read
14:39:16 <ianweller> top image: one thread read already, one you haven't
14:39:25 <ianweller> lower image: most active discussions, read/not read flags
14:39:54 <ianweller> http://imgur.com/gHzcX7T <-- first image
14:40:09 <ianweller> posts can have categories
14:41:08 <ianweller> hyperkitty has its own REST API for categories and whatnot
14:41:22 <ianweller> [presuming you can get mail clients to do things with it]
14:41:38 <ianweller> recent features:
14:41:47 <ianweller> plain-text search engine (uses the whoosh library)
14:41:51 <ianweller> can search across mailing lists
14:43:03 <ianweller> * reattach a broken thread (some clients break the In-Reply-To header)
14:43:13 <ianweller> have to be a member of the staff group, but
14:43:40 <ianweller> can even paste in a thread ID if you have it already.
14:43:55 <ianweller> * more dynamic UI, better user profile page, etc
14:44:11 <ianweller> * sysadmin stuff: RPMs, and running on server in fedora cloud
14:44:27 <ianweller> lists.dev, ask abompard
14:44:47 <ianweller> user profiles and whatnot
14:45:27 <ianweller> question: is name and whatnot extracted from mailman?
14:45:33 <ianweller> answer: don't actually know :)
14:45:42 <ianweller> mailman actually has a first-class concept of a user (with multiple email addresses!)
14:45:57 <ianweller> #topic where are we going now
14:46:06 <ianweller> mizmo has made more mockups
14:46:09 <ianweller> user profiles, moderation information
14:46:26 <ianweller> list directory
14:46:35 <ianweller> categories / tags on lists, per-list health overview
14:46:44 <ianweller> http://blog.linuxgrrl.com/2013/07/26/hyperkitty-ui-overview-and-list-directory-ideas/
14:46:57 <ianweller> now on presentation: http://blog.linuxgrrl.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/list-overview.png
14:47:13 <ianweller> #topic how you can help
14:47:24 <ianweller> we would like additional help with UI and design
14:47:29 <ianweller> django experience is certainly wanted
14:47:37 <ianweller> esp. with optimization
14:47:50 <ianweller> KittyStore needs help with statistical analysis and troll detection
14:48:31 <ianweller> per-user ignore lists
14:48:52 <ianweller> and if you're frustrated with mailing lists as they are today, every idea counts
14:49:04 <ianweller> development version is at http://mm3test.fedoraproject.org/
14:49:16 <ianweller> fedorahosted.org/hyperkitty, github.com/hyperkitty, hyperkitty.rtfd.org
14:49:20 <stickster> Very interesting point: Backend KittyStore would know how many people have PersonA on their ignore lists. Might be useful to report that to project leadership
14:51:36 <ianweller> (discussion now happening about how easy it is to install mailman3)
14:52:12 <ianweller> (discussion now happening about design feedback)
14:52:33 <ianweller> most design work is offloaded to mizmo but if you have ideas please tell abompard
14:52:51 <ianweller> OH: when the standard you are being compared to is the mailman 2 web "UI" there's nowhere to go but up
14:54:23 <ianweller> (also i just noticed that the streaming computer here says "off air" which scares me. is anybody trying to watch)
14:55:00 <ianweller> hackfest this afternoon in ECTR 103
14:55:08 <ianweller> on hyperkitty
14:55:14 <ianweller> #topic summary / end of talk
14:55:28 <ianweller> hyperkitty is really the only mail archiver for mailman 3
14:55:40 <ianweller> helps to bridge the gap between mailing lists and web forums
14:55:59 <ianweller> #topic LIVE DEMO
15:02:35 <ianweller> #chair flock-ectr103
15:02:35 <zodbot> Current chairs: flock-ectr103 ianweller
15:02:43 <flock-ectr103> #meetingtopic hyperkitty -- stream: http://youtu.be/Ut_m5W0Of8M
15:08:53 <ianweller> [question] i like the monthly mbox archives can we have that
15:08:56 <ianweller> [answer] i will look into it
15:14:11 <ianweller> #endmeeting