15:58:48 #startmeeting F21-blocker-review 15:58:48 Meeting started Fri Oct 3 15:58:48 2014 UTC. The chair is roshi. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 15:58:48 Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic. 15:58:48 #meetingname F21-blocker-review 15:58:48 The meeting name has been set to 'f21-blocker-review' 15:58:49 #topic Roll Call 15:58:59 so who's around? 15:59:10 ahoy 15:59:14 gettin' started early, huh 15:59:23 1600 UTC, right? 15:59:28 * mattdm is 20% here 15:59:52 * kparal is here 15:59:56 * roshi is here 16:00:04 ahoy kparal :) 16:00:24 I can be here if we're under capacity, but I have other stuff I should be doing. 16:00:31 we won't have pschindl today 16:00:34 * adamw wonders what 20% of a mattdm fetches on the open market 16:00:41 psh, blocker review is the only thing to do sgallagh ! 16:01:16 if we market it as fresh choice cut FPL, it might do pretty good adamw 16:01:29 mattdm: this is your best 20% we have though, right? 16:01:30 adamw: I got a tank of petrol and a cup of coffee for one of his kidneys. That's gotta be, what 5% of him? 16:01:34 * mattdm is not sure he likes where this is going 16:01:46 mattdm: just lie back and think of beefy 16:02:05 lol ewwwww 16:02:28 alright, well we have people so let's get started with the goodness (the blockers) 16:02:40 (just to let mattdm have a little peice of mind) 16:02:51 13 to go through 16:02:52 #topic (1147998) Cloud image does not permit successful reboot 16:02:52 #link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1147998 16:02:52 #info Proposed Blocker, cloud-utils, NEW 16:03:06 Title sounds fairly obvious... 16:03:19 I thought we did this one already 16:03:21 +1 16:03:33 i may have whiffed on secretarializing it, sorry 16:03:34 +1 16:03:42 unless we want to market them as "Ultra Disposable" images 16:03:48 no worries 16:03:59 +1 16:04:05 "They're free, but one time use only." 16:04:55 * sgallagh represses a series of terrible responses to that. 16:04:55 it's for security! 16:05:09 proposed #agreed - 1147998 - AcceptedBlocker - This bug is a clear violation of the Beta Shutdown, Reboot, Logout criteria. 16:05:40 #chair kparal mattdm adamw sgallagh 16:05:40 Current chairs: adamw kparal mattdm roshi sgallagh 16:05:57 * kparal notes we might need a secretary duty volunteer 16:06:08 i'll do it 16:06:14 (like i did it greaty last time) 16:06:14 thanks adamw 16:06:28 oh we're having a meeting? 16:06:31 * pwhalen is here-ish 16:06:42 #chair danofsatx-dt pwhalen 16:06:42 Current chairs: adamw danofsatx-dt kparal mattdm pwhalen roshi sgallagh 16:06:47 yeah, to get caught up 16:06:55 13 blockers left over from the last meeting 16:07:17 ack/nack/patch? 16:07:40 Ack 16:08:08 ack 16:08:11 #agreed - 1147998 - AcceptedBlocker - This bug is a clear violation of the Beta Shutdown, Reboot, Logout criteria. 16:08:18 #topic (1142512) 21 Beta TC1 KDE 32-bit live over size limit 16:08:19 #link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1142512 16:08:19 #info Proposed Blocker, distribution, NEW 16:09:14 ah, so we were punting on this till next week 16:09:22 but since we're meeting today, it comes up 16:09:24 any news on if this was decided at the last meeting? 16:09:35 you all wanted to punt it 16:09:49 oh, you mean last KDE meeting? 16:09:52 yeah 16:09:55 dunno 16:10:01 that was yesterday, right danofsatx-dt? 16:10:03 * satellit joining late 16:10:04 lemme try and grab a KDEian 16:10:06 hi satellit 16:10:19 o/ satellit 16:10:24 I think so 16:10:36 they increased the desired size limit? 16:11:47 adamw: We'll be bumping the limit at the Tuesday meeting most likely. 16:12:01 nvm, from their wiki the meetins are on tuesday 16:12:05 we can move on then 16:12:37 #topic (1038413) fedup stage2 keymap will always be US again for F20-F21 due to anaconda not writing vconsole.keymap kernel parameter any more (#1035316) 16:12:40 #link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1038413 16:12:43 #info Proposed Blocker, fedup, NEW 16:13:08 I thought we talked about this one too... or was there a similar one? 16:13:24 weren't we on it right at the end? 16:13:28 i'm not sure if we came to a decision or not 16:13:31 * adamw checks 16:14:19 you never actually did an agreed for it 16:14:22 proposed agreed, but no agreed 16:14:25 ah 16:14:33 we were up to proposed #agreed - 1038413 - AcceptedBlocker - This bug partially violates the Beta "Upgrade requirements" criteria. 16:14:52 anybody have votes other than +1? 16:14:54 i thought it might be worth checking that it's really broken 'as expected', but hard to do that till fedup is fixed 16:14:58 or can we move to acks? 16:15:11 true 16:15:17 as it is though, seems a blocker to me 16:16:09 fwiw, I'm an ack 16:16:40 i can ack it, can always withdraw it if it turns out not to be busted 16:16:47 ack 16:16:48 wrm 16:16:52 ackityack 16:17:20 #agreed - 1038413 - AcceptedBlocker - This bug partially violates the Beta "Upgrade requirements" criteria. 16:17:28 don't talk back 16:17:41 * roshi will now have that song stuck in his head 16:18:01 #topic (1145952) right click on the background locks mouse clicks 16:18:01 #link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1145952 16:18:01 #info Proposed Blocker, gnome-shell, NEW 16:18:12 I couldn't reproduce this one 16:21:07 * adamw reads 16:21:32 * pwhalen trying on arm 16:21:33 I don't understand whether mouse clicks are not registered only on the wallpaper, or everywhere 16:21:51 in the first case, I think this is not serious enough to block Beta 16:21:51 aiui, click the wallpaper, then can't click anything 16:21:55 * danofsatx-dt couldn't reproduce either 16:21:57 hm, i just reproduced it 16:22:01 but for different reasons ;) 16:22:09 exactly as described 16:22:12 adamw: mouse clicks completely stop working, everywhere? 16:22:14 not sure it blocks beta, esp. with the workaround 16:22:23 I don't think it's blocker material, workaround is easy 16:22:24 kparal: well i didn't check every pixel, but i can't click into xchat or firefox 16:22:25 I can reproduce this trivially 16:22:32 sgallagh: do you have dual displays? 16:22:33 that's bad 16:22:38 adamw: yes 16:22:58 huh, i was testing on second workspace (because background isn't visible on workspace #1) 16:22:59 I have dual displays, but only one on at a time 16:23:10 when i ctrl-alt-up'ed back to the main workspace i saw the right-click menu 16:23:31 roshi: Same situation 16:23:54 standing desk? (I have one up high and one at the sitting part) 16:24:05 roshi: No, side-by-side displays 16:24:14 there's something kind of wonky about the whole thing, but not sure it's blocker worthy. 16:24:29 i'd been using GNOME happily for days without noticing till i saw this report... 16:24:36 haha 16:24:39 I've hit it a *lot* 16:24:58 I don't really see violated criterion 16:25:01 Because I have a mouse that occasionally *sticks* the right-click button too long, which also fires the context menu 16:25:05 sgallagh: so is it an annoyance or a crippling thing? 16:25:05 unless you can't update 16:25:26 I'd give it +1 FE instead 16:25:31 roshi: It's a constant annoyance to the point that I finally hacked my mouse driver to fix the stickiness because it was so bothersome 16:25:36 I'd be +1 FE 16:25:57 I really wish we had a criterion for "So annoying that a user is likely to give up"... :-P 16:25:58 sgallagh: just make sure your background is never visible. problem solved! 16:26:04 * adamw never understands why anyone ever sees their background 16:26:11 but we're not in freeze yet 16:26:12 i have two frickin' monitors and i never do 16:26:29 I never see mine, either 16:26:32 roshi: we can grant +1 FE to things we'd want fixed once we hit freeze 16:26:34 we can still give FE, since we discuss it now 16:26:36 except on boot and the lock screen 16:26:43 +1 FE, i can see it would annoy some people 16:26:49 i'll make sure the fix gets backported 16:27:28 +1 FE 16:27:51 proposed #agreed - 1145952 - RejectedBlocker AcceptedFreezeException - This bug doesn't violate any criteria but is really annoying for those affected. Accepted as a Freeze Exception if a fix doesn't land before freeze. 16:28:58 +1 fe (worked okay for me) 16:29:04 ack 16:29:44 we could argue for finalblocker if anyone wants to, but i expect it'll be resolved by then 16:29:56 for gnome users, I hope it is 16:30:12 ack 16:30:17 my mouse is annoying enough, I feel for them 16:30:23 #agreed - 1145952 - RejectedBlocker AcceptedFreezeException - This bug doesn't violate any criteria but is really annoying for those affected. Accepted as a Freeze Exception if a fix doesn't land before freeze. 16:30:37 #topic (1146126) Fedup upgrade to 21 doesn't put the "upgrade" entry in bootloader 16:30:41 #link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1146126 16:30:43 #info Proposed Blocker, grubby, NEW 16:32:40 I wonder why fedup doesn't save a backup copy of important config files 16:32:59 yeah, that's odd 16:33:05 * roshi would have thought it would have 16:34:02 I think we should get some confirmation before making this a blocker 16:34:05 I find this weird: 16:34:12 /boot/grub2/grub.cfg doesn't have the entry. 16:34:12 /etc/grub2.cfg has the entry. 16:34:21 has anyone else seen this bug? 16:34:22 maybe the user had broken configs before running fedup 16:34:25 i didn't 16:34:32 i hit the *other* fedup bug, but not this one 16:34:34 /etc/grub2.cfg should be a symlink to /boot 16:34:41 right 16:34:52 it sounds to me mostly like an odd grub config of some kind 16:35:01 punt? 16:35:32 -1 or punt 16:35:46 i count the number of people filing the *other* fedup bug as strong indirect confirmation this one isn't general 16:35:50 I haven't done anything with fedup, so can't really speak to it 16:35:51 I'd go -1 probably, and asked for more confirmation 16:35:58 abstaining 16:36:00 wfm 16:37:03 proposed #agreed - 1146126 - RejectedBlocker - This bug doesn't seem to be widespread enough to block on. However, if more incidents of it continue to crop up, please repropose. 16:37:50 ack 16:38:02 ack 16:38:10 #agreed - 1146126 - RejectedBlocker - This bug doesn't seem to be widespread enough to block on. However, if more incidents of it continue to crop up, please repropose. 16:38:22 #topic (1146232) f21 workstation ships 'default' network, so loses connectivity when run in a VM 16:38:25 #link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1146232 16:38:28 #info Proposed Blocker, libvirt, NEW 16:40:40 this is the reincarnation of the 'virt networking' bug 16:40:59 a patch went in which mitigated it in some cases and so the original bug was closed, but it did not solve things for live images, which is the most common case 16:41:09 yeah 16:41:11 (though it seems to have become less common again with recent f21 live images, not sure why) 16:41:37 lives work for me with no issues in libvirt... 16:42:05 why doesn't it happen always? 16:43:31 I still think it violates the criteria 16:43:40 for sure 16:43:54 if the frequency went down, maybe we can postpone till Final? 16:43:58 I ran into the old bug, did the fix and haven't had any issues since 16:44:13 just booted i386 Live Beta and had network from the start 16:45:03 kparal: race condition i believe 16:45:16 ah 16:45:26 kparal: it depends which of two services comes up first - libvirt and NM or something 16:45:32 i believe it depends which gets the default route 16:45:38 * satellit no problem with lives or installed lives in Virtualbox 16:45:41 that explains 16:46:04 satellit: this would not affect virtualbox, I don't believe. 16:46:46 so right now the frequency of this is low enough for me i might call it final blocker not beta blocker (we can generally allow for a bit more manual workaround-y stuff at beta), but i'm not sure if it might happen more often for others 16:46:56 always hard to be sure with races 16:48:33 I'm fine with pushing to final 16:49:27 +1 delay to final 16:49:28 it will lower the pressure on the developers, which might be both a good and bad thing :) 16:49:42 I'm fine either way 16:49:51 we did do a couple of final releases which contained the bug, i guess, so... 16:50:01 i guess i'll say +1 final -1 beta on current experience 16:50:04 I haven't seen it recently, but I have modified libvirt ip range on my laptop, might affect things 16:52:25 it would, you have to have host and guest use the same ip range to hit it. that's what the issue is - conflict in use of 192.168.122. range 16:52:40 proposed #agreed - 1146232 - AcceptedBlocker - This isn't widespread enough to block beta but if not resolved will be a blocker for Final. The workaround is well documented in the time being. 16:53:15 libvirt wants to claim it to configure it as the *host* end of the NAT setup for virt guests, but since the system itself is a virt guest, NM wants it to have an IP in that range and route its traffic out through the *host* via 192.168.122.1 . cue explosions. 16:53:41 ack 16:55:04 ack 16:55:33 #agreed - 1146232 - AcceptedBlocker - This isn't widespread enough to block beta but if not resolved will be a blocker for Final. The workaround is well documented in the time being. 16:55:44 #topic (1121409) Offline update failed 16:55:44 #link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1121409 16:55:45 #info Proposed Blocker, PackageKit, NEW 16:58:38 * kparal never heard about libhif 16:59:13 me either 16:59:27 some new bit of the dnf/yum/packagekit/whatever complex i think 17:00:11 I always do my updates with whatever 17:00:11 Giovanni is actually a gnome-shell developer, right? 17:00:29 I think we can rely on his bug report 17:00:59 yeah 17:01:05 so it seems like this is a case where it fails sometimes 17:01:08 if he's a gnome dev, yeah 17:01:22 I'm not sure how often it fails 17:01:40 it won't *always* fail 17:01:45 why don't people just do 'yum update' and be done with it 17:01:54 * roshi never uses teh GUI for that 17:02:08 theoretically, offline updates are better than that. 17:02:12 (not that i use 'em either, but hey.) 17:02:33 today I install Beta TC1 and Software was an empty transparent box that couldn't be closed. that's not related I suppose 17:02:39 no. 17:02:43 hey, people use it and we offer it, so I would say it should work ootb 17:02:47 it's in the criteria 17:02:52 for me it's a question of how likely it is to fail 17:03:08 same here 17:03:11 I don't know Giovanni's nick, but he doesn't seem to be online on #fedora-desktop 17:03:13 i'd include +1, but i think i'd like to punt one week to ask that question 17:03:25 * roshi is fine with punting 17:03:33 ok 17:03:42 s/include/incline/ 17:03:43 makes me wish I was back on the rugby pitch... 17:05:04 proposed #agreed - 1121409 - Punt - We'd like some more information on the frequency of this bug before we decide it's blocker status. 17:05:17 ack 17:06:53 ack 17:07:09 #agreed - 1121409 - Punt - We'd like some more information on the frequency of this bug before we decide it's blocker status. 17:07:24 #topic (1120964) Windows NTFS volume corrupted beyond repair during installation 17:07:27 #link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1120964 17:07:29 #info Proposed Blocker, python-blivet, ASSIGNED 17:08:25 Expected results: 17:08:26 Not this. 17:08:27 lol 17:09:23 hard to argue with! 17:09:46 this bug makes me question whether I really should have installed F21 to the students with existing windows partitions 17:09:59 but it seemed to work 17:10:07 I'm +1 - chris makes a good justification, IMO 17:10:10 clear +1 final 17:10:31 sorry, got called away for a bit 17:10:37 and i hate using the 'backstop' paragraph, but yeah, it's a good case for +1 beta 17:10:47 kparal: did you test booting windows after? :) 17:11:18 yeah we did 17:11:31 +1 beta 17:12:01 I wonder if this happens only if you shrink ntfs as much as possible? 17:12:35 proposed #agreed - 1120964 - AcceptedBlocker - This bug is a conditional violation of several criteria - due to it's being a Critical Path package and can destroy user data. 17:12:48 kparal: it was resized to 138GB, which seems pretty large for 'as much as possible' 17:12:52 ack 17:12:54 ack 17:12:58 hum 17:12:59 several criteria might not be *totally* accurate, but it works 17:13:01 patch 17:13:07 go for it 17:13:10 i'd prefer to accept cmurf's rationale of using the 'backup' justification 17:14:13 proposed #agreed - 1120964 - AcceptedBlocker - only clearly violates Final criteria, but clearly meets the alternative blocker definition, "A bug in a Critical Path package that: -Cannot be fixed with a future stable update, -Has a severity rating of high or greater and no reasonable workaround" 17:14:57 ack 17:14:58 proposed #agreed - 1120964 - AcceptedBlocker - This bug is a conditional violation of Beta 'backup' justification criteria. Critical path packages that have bugs which cannot be fixed with update and have a severity rating of at least high block the release. 17:15:02 ha 17:15:04 either way 17:15:05 ack to adamw 17:15:41 #agreed - 1120964 - AcceptedBlocker - only clearly violates Final criteria, but clearly meets the alternative blocker definition, "A bug in a Critical Path package that: -Cannot be fixed with a future stable update, -Has a severity rating of high or greater and no reasonable workaround" 17:16:02 #topic (1141398) anaconda does not see existing Fedora 21 install to LVM-on-RAID 17:16:05 #link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1141398 17:16:08 #info Proposed Blocker, python-blivet, ASSIGNED 17:18:41 +1 17:18:47 clearly violates the criteria 17:19:33 it seems so 17:20:24 i proposed it, but seems +1 to me. 17:20:33 proposed #agreed - 1141398 - AcceptedBlocker - This bug is a clear violation of the Beta custom partitioning criteria. 17:23:02 ack 17:25:44 ackj 17:26:30 #agreed - 1141398 - AcceptedBlocker - This bug is a clear violation of the Beta custom partitioning criteria. 17:26:48 #topic (1141700) Do not autoactivate swaps on machine running live images 17:26:51 #link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1141700 17:26:53 #info Proposed Blocker, spin-kickstarts, NEW 17:28:35 * kparal is utterly confused 17:29:19 I thought we talked about this one too... 17:30:16 this is another bug filed as part of the same issue 17:30:23 ah 17:30:24 1114786 is the other 17:30:29 which is why it's familiar-ish 17:30:49 I know I couldn't reproduce that bug, at least 17:31:00 we nailed down the circumstances in 1114786 discussion i think 17:31:18 i'm not sure if there's any value to having two bugs open, but i think we can reasonably state that the beta blocking consideration at least shall attach to 1114786 17:31:23 and just un-propose this 17:31:25 brb, call of nature 17:31:47 deduping bugs is always good 17:35:02 so... 17:35:29 +1 for leaving this alone and focusing on 114786 17:36:11 proposed #agreed - RejectedBlocker - There is already another bug tracking this (BZ#114786). 17:36:25 ack 17:36:27 i'd rather call it 'un-proposed' than rejected, i.e. we summarily drop the nomination 17:37:06 proposed #agreed - un-propose - There is already another bug tracking this (BZ#114786). 17:37:54 * danofsatx-dt prefers rejected 17:38:36 you're a cup half empty guy, aren't you? 17:38:37 ack 17:38:39 haha 17:38:48 toss a coin! 17:38:53 #agreed - un-propose - There is already another bug tracking this (BZ#114786). 17:38:54 nope, cup is too big. 17:39:24 #topic (1141496) syslinux generates unbootable isos in F21 17:39:24 #link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1141496 17:39:24 #info Proposed Blocker, syslinux, NEW 17:39:35 I don't think there's a cup 17:41:35 the brown paper bag bug 17:41:37 +1 17:42:56 +1 for this as well 17:43:12 I also now have a spare machine for booting from media 17:43:19 but I need to go get some more dvds.... 17:43:56 we need to get pjones a reproducer, basically 17:44:07 it's kind of unclear how many people this is hitting, but certainly a provisional +1 17:44:31 i did mail the area RH office list to try and find anyone who could get a reproducing system to pjones 17:44:36 if anyone knows anyone around boston who's hit by this... 17:46:23 I guessed it's broken every time? 17:47:51 proposed #agreed - 1141496 - AcceptedBlocker - This bug violates the alpha criteria requiring images to boot in a supported configuration from optical media. 17:48:34 kparal: on affected systems, yes 17:48:45 ack, for now 17:49:06 kparal: it's a binary thing - if you're affected it never boots, if you're not affected it always does (so far that seems to be the case, anyway) 17:50:11 ack/nack/patch? 17:50:16 oh, actually 17:50:18 nack 17:50:32 https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1148087 is the one we're sure of 17:50:40 ok 17:50:47 i was just looking at that one 17:50:49 1141496 is one joachim filed which is actually different from what Jon and I saw 17:51:00 i don't think anyone but joachim has seen 1141496 yet 17:51:09 it'd be nice for several more people to test i think 17:51:22 so punt on this one and move to the next? 17:53:09 yeah, this one we could do with more info / reproducers 17:53:29 proposed #agreed - 1141496 - Punt - We still need more people to reproduce this bug in order to consider it blocking Beta. 17:54:37 ack 17:55:06 ack 17:55:30 #agreed - 1141496 - Punt - We still need more people to reproduce this bug in order to consider it blocking Beta. 17:55:38 #topic (1148087) Fedora 21 Alpha ISO images fail to boot on some systems when written to optical media (boot stops or reboots after ISOLINUX string displayed) 17:55:41 #link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1148087 17:55:43 #info Proposed Blocker, syslinux, NEW 17:57:59 so i'm probably +1 to this as we have two or three (can't recall) reproducers 17:58:06 yeah 17:58:11 but again more testing would be nice, and it's hard to fix without pjones having access to a reproducer 18:01:35 +1 with a note to test more? 18:03:20 we seem to be losing some steam - but we got through most of them 18:04:11 kparal: oy 18:05:02 I'll ack anything 18:06:02 proposed #agreed - 1148087 - AcceptedBlocker - This bug violates the alpha criterion of requiring images to boot from optical media. More testing would help to pin down the exact cause of this error. 18:06:13 ack 18:06:30 ack 18:06:37 #agreed - 1148087 - AcceptedBlocker - This bug violates the alpha criterion of requiring images to boot from optical media. More testing would help to pin down the exact cause of this error. 18:06:46 last one :) 18:06:54 #topic (1099299) fedup fails to upgrade f20 to rawhide - infinite loop when starting udev 18:06:57 #link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1099299 18:07:00 #info Proposed Blocker, systemd, NEW 18:07:54 this one's a fairly clear blocker 18:07:55 +1 18:08:00 yeah 18:08:01 +1 18:08:18 F20, you can check out any time you like but you can never leave 18:10:45 +1 18:12:13 proposed #agreed - 1099299 - AcceptedBlocker - This clearly violates the Beta upgrade criteria. 18:12:39 ack 18:12:59 ack 18:14:07 #agreed - 1099299 - AcceptedBlocker - This clearly violates the Beta upgrade criteria. 18:14:10 ...and that's it 18:14:35 yaay 18:15:10 anything for openfloor can be discussed in fedora-qa methinks 18:15:57 yeah, let's knock it on the head 18:16:21 thanks for coming! 18:16:24 #endmeeting